Frost gets upgrade

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

student isn't likely to make any sort of donation beyond their activity fee until they graduate from college, and even then it will likely take 5-10 years for them to get comfortable enough to buy tickets and make donations. Just a five year relationship with a season ticket holder could yield thousands of dollars for SDSU before a similar student seat even yields a season ticket.

Students pay to get into the games, they don't pay for premium seating (although a pretty solid case could be made for end bleachers qualifying as premium seating).............

So if the behind the basket seats are so great, why were those sections always the most empty? Because they suck, most fans regardless of student or alumni would not make those their first choice.

What if the teams start to struggle again heaven forbid? a few loosing seasons and say good buy to season ticket renewels. so have a side mostly empty seats just so alumni can feel good about themselves when their is a good year for basketball.

Students will become future donors and season ticket holders. If you want students to give money once they graduate, they should have some perks and court side seating for basketball and a endzone section for football isnt asking to much. Plus students buy conssessions and clothes at the bookstore, and food at the union with a lot of that money going to the atheltic programs.


so making a few thousand dollars now is worth it to spite the future relations of students who might pay more down the road then the thousands that are made now.

Obviously nobody else on here cares about the students or their experience. Sitting behind a basketball support, really, premium seating? IF there are season tickets available and poeple have gotten them because they want better seats? So as a true fan we can only support season tickets if we have great seats, seat tickets in the corner are for suckers? I am done with the topic. I think its a bad idea and students get shafted again.

I care about the students and their experience - ALL the students, including student athletes. Unfortunately, to improve the experience of student athletes, you need money. That is just a reality.

Students will hopefully become donors and season ticket holders. Sitting behind the baskets is premium seating. I would rather sit there than behind the student section on the side, can you disagree with that?

This change will result in much more than a few thousand dollars. If even 500 more season tickets can be sold, that's at least $250,000 every year. That's real money that is desperately needed at a time when we want to build a fieldhouse, new football stadium, and continue improvements at Frost. Not to mention we are constantly one of the most underfunded football/basketball teams in our conferences.

Pardon the breach of forum etiquette, but your last paragraph is preposterous. Season ticket holders should be content with terrible sightlines, but students shouldn't be content with lower level seating behind the baskets.

"So a true student fan can only support the team if they have great seats, seats behind the basket are for suckers?" Right.

As far as atmosphere goes, there are maybe 30 students that stand for the entire game (not counting big games). Put 15 of those students in the front row at each end, and suddenly you have an entire student section that stands for the whole game - making them far more likely to cheer instead of checking facebook and texting during the game.

I understand why some students are upset, and maybe I would be if I was a student. But I think this is a sound financial and strategic decision. Simple as that.

[Nidaros]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

I care about the students and their experience - ALL the students, including student athletes. Unfortunately, to improve the experience of student athletes, you need money. That is just a reality.

Students will hopefully become donors and season ticket holders. Sitting behind the baskets is premium seating. I would rather sit there than behind the student section on the side, can you disagree with that?

This change will result in much more than a few thousand dollars. If even 500 more season tickets can be sold, that's at least $250,000 every year. That's real money that is desperately needed at a time when we want to build a fieldhouse, new football stadium, and continue improvements at Frost. Not to mention we are constantly one of the most underfunded football/basketball teams in our conferences.

Pardon the breach of forum etiquette, but your last paragraph is preposterous. Season ticket holders should be content with terrible sightlines, but students shouldn't be content with lower level seating behind the baskets.

"So a true student fan can only support the team if they have great seats, seats behind the basket are for suckers?" Right.

As far as atmosphere goes, there are maybe 30 students that stand for the entire game (not counting big games). Put 15 of those students in the front row at each end, and suddenly you have an entire student section that stands for the whole game - making them far more likely to cheer instead of checking facebook and texting during the game.

I understand why some students are upset, and maybe I would be if I was a student. But I think this is a sound financial and strategic decision. Simple as that.

