Argus Editorial on Nagy

[rabbit_boy]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

People have been saying the same thing for years, be patient talent is coming and things will improve. I hate to tell you, they wont improve under the current coaching staff. By the time next years frosh are soph's, our junior class is gone and we are starting over again, but thats a whole other can or worms.

But I forget, we are all supposed to stick our heads in the sand and keep saying things are getting better. Oh yeah, and we are to believe we are going to be Duke, NC, UCLA etc and win the whole thing this year. If we write anything else we are the problem and should be burnt at the cross. Sorry for caring about the future of our team.

[1stRowFANatic]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

No..... Its the fact that your not going to improve the program by changing coaches, if by some chance you do get a coach that becomes something he'll be gone with the first offer..... Until you atleast match NDSU dollar for dollar you won't get anyone....

You've got to be kidding me. We have one of the best venues in the region. Great corporate support. A proven fan base that comes out even when things are mediocre. In a conference with an auto-bid to March Madness. The host institution for the next two years for the conference tournament, with a community that wants it to come back for as many years as possible. An institution that has shown its commitment to athletics and being successful in every sport. An administration that has shown it is willing to hang with a coach during repeated losing seasons. An institution that is embarking on its largest capital drive ever.

Yep, there is no coach out there that wants to get in a situation like that.

But somehow, the idea that a coaching change may need to be made is going to make the program worse. We have averaged 8.25 wins per season over the last four years (10, 9, 6, and 8). What is going to be worse? Only winning 5 games per year?

I think our University is strong enough to keep good student-athletes even if a change is made. Some may leave or not come, but for those few that make that choice, I believe we will get others to consider SDSU for the first time. Stu laid out the points in a very even handed manner, IMO, and the obvious conclusion is that the program is not close to where anyone thought it would be 5 years ago. It has not made progress towards being a competitive program. It just hasn't.

Given the above factors, you don't think anyone would want to take the job because they couldn't make it better? Back to back 10 win seasons is better. Tom McCrean was just talking about how he was glad Indiana only got three years probation because that means next years freshman have a shot at the tournament and the program can truly say they have turned the page towards a brighter future. The reasons the two programs futures look bleak are not analogous, but being able to turn the page is. And I do not rule out the possibility that Coach Nagy can be the page turner.

Do I think that means Coach Nagy must be gone? No, not now and not necessarily at the end of the year. I have posted many times that I want him to be the coach of the Jackrabbits for the next 20 years. But I want a competitive program more.

If Coach Nagy leaves (which I think is more likely than him being fired), I have no doubt that he will get another job rather quickly and in 5-7 years he will have that program competing at a very high level. If Coach Nagy stays (which I think will only happen if the team shows significant progress this year), I think in 5-7 years he will have this program competing at a very high level. What I don't think will happen is to have another year like the past four and the program to be turned around in the next 5-7 years.

[SDSUJack3031]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

I wasn't pleased with the Stig hiring from Day 1 just to be clear, so there should be no comparison to my statements on the two. But, Stig has actually made progress during the transition with similar staff issues as Nagy. And I have also admitted as such that Stig's progress in the past couple of years has been very good in my personal opinion. So I am big enough to admit that I could have been wrong at one time.

People continually make excuses for coach Nagy on here (not calling you out specifically by quoting you eq just to be clear). I will admit that it's probably easier to make the transition in the women's sports, but AJ is faced with the same staffing numbers as Nagy, same scholarships as allowed by the NCAA, same facility issues and recruiting to the same city and campus. If anything the number of quality players to recruit from might be bigger for men's sports than women's. Yes, injuries are something a coach can't control. But identifying talent, developing talent and retaining talent are a core aspect of any coach's job. There's obviously something lacking in regard to that last statement as it relates to SDSU's MBB program. At one time the MBB staff was one of the best at that, now not so much.

Here's a statement for thought, maybe the wrong coach left to take over the Mankato State program. SDSU hasn't been "right" since Margenthaler left. Could he have been that big of a factor in Nagy's success? I'll vote yes on that. Anyone agree or disagree?

Could not agree more. Margenthaler was huge for SDSU! Now choosing to keep Margenthaler over Nagy isn't likely, but a replacement in the future is a definite possibility. Hopefully before he gets a better job.

[SturgisJeff]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Coaches coach, players play. The coach no matter how good or how bad is only there on the sideline. He can't play. His playbook may be good and it is up to the players to make it work. He needs to find players that will work for him. He can motivate his butt off but if his players dont accept it what can he do. You can see Nagys frustration and his desire to win but apparantly the players dont or dont care which I dont think is the case. Should Nagy be fired, dont know. I do think if he thinks he cant do it he will resign. One year or two, who knows. Look at the Detroit Lions. Some good coaches came in and because of the players they get canned. Sometimes its the players fault and not the coaches.

