USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

[SUPERBUNNY]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

You are correct on that. My angle is that if I was wanting to showcase USD, I wouldn't have picked that weekend to be the one. It's a tough day to get a good crowd. We've seen that many times when we have a home game on the opener. Plus, they're playing the Bison which makes for a tough game to win. Heck, a tough game to even make a close game for that matter.

It's a good idea for them to play a game in Sioux Falls. My choice wouldn't have been that date when NDSU comes calling.

SUPERBUNNY

[LakeJack]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

We've had this argument before. You can argue taking games away from Brookings hurts students, the community, the bottom line, etc, but you can't say that Sioux Falls hasn't taken advantage of FCS football. It just isn't true.

All those things you listed are true. So if Sioux Falls wants to overcome them it needed to sell out Howard Wood back in 2005 not just outdraw some of the games (the cold weather games). You also forgot giving up home field advantage. I am not saying that Sioux Falls doesn't support the Jackrabbits or the Coyotes but for either school to move a home game and give up all the advantages listed (not to mention you now have to share your revenue because you are playing on someone else's field and you have the added expense of getting you team and staff down/up to SF) then SF needs to bring it a lot more then just a little bit better then they might have at home.

Now that SDSU is avg. more fans then Howard Wood holds Sioux Falls can't do it unless as JD suggested they want to make financial guarantees. Bottom line, keep the home games in Brookings unless it is a really sweat deal for SDSU to move it.

[LakeJack]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

Away games for us are somebody else's home games...

Yup that is the point. If SF wants the Jackrabbits to play in SF find someone else who is willing to move their home game vs. SDSU to SF and we are in.

[bigticket1]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

Away games for us are somebody else's home games...

I would like to see the Sports Authority work with SDSU to put together some sort of basketball tournament with DI teams in Sioux Falls once the new events center is done. Is that what you mean by away games?

As to USD/NDSU, the Coyotes desperately need to engage their Sioux Falls and regional alumni. If the fans aren't coming to the games, bring the games to the fans. I will still maintain they pull a bigger crowd in Sioux Falls than they would have in Vermillion for this game. No harm done.

If you can't connect with alumni that are only an hour's drive away, one game where you are likely to get the snot kicked out of you probably won't do a lot to change that.

[goon]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

If you can't connect with alumni that are only an hour's drive away, one game where you are likely to get the snot kicked out of you probably won't do a lot to change that.

At least fans can drink a beer to ease the pain of another bad loss. That's a plus....just trying to look at the bright side of things on it.

[GoJacks]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

Once the new event center is built I would be willing to bet the Sioux Falls Sports Authority could come up with the guarantee money to have a few regular season SDSU vs. USD basketball games there. No drought in mind the will come with a proposal.

[GoJacks]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

I would guess there will be between 200-500 SDSU season ticket holders at this game, based on what I'm heard during tailgate last week.

I am planning on going to both the Augie vs. USF and the USD vs. NDSU games Saturday. I have some family that are Augie grads and some friends tthat are USF alumni.. None of us hunt and we decided to make it a big ole football day.

[poppa1]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

The nice thing about playing a game is that anything can happen, a win is not guaranteed upfront.

[SDSUAlum08]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

Bison 48 Yotes 10

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

I mean it the same way A.D. Sell was quoted by TV. A major or mid-major DI program that wants to play SDSU but doesn't want to play in Frost may be willing to schedule on a "neutral" court in SD (pentagon or arena).

I think its all semantics. SDSU will schedule in Sioux Falls when it makes sense to do so, but we aren't going to go out of our way to do it. That's pretty much what it boils down to.

[Nidaros]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

I think its all semantics. SDSU will schedule in Sioux Falls when it makes sense to do so, but we aren't going to go out of our way to do it. That's pretty much what it boils down to.

I still have a copy of the Carr Report, the offical guideline study that moved us to D1 over 5 years ago. There are two recommendations that seemed to make sense at the time that have later proven not to be the best recommendations.
They were as follows:
1. That SDSU find a conference before going D1

2. That they build their fan base by having SF host certain Athletic events.

The first one created a problem for President Miller since schools keep asking her where was their D1 paper work, when she inquired about being considered for joining a conference. Also this recommendation gave ammunition to the naysayers about going D1.

The second one was tried with Football and UC Davis, and Manhattan with basketball and its been so-so with many expected knee jerk reactions from the Brookings Business Community. AD Sell coming in later recognizes as a major consideration, the reaction of the Brookings business community, in future events should they be held in SF. So future events in SF are going to have to be win-win for SDSU. It will be interesting to see how the USD-NDSU shakes out financially and also in attendence.