I will add to this fine post, that student apathy is the real issue here. I suppose it was no different in 1965 when enrollment numbers were broken with 4200 students, but I suspect that student association voting was not much different with 10 per cent turnout as it is now. What is sad that students pay admission with student activity fees and only about 10 per cent show up regularily to BB games. I dont have a GOOD solution. Back in 1965 my mind was on getting the military obligation, the draft fulfilled, and a future occupation, that sports although interesting to read about, I did not always attend. I found in my archives a student id with several unpunched holes. Back then scanning of any sort was a thing off in the future, and your ID was laminated in plastic and the ticket taker at the Barn punched the card. Unfortunately, I did not show up to have my ID fully punched.

I sympathize with the students in being forced to take new seats, but over all it will work for the Athletic department who is in a business, like it or not, that has to maximize revenue. We got an AD who appears to answer the call. Moving up to D1 involved more revenue and thats what he is doing, but at the same time trying to create a more attractive product, namely attending games in person. If students show up in masses and say 40% do so that is 5200 people demanding seats, then your AD and staff are face with another revamp. Will 40% show up? I want to say that back in 1965 maybe 30% did because it was the only game in town and with 3.2 beer being the strongest beverage, there were not as many distractions.

[MontanaRabbit]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

I tend to agree with Goon on this matter, although not quite as strongly. There is absolutely no question that the students got the short end of this deal. Is that right or wrong? I think the answer is somewhere in the middle.

I really think this is being done out of necessity to generate more revenue. That revenue is really needed in the athletic department now to help fund many necessary projects. It's a double edge sword...to generate the revenue now, someone has to sacrifice. That sacrifice could be rewarded in the future with a new football stadium or a revamped Frost Arena. There is no question, a new football stadium will have a positive impact on the student experience at football games.

Goon, you gotta realize most of the posters on here are donors. This directly benefits many of them so of course they will be happy with it.

[91jack]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

What if the teams start to struggle again heaven forbid? a few loosing seasons and say good buy to season ticket renewels. so have a side mostly empty seats just so alumni can feel good about themselves when their is a good year for basketball.

Students will become future donors and season ticket holders. If you want students to give money once they graduate, they should have some perks and court side seating for basketball and a endzone section for football isnt asking to much. Plus students buy conssessions and clothes at the bookstore, and food at the union with a lot of that money going to the atheltic programs.


so making a few thousand dollars now is worth it to spite the future relations of students who might pay more down the road then the thousands that are made now.

Obviously nobody else on here cares about the students or their experience. Sitting behind a basketball support, really, premium seating? IF there are season tickets available and poeple have gotten them because they want better seats? So as a true fan we can only support season tickets if we have great seats, seat tickets in the corner are for suckers? I am done with the topic. I think its a bad idea and students get shafted again.[/QUOTE]

I think if the team starts to struggle again, the students won't show up either. There are many more season ticket holders that show up for games than students right now. The students show up for NDSU, USD and a few other games but that's about it. I really wish more students were like you and showed up for all games and cheered the teams on. You have to go by what's happening not what could happen.

What percent of students do you think will become donors and season ticket holders? I don't think there will be very many just because there aren't many students that show up for games the way it is. Would you rather have great seats when you were a student(5-years) or for the next 30 years when you buy tickets? I know it's more than just the money. If it was just money, you'd just put the students in general admission because you already have their money so you'd get more all the way around.

I guess this all depends on what side your on. How many of the students that go to games will be donors because of the seats at the games? I don't know how much the activity fee is. I do think that the meal plan and other things like that are unfair but how much of that goes to athletics? I didn't think much of that went to athletics. If it does, maybe my opinion would change.

[goon]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

Bull****. I know how I feel. The seats behind the basket are worse. It's just not as good of spot to watch basketball. Therefore, it does not make me happy.

Exactly, if they were great seats, why not put people who want season tickets in those seats? Dont blow smoke up students bums and tell them its a good deal and great seats when obviously those ends have been horrible for people buying tickets.

If the new bleachers are longer and lower to the ground, that could help some, but the whole middle section would be a horrible view. If we could go back to the hanging baskets, it would be fine IMO. Those were not obstructed views from the ends with the hanging baskets.

