Jacks to play USD

[NorCalJack]

Re: Jacks to play USD

Then, he commented that "USD made it to the DII championship" and asked "has SDSU ever done that?"

You should have said "Lose a championship game in D-II? No"

[jackrabbit1979]

Re: Jacks to play USD

This is a really good post.
I think it's too early to see what USD will become though. I think you have SDSU, Oakland, NDSU and then it's up for grabs. Will USD and/or UND become the 4th-5th team. I think NDSU's new coach did a great job this year. How will She do recruiting, I don't know but to get the results She did was impressive. Will USD's new coach do the same thing? His recruiting already expanded(area) in his 1st class. That doesn't need to be done but it might not hurt anything.
I don't see USD hosting many WNIT games. The dome isn't a fan friendly place to play. I think they'll have bigger schools that will put in better bids. USD can get there in a couple years but hosting might be another story.

Fixed it for you...

[minnesotarabbit]

Re: Jacks to play USD

I would be shocked if this monday night game sold out. It should be a good crowd, I would guess in the 3500 neighborhood, but a sell out is probably a pretty tall order.

I'll take the over on 3500

[NoVaJack]

Re: Jacks to play USD

I'll take the over on 3500

Me, too.

Here is what Jacks get with this game:
1. Big gate.
2. Intense late-season game challenge. Whether USD is good or not, does anyone doubt that the intensity level of this game will be pretty high? Isn't that what you want for a team presumably shooting for the NCAA tournament a few weeks later?
3. Chance to answer the questions on where Jacks are relative to USD in D-1. I.e., chance to silence the boasters in Vermillion for awhile.
4. Chance to resume a rivalry in our house, from a position of strength.

All good, right? I think the doubters are vastly underestimating what the resumption of this rivalry will mean. I'd wager that there will be renewed pressure/interest to get it going in other sports. This is gonna be a novelty game.

[WestSideRabbit]

Re: Jacks to play USD

NoVa I could not agree more, but it says I have to spread the Rep around more! Great Post! I hadn't even thought of the late season intensity!

[jackmd]

Re: Jacks to play USD

Perspective alert, 23-2 in the last 25 contests against USD. I think there will be a level of intensity among fans, especially USD fans and those SDSU fans that haven't fully embraced DI, but I'm not sure it will be matched on the floor. Our women are focused on winning a DI conference championship and competing in the DI post-season not on a team the program dominated before they enrolled at SDSU, a team these players haven't ever played before.

That said, I understand the history and I admit that I am excited to see things play out on the court. I'll be there for sure.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: Jacks to play USD

I'll take the over on 3500

The crowd could be bigger than 3500, it will be a big game. Nova listed the positive aspects of this game that should make it a good crowd. However, many of the things that could negatively impact the attendance are unknown right now.

1-Monday night game. OK, that's known, but will fans travel further than Flandreau for a women's basketball game on a week night? I live in Sioux Falls and am somewhat of a diehard, and I can't say with any certainty that I'll be there.
2-Single header. By my count the women have drawn over 3500 2 times in the last 2 years for a single game format. Both games were against NDSU. Both games were on Saturday night.
3-What high school activities will be happening in Brookings and the surrounding communities?
4-What will the two team's records be? If both teams have 7 or more losses, what kind of effect will it have on attendance?
5-Weather in February? This one alone could kill attendance.

[yoteforever]

Re: Jacks to play USD

[quote=jackmd;122601]The paper ran a couple of front sports page articles. They talked about the rivalry and how much they missed the competition the last several years. I mentioned to a casual USD fan that I had a hard time considering it a "rivalry" in women's basketball given that we had won something like 21 of the last 22 games. This person, of course, had no idea of the domination demonstrated by the Jackrabbit women. Then, he commented that "USD made it to the DII championship" and asked "has SDSU ever done that?" I just laughed and shrugged my shoulders telling him DII was in the past.

For the record, I think we were 23-2 against USD the last 11 years at the DII level. The 2 losses came in years in which we were 2-1 against USD, losing on their court but beating them each year at home and on a neutral court.