Otherwise the Carr Report gave the adminstration a blue print to get were we are now. Slowly but surely we are adding to coaching staffs something that in some cases were underfunded at the D2 level, and going forward with the same size staff would have jeoprodized the success at the D1 level.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

I still have a copy of the Carr Report, the offical guideline study that moved us to D1 over 5 years ago. There are two recommendations that seemed to make sense at the time that have later proven not to be the best recommendations.
They were as follows:

2. That they build their fan base by having SF host certain Athletic events.

The second one was tried with Football and UC Davis, and Manhattan with basketball and its been so-so with many expected knee jerk reactions from the Brookings Business Community. AD Sell coming in later recognizes as a major consideration, the reaction of the Brookings business community, in future events should they be held in SF. So future events in SF are going to have to be win-win for SDSU. It will be interesting to see how the USD-NDSU shakes out financially and also in attendence.

Otherwise the Carr Report gave the adminstration a blue print to get were we are now. Slowly but surely we are adding to coaching staffs something that in some cases were underfunded at the D2 level, and going forward with the same size staff would have jeoprodized the success at the D1 level.

I'm not familiar with the specifics of that report, but I would argue that #2 has also taken place in the form of Summit League tournaments (not directly SDSU, but still huge for building the SF fan base), football practices in Sioux Falls, coaches coming down for alumni events, and probably lots of others I'm not familiar with.

When it works and makes sense (8 home football games in a season was one of those times), it could be smart to have a game in Sioux Falls. That doesn't mean it has to happen every year.

[Nidaros]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

I'm not familiar with the specifics of that report, but I would argue that #2 has also taken place in the form of Summit League tournaments (not directly SDSU, but still huge for building the SF fan base), football practices in Sioux Falls, coaches coming down for alumni events, and probably lots of others I'm not familiar with.

When it works and makes sense (8 home football games in a season was one of those times), it could be smart to have a game in Sioux Falls. That doesn't mean it has to happen every year.

Having 10k or more for each home game is special and becoming more special with each season, and the Carr people could not possibly visualize this happening considering the most of tailgating that took place in D2 days was a few motor homes parked in the grove of trees that are no longer there.
Mr Carr having done many of these studies no doubt experienced lack of support for D1 sports in small communities like Brookings so the natural thing to look to is drawing people from larger communities. I believe the D1 concept has caught on in Brookings. Support for SDSU athletics amongst the business community goes back to the 1920's. Bob Bartling recently found a ledger book that his father had kept to record all the donations from various business. This book recorded not only donations but also disbursements to various athletes for tuition, room and board. So I dont think Brookings has ever ignored SDSU.

Now in Vermillion its a different story and might explain the difference in current budgets of USD and SDSU. The business community of Vermillion has often ignored USD as do some alums, so they have a cultured past to over come going forward. Seems like my friend YF recognizes this difference.

I am not arguing against SF, but if SF really wants to support SDSU, they are going to have to drive a few miles to Brookings, after all this is where the campus and facilities are located. Yes the Summit works great for SF and SDSU. The partnership is indeed needed to fund our budget.

[Chains]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

I think its all semantics. SDSU will schedule in Sioux Falls when it makes sense to do so, but we aren't going to go out of our way to do it. That's pretty much what it boils down to.

SDSU already schedules games in Sioux Falls. Its called the Summit League tournament. The only games the SF area will get from SDSU. 35 minute drive from SF to Brookings to support the Jackrabbits. Several reason's why the Summit League BB tournament is in SF - Sioux Falls does a nice job and SDSU cannot host the games at Frost arena by conference rules. As stated in an earlier post SDSU experimented with games in SF with limited success. There is a cost to move games out of Brookings to SF not just in facility costs but all the SDSU staff has to move to SF to support the games.

I personnally think USD moving the NDSU game to SF is a mistake. If your trying to show case your program - getting beat by 30+ is not the way to accomplish it.

GBGBGJ

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: USD v NDSU in Sioux Falls

SDSU already schedules games in Sioux Falls. Its called the Summit League tournament. The only games the SF area will get from SDSU. 35 minute drive from SF to Brookings to support the Jackrabbits. Several reason's why the Summit League BB tournament is in SF - Sioux Falls does a nice job and SDSU cannot host the games at Frost arena by conference rules. As stated in an earlier post SDSU experimented with games in SF with limited success. There is a cost to move games out of Brookings to SF not just in facility costs but all the SDSU staff has to move to SF to support the games.

I personnally think USD moving the NDSU game to SF is a mistake. If your trying to show case your program - getting beat by 30+ is not the way to accomplish it.

GBGBGJ

For the casual sports fan in Sioux Falls who has never been to an SDSU game, what is the incentive for driving 35 minutes to watch SDSU vs 10 minutes to watch the Skyforce or Stampede (and USF or Augie for that matter)?

Sioux Falls hosts the Summit League Tournament for only 1 reason, money. Money comes from attendance and corporate sponsors. More people and more corporate sponsors are available in Sioux Falls, which is why Sioux Falls should be important for SDSU athletics.

In 2005, the Sioux Falls football game attendance was just as good or better than 5 of our other home games. Basketball was more than the season average and outdrew a game 8 days later against Butler. I'm not sure that can be called limited success.

I'm not saying hosting games in Sioux Falls should be a regular thing, but it should (will) be considered when it makes sense.