ND legislature and Sioux name

[1stRowFANatic]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

Absolutely NOTHING is stopping UND from using anything they want as their mascot. If, however they VOLUNTARILY want to be part of an organization, they will need to conform to the requirements of that organization or suffer the consequences of not following the rules. Even if the constitutional amendment passed, does anyone think the NCAA would change their position? I think they would tell UND we care as much about your constitution as we do your law; follow the rules or suffer the consequences. If you don't like it, join the NAIA.

[goon]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

Well no one forced the Irish from their homes and moved them to land no one wanted calling it a Reservation. IMHO the Native Americans may be the only special class left and perhaps if a portion of them don't want to be a team mascot we should honor their wishes.

At the same time there are some who wish to be honored in their view with a school mascot maybe their wishes should be considered too. What about animal groups next who thing using jackrabbits and bison and such is explotation of animals in a unfair and offensive. The ncaa imo is just asking for more. The point is the fighting irish is stereotyping irsish that is just not true and if my family was offended it really wouldn't matter our feelings. What if the ncaa says no homosexuals can be apart of it. I guess it is their rules everyonr will have to abide by no matter what is right or wrong. I don't think many are seeing where I am going with this.....

[boxerboy]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

Amen, and Goon, did you just come out from a rock somewhere? I thought you had more insight than that expressed in your last post. BTW, all Norwegian not even a Dane in my family tree and I dont find the use of Vikings offensive either, except when they are called viqueens by some on this board Now that one really gets me worked up.

The sad part is the word Sioux is a French word that is not complimentary to the Lakota. That alone would be reason not to use it. Forget the nuts at UND that started using it in the 1930's, they have no concept of tradition.

I still believe that if "Sioux" is such a dishonorable name then why Nidaros, are you not taking your battle further? I've said it before why stop with UND, Lakota Falls, Lakota City, Lakota River. What seems to be the difference? If it's bad for UND it must be bad everywhere that word is used. Let's show some consistency here or else drop the whole stupid argument.

[mitchellrabbit]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

At the same time there are some who wish to be honored in their view with a school mascot maybe their wishes should be considered too. What about animal groups next who thing using jackrabbits and bison and such is explotation of animals in a unfair and offensive. The ncaa imo is just asking for more. The point is the fighting irish is stereotyping irsish that is just not true and if my family was offended it really wouldn't matter our feelings. What if the ncaa says no homosexuals can be apart of it. I guess it is their rules everyonr will have to abide by no matter what is right or wrong. I don't think many are seeing where I am going with this.....

goon, im not sure you know where you are going with that. : )

[JackJD]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

At the same time there are some who wish to be honored in their view with a school mascot maybe their wishes should be considered too. What about animal groups next who thing using jackrabbits and bison and such is explotation of animals in a unfair and offensive. The ncaa imo is just asking for more. The point is the fighting irish is stereotyping irsish that is just not true and if my family was offended it really wouldn't matter our feelings. What if the ncaa says no homosexuals can be apart of it. I guess it is their rules everyonr will have to abide by no matter what is right or wrong. I don't think many are seeing where I am going with this.....

Geez, I hope we can avoid trying to debate the whole nickname thing. I think all of the arguments, some plausible and some absolutely batcrap nuts, have been made on other fan message boards, primarily UND's and to a much lesser extent, NDSU's. Let's not eat up filbert's bandwith with more of that junk!

Next. Goon. Okay, goon. I'm tired of people making "arguments" like that (I agree you can give it a try but expect a BS flag once in a while). Give me an example of an animal rights group who have objected to the use of jackrabbits and bison etc. as you state. I want to examine their position and then I can respond. Personally, I don't think you can come up with a verifiable example. That kind of arguing no matter what corner of society it comes from, is doing some real damage to civil discourse in the this country (National Anthem playing in the background). If you want to try to make some comparison arguments with the Fighting Sioux nickname issue, I think you're going to have to bring in another racial group, like, for example, all caucasians, not just some people who identify with one of the British Isles (many of whom trace roots to Normandy and other parts of Europe as Ireland was first inhabited)...ah, why waste my time: at least I can agree with your last statement: I don't think many can follow where you're going with your statements.

PS: I'm not necessarily a fan of the NCAA.

[Nidaros]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

I still believe that if "Sioux" is such a dishonorable name then why Nidaros, are you not taking your battle further? I've said it before why stop with UND, Lakota Falls, Lakota City, Lakota River. What seems to be the difference? If it's bad for UND it must be bad everywhere that word is used. Let's show some consistency here or else drop the whole stupid argument.

Well if you put it that way Sioux Falls literally in English means Snake Falls, and Sioux City is really Snake City. I suppose the early people to the upper mid west were not up on their French otherwise they might not have used the word Sioux as in Sioux Center Iowa, which is really Snake Center Iowa in honor of all those noble and honest dutchmen.

Lakota is the perferred name as I understand it. But is Snake City likely to change their name anytime soon and would all the commerical interests in Snake City do so to appease the Standing Rock Reservation? I dont think so. So that kind of takes care of your excluded middle logic.