[UWMandSDSU]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

Exactly, if they were great seats, why not put people who want season tickets in those seats? Dont blow smoke up students bums and tell them its a good deal and great seats when obviously those ends have been horrible for people buying tickets.

If those seats are so bad, why have the parents of the basketball players sat in them for years?

I will agree with you if I were a student I would have probably been outraged, but knowing the full reason behind the change, I understand why the Athletic Dept. is doing it.

[Nidaros]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

If those seats are so bad, why have the parents of the basketball players sat in them for years?

I will agree with you if I were a student I would have probably been outraged, but knowing the full reason behind the change, I understand why the Athletic Dept. is doing it.

If only ten per cent show for athletic events and for student elections, your student representation leaves something to be desired, you dont get backbone guys like WestsideRabbit for leaders. Seems like a few years back some guy who was a roaring drunk got elected SA president. Its about student apathy and old old problem.

[Kemo]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

Bull****. I know how I feel. The seats behind the basket are worse. It's just not as good of spot to watch basketball. Therefore, it does not make me happy.

I used to think behind-the-basket seats were terrible as well until I actually watched a game from that perspective at a decent arena. I'm not saying they are as good a seats as side-court lower-bowl seats (because there not), but one can still have a great basketball experience at that location. If the remodeling is done right, I believe the students won't dislike the change as much as they may originally think.

[goon]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

Students will hopefully become donors and season ticket holders. Sitting behind the baskets is premium seating. I would rather sit there than behind the student section on the side, can you disagree with that?


"Pardon the breach of forum etiquette, but your last paragraph is preposterous. Season ticket holders should be content with terrible sightlines, but students shouldn't be content with lower level seating behind the baskets."....sorry but this is nuts. You can't come out and say the end seats are great for students....then say season ticket holders should be content with terrible sightlines.......you make my case. Behind the basket seats are not very good. A few on the ends have an ok view, but only when they action is on their side. If those seats were so good, they would be packed with season ticket holders.

"So a true student fan can only support the team if they have great seats, seats behind the basket are for suckers?" Right.

As far as atmosphere goes, there are maybe 30 students that stand for the entire game (not counting big games). Put 15 of those students in the front row at each end, and suddenly you have an entire student section that stands for the whole game - making them far more likely to cheer instead of checking facebook and texting during the game.

Yes I can disagree on that. You put more emphasis on the donors as money makers, which is very important, but overall.12k students pay a lot to have access to quaility seating also. So the athletic programs make decent coin off of students just through fees, not to mention anything else they buy through the school which puts money into the athletic programs.

So you feel that behind the basket seats are premium seats? but only for students? if they are so great, why not put all these new potential season ticket holders there? They can still be a donor and have great seats behind the baskets and not affect where students sit. I am sorry but I can not accept that arguement. I understand its about money. So why not kick students out of the main grandstand at CAS and put them on the otherside to open up more season ticket sales? Once a new stadium is built, I would be fine with that, but not untill then should they move.

If fans behind the students wouldnt yell at them to sit down, maybe more would stand or care. Its hard to get into a game when your own fans yell for you to sit down. Which when I was student at the end of the D-2 days, happened constantly. If you want to add more future donors, trying to find ways to bring in students would be a good way to do it, not to move them to second rate horrible seats.

Pardon the breach of forum etiquette, but your last paragraph is preposterous. Season ticket holders should be content with terrible sightlines, but students shouldn't be content with lower level seating behind the baskets.

[bigticket1]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

It's understandable that students are upset. But in reality,almost every high major game you see on TV shows the camera shot of a visiting player shooting free throws with the students standing in the background waving their arms,cut-out heads,etc... Only schools like Duke and Michigan State that have huge student sections have students in courtside seating.

[91jack]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

Originally posted by goon "If fans behind the students wouldnt yell at them to sit down, maybe more would stand or care. Its hard to get into a game when your own fans yell for you to sit down. Which when I was student at the end of the D-2 days, happened constantly. If you want to add more future donors, trying to find ways to bring in students would be a good way to do it, not to move them to second rate horrible seats."

