Last scholarship???

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: Last scholarship???

I think come next Midnight Madness, lots of folks will be surprised to learn that Fiegen is not much bigger (if bigger at all) than Cassaday, Pederson, or even Rader. Cassaday has the potential to play bigger than his 6'6" body, and Pederson is a pretty long 6'8".

IMO, if Cassaday and Pederson can contribute and Davis is healthy, our "bigs" will be on par with most mid majors and the Summit League competition. With AC, we could be better than many mid majors and most of our conference mates.

Filling the 4-5 spot next year:

Davis
Cordova
Williams
Engen
Cassaday
Pederson
Fiegen
Rader

By my count, that's 8 (7 if you count Rader as a G/F) guys to fill 2 floor positions. Not bad, IMO.

[Jacked_Up]

Re: Last scholarship???

Brandon DeBoer, 6-6 junior forward, is on the roster too. I don't know what his status was this past season. Redshirt? Injury? Practice player? DeBoer is similar in height and body type to Kai Williams, and seems to get around the court pretty well. Cassaday, also 6-6, reminds me of Michael Loney from last year's squad. A battler. Anyway, I agree with SF. If Davis is healthy and newcomers like Pederson and Fiegen contribute, the Jacks should have a pretty good mix of bigs. Getting depth at point guard might be a bigger issue.

[TeaJackrabbit]

Re: Last scholarship???

Coach Nagy said two weeks ago that both Fiegen and White are "going to play a lot of minutes for us next year." Seems pretty clear to me that Coach Nagy thinks they're both ready to contribute right away.

Well that works for me. From what I saw from Fiegen at the HS level, he wasn't ready to log alot of productive minutes at the D1 level, but how can little ol me argue w/ Coach? I hope he puts more emphasis into rebounding.

I guess if we don't go out and try hard to land another big then we can say that Coach is satisfied with what he has. It's a no-brainer he knows more about players development and health than we do.

AC and Davis are a pretty solid duo in the paint. If Engen and Fiegen bust their tails this summer they could be capable backups. And Cassaday could be a pretty tough-nosed undersized guy against alot of lowr-level D1 schools.

[Kemo]

Re: Last scholarship???

Nothing is stated you can only use your redshirt your freshman year. Sure it seems the most logical, but it isn't a law.

You're right in the fact that you can redshirt a player beyond their freshman year if they have not used it, but it's not a particularly good idea. The reason for this is the redshirt year right out of high school is there to create a smoother transition to the next level both physically and mentally, which helps reduce the "on the court" growing pains for the player and the team. If the player has already played an entire college season, are they going to benefit as much from sitting out a year not playing?... I personally think "no" in most cases. I don't feel MacKenzie Casey benefitted from redshirting later in his career from a production stand point, as the benefit there was he had a chance to compete for an NCAA Tournament bid and the team could spread its scholarships out a little more. Also, it's much harder to convince a player they should sit out a year after they have already played a full college season, unless of course there is an offseason injury, in which case they can request a medical redshirt if they have already used their traditional redshirt!

I just want to clarify that I'm not saying Fiegen or White aren't ready to play right away, as I don't believe one can make an accurate judgment till they are evaluted playing against other college players in offseason workouts. I just feel it is a waste of valuable development time to not redshirt a player who isn't going to get a respectable amount of playing time, which could effect their overall physical development and mental psyche.

[EQguy]

Re: Last scholarship???

in which case they can request a medical redshirt if they have already used their traditional redshirt!

Just one quick point here Kemo. The medical redshirt is closing in on a thing of the past. They are next to impossible to get at this level.

[bub94]

Re: Last scholarship???