[goon]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

Geez, I hope we can avoid trying to debate the whole nickname thing. I think all of the arguments, some plausible and some absolutely batcrap nuts, have been made on other fan message boards, primarily UND's and to a much lesser extent, NDSU's. Let's not eat up filbert's bandwith with more of that junk!

Next. Goon. Okay, goon. I'm tired of people making "arguments" like that (I agree you can give it a try but expect a BS flag once in a while). Give me an example of an animal rights group who have objected to the use of jackrabbits and bison etc. as you state. I want to examine their position and then I can respond. Personally, I don't think you can come up with a verifiable example. That kind of arguing no matter what corner of society it comes from, is doing some real damage to civil discourse in the this country (National Anthem playing in the background). If you want to try to make some comparison arguments with the Fighting Sioux nickname issue, I think you're going to have to bring in another racial group, like, for example, all caucasians, not just some people who identify with one of the British Isles (many of whom trace roots to Normandy and other parts of Europe as Ireland was first inhabited)...ah, why waste my time: at least I can agree with your last statement: I don't think many can follow where you're going with your statements.

PS: I'm not necessarily a fan of the NCAA.

Well in this state peta and the whole spearfish name. I wouldn't be surprised if there have been or will be lawsuits claiming animal rights issues at the college level. Like using animals as mascots bevo anf uga etc. Maybe its the skeptic in me I don't see the ncaa and the PC police stopping on issues like this. So how many years has the ncaa allowed the use of these nicknames and they decide its wrong to use them, yet enough of those who are supposed to find it hostile and abusive are ok with it. Did native americans bring on a lawsuit which directed the ncaa to act or did they just deicded in their infanant wisdom they know what is hostile and abusive regarding other cultures which they are not apart of.

I don't care one way or the other. The ncaa has absolute power and you have to play by their rules. Is it the fighting or sioux which the ncaa has a problem with.

[zooropa]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

Amen, and Goon, did you just come out from a rock somewhere? I thought you had more insight than that expressed in your last post. BTW, all Norwegian not even a Dane in my family tree and I dont find the use of Vikings offensive either, except when they are called viqueens by some on this board Now that one really gets me worked up.

The sad part is the word Sioux is a French word that is not complimentary to the Lakota. That alone would be reason not to use it. Forget the nuts at UND that started using it in the 1930's, they have no concept of tradition.

Sioux isn't French, it's a truncated form of a French transliteration of an Ottawa or Ojibwa word that means either foreign speaker or little snake. The etymology is far from certain.

The only thing that is certain about "Sioux" is that it's not a self-given name for the D/L/Nakota people.

[goon]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

Well if you put it that way Sioux Falls literally in English means Snake Falls, and Sioux City is really Snake City. I suppose the early people to the upper mid west were not up on their French otherwise they might not have used the word Sioux as in Sioux Center Iowa, which is really Snake Center Iowa in honor of all those noble and honest dutchmen.

Lakota is the perferred name as I understand it. But is Snake City likely to change their name anytime soon and would all the commerical interests in Snake City do so to appease the Standing Rock Reservation? I dont think so. So that kind of takes care of your excluded middle logic.

So we should continue to be insensitive to the feelings of tribes who find the name hostile and abusive?

[JackJD]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

Well in this state peta and the whole spearfish name. I wouldn't be surprised if there have been or will be lawsuits claiming animal rights issues at the college level. Like using animals as mascots bevo anf uga etc....

Goon: do a little research on the spearfish deal. PETA was making a joke -- to, in their minds, raise the level of thinking about their favorite issues. Geez, it was a joke. A dumb one. It got a little free publicity and apparently a few people like you somehow read something serious into it. Your second statement shows a profound lack of understanding of the legal system and causes me to think we may have to add some additional remedial classes to the curriculum.

I've gotta check to see if goon is an alias for one of the electronic media fear mongers.

[goon]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

Goon: do a little research on the spearfish deal. PETA was making a joke -- to, in their minds, raise the level of thinking about their favorite issues. Geez, it was a joke. A dumb one. It got a little free publicity and apparently a few people like you somehow read something serious into it. Your second statement shows a profound lack of understanding of the legal system and causes me to think we may have to add some additional remedial classes to the curriculum.

I've gotta check to see if goon is an alias for one of the electronic media fear mongers.

Don't think to hard about it. I'm just a guy who thinks its a little silly the up roar people have that und is so wrong for wanting to keep their name. I also think its silly all the law suits and such. I think its silly the ncaa is worried about nicknames schools have when the ncaa has more issues to be concerned about. Frankly I think our legal system is a little messed up. Maybe you think highly of it which is fine. Its a message board so don't think to hard about what people post or think on here. You don't always have to take things so serious or maybe I should insert smiley or sarcasm quotes if that would help.

[Nidaros]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

Moderators:
If I post to this thread ever again, I should be banned for 6 months.

[rabidrabbit]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

Moderators:
If I post to this thread ever again, I should be banned for 6 months.

Since you did, should I ban you now?

[Nidaros]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

Since you did, should I ban you now?

No the ban would apply to future posts such as replying to Goon and boxerboy postings. I really am tired of discussing this issue. Thats my point.

[goon]

Re: ND legislature and Sioux name

So does this post count as a future post since your last one? I hope you didnt just ban yourself.