I guess I'll have to wait and see what it looks like when it's done but this could solve the "If fans behind the students wouldn't yell at them to sit down, ...". If the students are on the baseline, there won't be any other fans behind them to yell at them to sit down. If there get to be too many students to fit there, the admin better do something to address that.

[The Sports Block]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

Student fees make up 20 percent of the SDSU athletic department's annual budget. Despite students' contributions to athletics, your season tickets for basketball just got moved — with no warning — to worse seating. Marcus Traxler with his latest blog:
http://marcustraxler.blogspot.com/20...fallacies.html

[goon]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

I think if the team starts to struggle again, the students won't show up either. There are many more season ticket holders that show up for games than students right now. The students show up for NDSU, USD and a few other games but that's about it. I really wish more students were like you and showed up for all games and cheered the teams on. You have to go by what's happening not what could happen.................If the team struggles, the athletic programs still gets activity fees from 12k students. If Season tickets drop they lose money. Money from students is garunteed so money from students will always be there, not season ticket holders who wont buy tickets for struggling programs.

What percent of students do you think will become donors and season ticket holders? I don't think there will be very many just because there aren't many students that show up for games the way it is. Would you rather have great seats when you were a student(5-years) or for the next 30 years when you buy tickets? I know it's more than just the money. If it was just money, you'd just put the students in general admission because you already have their money so you'd get more all the way around.............If the school wants to increase its percent of students who buy season tickets and become donors....wouldn't it behooves the school to try to increase student participation to foster long term connections to turn more current students who turn into future donors? Not just quaility lower court side seats, but through various other means of fostering relationships, this is just one way it could help. How does this move help create more for SDSU from its current students who will become alumni and possible donors?

I guess this all depends on what side your on. How many of the students that go to games will be donors because of the seats at the games? I don't know how much the activity fee is. I do think that the meal plan and other things like that are unfair but how much of that goes to athletics? I didn't think much of that went to athletics. If it does, maybe my opinion would change.........I am pretty sure that 12,000 students who all pay activity fees, and purchases from the bookstore ect support athletics, so giving room for the few thousand that care to attend games, really isnt asking that much.

As alumni and donors, don't we owe it to the school to give as much as we can and in turn the do the best they can to use that money with out expecting the greatest court side seats, or 50 yardline seats? With large donations should come perks, but i dont think its fair at expense of students. So as season ticket buyers, we wont buy more season tickets untill we have the best seats in the house? Untill all possible season tickets are sold out, I dont know if this is a nessicary move for now. Wait till the indoor track/practice facility is built, then renovate Frost to have a full rounded courners chair back seating which would improve the experience for every one and allow students to have great seats too. [/QUOTE]

[goon]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

One last thought, if we had USD type student and fan support, I would not complain one bit, but as much as we would like to see more students engaged at SDSU atleast alumni and students do a great job compared to USD.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: Frost gets upgrade

"Pardon the breach of forum etiquette, but your last paragraph is preposterous. Season ticket holders should be content with terrible sightlines, but students shouldn't be content with lower level seating behind the baskets."....sorry but this is nuts. You can't come out and say the end seats are great for students....then say season ticket holders should be content with terrible sightlines.......you make my case. Behind the basket seats are not very good. A few on the ends have an ok view, but only when they action is on their side. If those seats were so good, they would be packed with season ticket holders.

You missed my point, or I did a bad job of illustrating it. The end sections do not have sight lines as good as courtside, but they are still pretty decent seats. The section above the students does have awful sight lines when the students are standing. It is simply unrealistic to expect people to pay for season tickets there. It would be irresponsible to build that section twice in the next 10 years for the sake of keeping students sitting courtside, especially at a time when there are other more worthy projects on the horizon that will require that funding.

Youself and others have done a lot of complaining on this thread, yet proposed ZERO alternatives. So tell me, what would your proposal be for:

1-Increasing the number of chairbacks in a way that is fiscally responsible and so that people will actually want them.
2-Keeping the student section sitting courtside.

Or you can keep complaining about how unfair the students are being treated, and keep wondering when we will break ground on the new football stadium and fieldhouse.

I'm all ears.