You're right in the fact that you can redshirt a player beyond their freshman year if they have not used it, but it's not a particularly good idea. The reason for this is the redshirt year right out of high school is there to create a smoother transition to the next level both physically and mentally, which helps reduce the "on the court" growing pains for the player and the team. If the player has already played an entire college season, are they going to benefit as much from sitting out a year not playing?... I personally think "no" in most cases. I don't feel MacKenzie Casey benefitted from redshirting later in his career from a production stand point, as the benefit there was he had a chance to compete for an NCAA Tournament bid and the team could spread its scholarships out a little more. Also, it's much harder to convince a player they should sit out a year after they have already played a full college season, unless of course there is an offseason injury, in which case they can request a medical redshirt if they have already used their traditional redshirt!

I just want to clarify that I'm not saying Fiegen or White aren't ready to play right away, as I don't believe one can make an accurate judgment till they are evaluted playing against other college players in offseason workouts. I just feel it is a waste of valuable development time to not redshirt a player who isn't going to get a respectable amount of playing time, which could effect their overall physical development and mental psyche.

Everyone was making comments regarding them redshirting next year. My point is you don't have to redshirt and if you do, it doesn't have to be your freshman year. In my opinion, neither one needs to redshirt next year. Tony has added size in the past year and Chad has gotten his leaping back from surgery. Tony is not going to be playing "center". He is a 3 or 4. But with the smaller scheme Coach has switched to, he will be rotating on defense with our "center".

[NoVaJack]

Re: Last scholarship???

Add up all the previous posts and you have to say that for the first time in a long time the Jacks could have a lot of options. Good options, especially with the core of players that will return. One more big presence inside and everyone else on the team gets better, AC gets better and stays stronger, and you see a team rise exponentially.
It will be very interesting to watch.

[Kemo]

Re: Last scholarship???

Just one quick point here Kemo. The medical redshirt is closing in on a thing of the past. They are next to impossible to get at this level.

Yah, you are right that they are not being handed out quite as liberally as in the past, but they are still obtainable if one can convince the NCAA of a true hardship: (i.e. not getting to play a single game in their senior season due to an injury)

[Nidaros]

Re: Last scholarship???

Yah, you are right that they are not being handed out quite as liberally as in the past, but they are still obtainable if one can convince the NCAA of a true hardship: (i.e. not getting to play a single game in their senior season due to an injury)

Medical redshirts at the D1 level are not given out in the same manner as D2. A big difference.

[Rabbitlivinginverm]

Re: Last scholarship???

Brandon DeBoer, 6-6 junior forward, is on the roster too. I don't know what his status was this past season. Redshirt? Injury? Practice player? DeBoer is similar in height and body type to Kai Williams, and seems to get around the court pretty well. Cassaday, also 6-6, reminds me of Michael Loney from last year's squad. A battler. Anyway, I agree with SF. If Davis is healthy and newcomers like Pederson and Fiegen contribute, the Jacks should have a pretty good mix of bigs. Getting depth at point guard might be a bigger issue.

DeBoer is a practice player. He's the same height as Kai but that's it. I don't think he'll ever see regular playing time.

Cassaday is more athletic than Loney but is a battler like him. Which is nice to have on the court.

[Kemo]

Re: Last scholarship???

Medical redshirts at the D1 level are not given out in the same manner as D2. A big difference.

I'll have to read up on the D1 medical redshirt policy since most of my recollection of how medical redshirts worked was from the D2 era.

[Nidaros]

Re: Last scholarship???

I'll have to read up on the D1 medical redshirt policy since most of my recollection of how medical redshirts worked was from the D2 era.

I am hardly expert, but the big difference that I have noticed between D2 and D1, is that progress towards a degree is a driving factor at the d1 level. The student athlete has to complete his academic progress in a certaiin number of semesters, and when they stop making progress, they are no longe ineligibe to compete and that might explain a number of transfers from D1 to D2, where the time limits in completing the eligibilty is more flexible. I think the progress rules could stop a medical redshirt from being granted if the Student Athlete's progress ends up outside the time frame. The NCC was very liberal with the medical redshirts and I think that was one of SDSU problems going into d1 transition. We finished the final two years of d2 with five to seven seniors, and that stopped the coaches from going out looking for fresh recruits. They had no scholarships to offer. At least three of the seniors had medical redshirts and should have been gone before we started the transition to D1. Cerveny was one that comes to mind. Its amazing how quick you forget the roster from five to six years ago. I am sure others can expand here.