Doc,

I have been really, really quiet as of late because I don't want to be seen as a rebel rouser. But sometimes your posts make me chuckle inside. You discuss having a conversation with a casual USD fan regarding the renewed basketball game between USD and SDSU. You bring uo the domination numbers SDSU has had on USD in womens basketball, and I am assuming you indeed are being factual, but my guess is your delivery made the hair stand on the back of that "casual" USD fan, so he throws the D-II Championship comment back at you. You then proceed to say " I laughed and shrugged my shoulders say D-II was in the past." Doc, you can't have it both ways. Either the past is the past, so the Championship game comment is irrelevant and the "domination" also becomes irrelevant.

Then comes the comment that the USD game is huge for USD, but not so much for SDSU. Now seriously, you can't buy into that for one second. In Iowa, the Hawkeye fans always say the same darned thing. "This game means more for Iowa State the it does for us". B.S. It means alot for both teams. Period. Some of the posters on here have it right, if you don't think it won't be a huge rivalry game with a ton of excitement, and a ton of fanfare both before and after, I think you are seriously mistaken.

I have no expectation of winning that game, but as I said in some previous posts, if USD beats you or takes you to the wire, there will be alot of fans that will be eating some serious crow. I hope we are competitive. I do believe it is indeed a great measuring stick of where our program is, because I do respect the hell out of your womens program. If we are even close, then I think we have a decent chance to gain momentum and play at the same level as SDSU in a couple to three years. However, if you trounce us, and that could happen, then the building of this program will take longer.

Here is the bottom line. If SDSU takes on USD in anything from womens basketball to Easter egg hunting, there will be interest. That's how rivalries work.

Lastly, I have read with interest about the Summit League coming down on USD if the fans behave poorly (like all SDSU fans are ministers). I have to tell you, one of the big reasons USD was admitted into the Summit was because the commisioner said in our group meetings, and I paraphrase here, "this league doesn't know what a rivalry is. I have heard stories from games of past of the antics of the fans on both sides, and maybe these two institutions can teach the rest of the league what it means to play a rivalry". End quote.

In other words, this league wants something off the cuff to happen. I hope there are no animals thrown, or language that is unacceptable, but I do pray that there are two sides cheering loudly for their teams that raises the decibel level to all time highs. That would be good for the sport.

You can't tell me that playing UMKC in Kansas City in front of (3) refs, 20 players or so, a handful of coaches, 6-8 people at the scoring bench, 2 popcorn makers, a ticket taker, and 9 parents is more excting and more important than playing USD at Frost. I don't buy it.

[zooropa]

Re: Jacks to play USD

It means alot for both teams.

I 'spect it means more for the fans than the teams.

But on the score of team motivation--while AJ's not one to post articles in the locker room, he wasn't afraid to take a bit of umbrage at the tone of NDSU fans and supporters after the game at Frost this past season.

However, if you trounce us, and that could happen, then the building of this program will take longer.

You can expect that to happen.

Perhaps the worst thing about SDSU's WBB program is that they make things look so effortless---it is what makes it such a pleasure to watch them play, but at the same time, it is so deceptive. It takes a lot of effort--a TON of hard work and talent to make that game look that easy.

Anyone who thinks, 'well, we recruit roughly the same players from roughly the same area, thus we should be roughly as good as SDSU with a rough time frame' is grossly underestimating AJ and his staff.

[Nidaros]

Re: Jacks to play USD

In other words, this league wants something off the cuff to happen. I hope there are no animals thrown, or language that is unacceptable, but I do pray that there are two sides cheering loudly for their teams that raises the decibel level to all time highs. That would be good for the sport.

Certainly not dead animals. I do think Douple likes big crowds but if they are unruly in Brookings or Vermillion, the presidents are going to be advised to put an end to it. I hope that never happens.

[1stRowFANatic]

Re: Jacks to play USD

Yote4ever,
Here is what I think most Jacks fans mean when they say the game is a much bigger deal for USD than SDSU.

If SDSU wins, it is an expected win. If we have a similar year as last year and we are fortunate enought to make it to the NCAA's again, the win will not help our seeding. A blowout win is still just a win and a close win may actually hurt us with those looking at the game from a national perspective. Now let's say that the year progresses and we have multiple in-conference losses, but win the auto-bid, again the blow-out win doesn't help us and close win probably would not affect the seeding. If SDSU has a bad year and doesn't make the tournament, quite frankly I don't think SDSU fans will take solace in the fact that they got a win over USD, blow-out or close.