[JacksFroshFan]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

People have been saying the same thing for years, be patient talent is coming and things will improve. I hate to tell you, they wont improve under the current coaching staff. By the time next years frosh are soph's, our junior class is gone and we are starting over again, but thats a whole other can or worms.

But I forget, we are all supposed to stick our heads in the sand and keep saying things are getting better. Oh yeah, and we are to believe we are going to be Duke, NC, UCLA etc and win the whole thing this year. If we write anything else we are the problem and should be burnt at the cross. Sorry for caring about the future of our team.

Why can they not improve under the current coaching staff?

We are 5 games out of our probationary period. If we had these problems 4 years out of probation, that'd be one thing, but he's bascially had one recruiting class where he could go into their living room and say, "Hey, we are eligible for all post season tournaments, next year." Not the, "hey, in two years, three years or four years from now we will be eligible." High school kids that can play at the D1 level want a shot at playing in a conference tournament and an NCAA tournament. They don't want to come in and play a regular season with nothing to play for at the end of the year.

We haven't been able to offer that to players until now and it appears that our first class and the class next year should be strong. Davis was a great get (unfortunately the injury bug hit). I don't know that Davis gives us a second look if we weren't going to be out of probation. I think we are damn lucky we have players like Kai, Garrett and Clint who came in while still on probation. For the talent those three have, I think they are pretty special people for coming into what I'm sure they knew would be a tough situation and sticking it out to this point.

I think Coach Nagy deserves the chance to prove whether he can or can not compete now that the probation is no longer an issue.

Firing a guy one year out of that period just doesn't make sense. People will reference how NDSU has done. NDSU developed a full class from year 1 and have been graced with few injuries, unfortunately due to injuries we haven't had the luxury of having a full roster of players. After this year it will be interesting to see how NDSU will be with their senior class leaving. The injuries have just been a killer. Mo, Beran, Davis, Palarca, Cassady to just name a few. When in the last 2-3 years have we had all our players healthy for one game let alone a month or more to just play together and gel? I can't think of a time off the top of my head.

Coach Nagy in my opinion can get the job done now that he is on a level playing field with the rest of the conference.

[joeboo22]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Why can they not improve under the current coaching staff?

We are 5 games out of our probationary period. If we had these problems 4 years out of probation, that'd be one thing, but he's bascially had one recruiting class where he could go into their living room and say, "Hey, we are eligible for all post season tournaments, next year." Not the, "hey, in two years, three years or four years from now we will be eligible." High school kids that can play at the D1 level want a shot at playing in a conference tournament and an NCAA tournament. They don't want to come in and play a regular season with nothing to play for at the end of the year.

We haven't been able to offer that to players until now and it appears that our first class and the class next year should be strong. Davis was a great get (unfortunately the injury bug hit). I don't know that Davis gives us a second look if we weren't going to be out of probation. I think we are damn lucky we have players like Kai, Garrett and Clint who came in while still on probation. For the talent those three have, I think they are pretty special people for coming into what I'm sure they knew would be a tough situation and sticking it out to this point.

I think Coach Nagy deserves the chance to prove whether he can or can not compete now that the probation is no longer an issue.

Firing a guy one year out of that period just doesn't make sense. People will reference how NDSU has done. NDSU developed a full class from year 1 and have been graced with few injuries, unfortunately due to injuries we haven't had the luxury of having a full roster of players. After this year it will be interesting to see how NDSU will be with their senior class leaving. The injuries have just been a killer. Mo, Beran, Davis, Palarca, Cassady to just name a few. When in the last 2-3 years have we had all our players healthy for one game let alone a month or more to just play together and gel? I can't think of a time off the top of my head.

Coach Nagy in my opinion can get the job done now that he is on a level playing field with the rest of the conference.

I agree 110%..... Its like people on here think that just because its are first year out of transition we should be fine...... Nagy has done a good job over the past 5 years, if anybody could of done as good as job as him and still be sane after all the injuries and everything else over the past 5 years, I'd like to have your autograph..... Atleast let him coach his first true D-I recruits in Feigen and White....

Too many people compare the mens program to the women... It doesn't make sense... Th women get the Colton Iverson's too stay, not because there great, but because they have a good program and IOWA, IOWA STATE, Minnesota, and all of the other D-I schools don't flood to the tri-state area for every guy that might be the next mike miller like they do in mens basketball..... Not the mens program.... I think next year if we don't blow this team up and Davis can come back 100% they could be a contender for the conference.....

The mens RPI is right around where there funding is.... I know people say well the women, or the football team (they were pretty bad until they started funding 100% of there scholarships) or this or that or everything else.... The only thing to compare to is NDSU, They have funded there basketball team a heck of a lot better and done a pretty decent job....

[SUPERBUNNY]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

I'll gaurantee you one thing, Stu is lurking on here reading this and laughing his ass off!

We all took the bait! There's overeactions on both sides, the whole gammut!

I can just picture Stu now belly-laughing with that smurk on his face.

UUUUUUUUGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm with filbert, this thread is done for me.

I'm just going to go support the team and let everything else take care of itself.

GB, GB, GJ!

SUPERBUNNY

[Jacks99]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Can't find the post, but the comments on Nagy switching gears and recruiting the players such as Feigen and White, he needs another year to make that transition. If the team stays together and Davis comes back from injury, I agree next years could be a competitive conference team.

If anything it's interesting to see where the core fan base is at and glad I don't have to make that decision.

[1stRowFANatic]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Why can they not improve under the current coaching staff?

I don't think anyone has, well most haven't, said they couldn't. My question to you would be why haven't they improved from the past?

We are 5 games out of our probationary period. If we had these problems 4 years out of probation, that'd be one thing, but he's bascially had one recruiting class where he could go into their living room and say, "Hey, we are eligible for all post season tournaments, next year." Not the, "hey, in two years, three years or four years from now we will be eligible." High school kids that can play at the D1 level want a shot at playing in a conference tournament and an NCAA tournament. They don't want to come in and play a regular season with nothing to play for at the end of the year.

While it is true that some of this year's team wasn't eligible for past tournaments, all have been recruited with the knowledge they would be eligible this year.

We haven't been able to offer that to players until now and it appears that our first class and the class next year should be strong. Davis was a great get (unfortunately the injury bug hit). I don't know that Davis gives us a second look if we weren't going to be out of probation.

Switch unsettled coaching status for probation (I think you meant transition) and we are in the exact same spot.

I think we are damn lucky we have players like Kai, Garrett and Clint who came in while still on probation. For the talent those three have, I think they are pretty special people for coming into what I'm sure they knew would be a tough situation and sticking it out to this point.

Absolutely agree with you on this.

I think Coach Nagy deserves the chance to prove whether he can or can not compete now that the probation is no longer an issue.

Firing a guy one year out of that period just doesn't make sense. People will reference how NDSU has done. NDSU developed a full class from year 1 and have been graced with few injuries, unfortunately due to injuries we haven't had the luxury of having a full roster of players. After this year it will be interesting to see how NDSU will be with their senior class leaving. The injuries have just been a killer. Mo, Beran, Davis, Palarca, Cassady to just name a few. When in the last 2-3 years have we had all our players healthy for one game let alone a month or more to just play together and gel? I can't think of a time off the top of my head.

Coach Nagy in my opinion can get the job done now that he is on a level playing field with the rest of the conference.

Injuries happen to all programs, but I will admit that our problems have been unlucky. However, I do not think that Coach Nagy would say that the transition status should be used as an excuse/reason for the state of the program. The idea was that each year it would improve in its competitiveness so that by this year it would have a program that would have a realistic shot at the post season; I don't think we have a realistic shot at the post-season this year (March Madness no, Summit Tourney maybe). Does that mean I think we have to make it into the tourney to have had a successful year? Nope.

As for me, I am done on the topic and I will agree to disagree on the subject. I know that all of us hope that the year progresses so that no decision has to be made at all in this regard.

[BTownJack]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

As for me, I am done on the topic and I will agree to disagree on the subject. I know that all of us hope that the year progresses so that no decision has to be made at all in this regard.

Can I get an AMEN! Cheers to the boys winning today and tomorrow and get a run going into our first conference weekend!

[bub94]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

I'll gaurantee you one thing, Stu is lurking on here reading this and laughing his ass off!

We all took the bait! There's overeactions on both sides, the whole gammut!

I can just picture Stu now belly-laughing with that smurk on his face.

UUUUUUUUGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm with filbert, this thread is done for me.

I'm just going to go support the team and let everything else take care of itself.

GB, GB, GJ!

SUPERBUNNY

I agree. He is sitting at home with orange fingers, orange "milk" smile and something else orange from eating Cheetos and reading these posts. I'm just surprised a Jacks fan would even read a column written by him.

[CatchEmAll]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Wait a minute...Stu wrote a column about something that started all of this?!?!?!

[sizzleman]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

It will be interesting to see what happens with this, after this year. I don't have my mind made up yet of what I would like to see happen, although I'm starting to get annoyed of our results.

I personally think we need someone with a lot of recruiting experience, I'm not sold on some of the athletes we have been recruiting.
For Fun
Who would be on your short list of coaches who we would actually have a chance of hiring and would be an upgrade over Nagy? Big Time recruiting experience? Local Guy? No ties with SD at all?



I got two or three but I first want to see what the rest come up with.

[filbert]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Wait a minute...Stu wrote a column about something that started all of this?!?!?!

More likely Stu lurks here, looking for something controversial to write up and get people going. So be careful, y'all . . . Big Brother Is Watching!

(There . . . replied to the ThreadKiller himself. Maybe I'll get a ThreadKilling Assist.)

[JackJD]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

If that's a motion to kill the thread, I second it.