[Kemo]

Re: Last scholarship???

From my quick online research, "Medical Hardship/Redshirt" is not the same as the "Extension of the 5 year clock", which is where I was confused in an earlier post.

"Medical Hardship/Redshirt"
A medical hardship is a form of relief that a university’s student-athlete will receive after a university’s application to the conference only if:

• the student-athlete’s injury or illness was incapacitating;
• the student-athlete’s incapacitating injury or illness occurred during the first half of the season and before competition in more then two contests or 20% of the season’s scheduled contests (whichever is greater); and
• the injury or illness is supported by contemporaneous medical documentation.

"Extension of the 5 Year Clock"
Sixth season of eligibility granted by the NCAA based on missing the equivalent of two seasons of competition for reasons beyond the student-athlete's and the institution's control.

So basically, from my understanding, The NCAA gives a 5 year window of eligibility in athletic competition after a person enrolls in a post secondary institution, in which they are allowed to compete only 4 out of these 5 years. If the participant files for a medical hardship and meets the requirements posted above, they will receive the extension on their playing career if the extension falls within the 5 year period (i.e. plays in year 1,2, and 4 but was injuried in year 3 within the parameters of the rule, he/she will be allowed to compete in year 5). It is much tougher to get an extension on the 5 year period, as a participate must prove 2 years of hardship (medical or other) in which to be granted an extension of the participation window to 6 years (i.e. if redshirted during freshman year for non-medical reasons, would have to prove a hardship in 2 of the 4 participation years).

Though I did mistake the rule in an earlier post, knowing what I do now does not change my mind in regards to me believing that a player should be expected to average 15 minutes or more a game as a true freshman in order to skip his/her redshirt year in basketball.


Sources:
http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/...-hardships.pdf

http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/...-clock-ext.pdf

[Kemo]

Re: Last scholarship???

I am hardly expert, but the big difference that I have noticed between D2 and D1, is that progress towards a degree is a driving factor at the d1 level. The student athlete has to complete his academic progress in a certaiin number of semesters, and when they stop making progress, they are no longe ineligibe to compete and that might explain a number of transfers from D1 to D2, where the time limits in completing the eligibilty is more flexible. I think the progress rules could stop a medical redshirt from being granted if the Student Athlete's progress ends up outside the time frame. The NCC was very liberal with the medical redshirts and I think that was one of SDSU problems going into d1 transition. We finished the final two years of d2 with five to seven seniors, and that stopped the coaches from going out looking for fresh recruits. They had no scholarships to offer. At least three of the seniors had medical redshirts and should have been gone before we started the transition to D1. Cerveny was one that comes to mind. Its amazing how quick you forget the roster from five to six years ago. I am sure others can expand here.

Okay, I understand where you are coming from here. I think this falls more under academic eligibility, though these standards do have to be met as well as the stipulations for being eligible for the hardship/5 year clock extension that I posted previously. There are different academic standards from DII to DI (though I don't feel like looking them as I'm tired of homework for today ), so I am sure you are right about them being a factor in the regularity of medical redshirts given out in DII compared to DI.

[Jacks#1Fan]

Re: Last scholarship???

AC and Davis are a pretty solid duo in the paint. If Engen and Fiegen bust their tails this summer they could be capable backups. And Cassaday could be a pretty tough-nosed undersized guy against alot of lowr-level D1 schools.

I notice that quite a few of the posts talk about Davis as if he is going to be ready to go next fall. I think from what I hear, that is a stretch and that it is more likely that he is not going to be ready to play next fall. That will certainly have a bearing on whether Coach Nagy would redshirt Tony Fiegen next fall...although I don't believe he is planning to under either circumstance.