If SDSU loses the game but we have a season reasonably comparable to last year, SDSU fans will be looking at how we do in the tournament to judge the success of the year. It would be disappointing to lose, but if we play well in the tourney, that would be most important. If the season has multiple conference losses, but we make the tournament, I think most would view the season as successful, especially if we represent as well as last year.

But most importantly, I think most SDSU fans will judge the success of the season by whether or not the team makes it to the NCAA's. As you can see from this sentence, the USD game is not part of the equation. They will want to win the game of course, but the measure of success is based upon post-season participation.

According to your post, the game is important to USD because it could be a program changer for good or bad. I don't think anyone on this board would say the same for SDSU. So, is the game more important for SDSU or USD. One group looks at the best outcome of the game as a "bad win" and the other a program changer.

[jackdaniel]

Re: Jacks to play USD

I think the rest of the conference has seen the success we've enjoyed & want that for thier teams too, i think they've all raised the level of thier recruiting effort, it seems to me.In a few more years, they're not going to be pushovers anymore....we have to stay ahead of the pack.Look at thier recruits, some have impressive credentials, the conf. is slowly achieving parity.In that sense, i think it's important for both teams to show success, to help in the recruiting war.Especially SDSU, because anything less than #1 ,would be considered a great disappointment,USD on the other hand has nothing like that to worry about, they are in the great position to be the big spoiler when they get into the conference.There's a lot of pressure on our women to achieve , we've won the summit two years in a row now, USD has the luxury of not having to deal with that, since they're still transitioning & are not officially in the conference yet.

[RabbitObsessed]

Re: Jacks to play USD

Yote4ever,
Here is what I think most Jacks fans mean when they say the game is a much bigger deal for USD than SDSU.

If SDSU wins, it is an expected win. If we have a similar year as last year and we are fortunate enought to make it to the NCAA's again, the win will not help our seeding. A blowout win is still just a win and a close win may actually hurt us with those looking at the game from a national perspective. Now let's say that the year progresses and we have multiple in-conference losses, but win the auto-bid, again the blow-out win doesn't help us and close win probably would not affect the seeding. If SDSU has a bad year and doesn't make the tournament, quite frankly I don't think SDSU fans will take solace in the fact that they got a win over USD, blow-out or close.

If SDSU loses the game but we have a season reasonably comparable to last year, SDSU fans will be looking at how we do in the tournament to judge the success of the year. It would be disappointing to lose, but if we play well in the tourney, that would be most important. If the season has multiple conference losses, but we make the tournament, I think most would view the season as successful, especially if we represent as well as last year.

But most importantly, I think most SDSU fans will judge the success of the season by whether or not the team makes it to the NCAA's. As you can see from this sentence, the USD game is not part of the equation. They will want to win the game of course, but the measure of success is based upon post-season participation.

According to your post, the game is important to USD because it could be a program changer for good or bad. I don't think anyone on this board would say the same for SDSU. So, is the game more important for SDSU or USD. One group looks at the best outcome of the game as a "bad win" and the other a program changer.

While I agree with your point 1stRow, that a win would be a bigger deal for USD than it would for SDSU, wouldn't you also agree that a loss would be a bigger deal for SDSU than it would for USD?

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: Jacks to play USD

While I agree with your point 1stRow, that a win would be a bigger deal for USD than it would for SDSU, wouldn't you also agree that a loss would be a bigger deal for SDSU than it would for USD?

So what you're saying is

USD has nothing to lose and everything to gain.

SDSU has everything to lose and nothing to gain.

Isn't that pretty much the premise of every post saying this game means little to SDSU?

[RabbitObsessed]

Re: Jacks to play USD

So what you're saying is

USD has nothing to lose and everything to gain.

SDSU has everything to lose and nothing to gain.

Isn't that pretty much the premise of every post saying this game means little to SDSU?

Yes, except for the last line. Because if SDSU loses, it will probably mean quite a bit.