IPFW Game 2

[1bunnies]

Re: IPFW Game 2

I agree. I have not turned on Matt either. When your at the games though, it is very obvious that his productivity has gone south. I'm confident that Matt will bounce back, but I don't think it will be until he has a chance to heal. Good Luck Matt.

[mitchell2006]

Re: IPFW Game 2

I don't think it has anything to do with matt's hip pointer. I believe Nagy said in a Post Game that it wasn't the hip but just him being mentally tired and worn out. He's a prideful man and losing and not playing up to his standards is most likely frustrating him. I'm guessing he'll back to form next year though.

[MilwaukeeJacksAlum]

Re: IPFW Game 2

 Maybe Nagy is trying to get more minutes for Engen and Bassett, but Cadwell should have been the one sitting on the bench.

Your infatuation with Cadwell is a little disconcerting to say the least. I love it when fans get all bent out of shape when someone leaves the program talking about how it's BS that they are turning their back on the program, etc., yet are equally quick to cast judgment against a player whenever he starts to struggle. Cadwell was the only shining part of the team last year and was rightfully the opposing team's main concern for most of the season this year. Now, because he had a bad half of the season, you want to tell him to leave and not let the door catch him on the way out? Maybe if he had quit half way through the season or played up his injury as an excuse to sit on the bench you'd be happy?

One thing I know for certain. In this day and age of the spoiled athlete, give me someone who will give his all every game even while injured or playing poorly. From my sources, and they're pretty impressive sources, Cadwell's injury was more than anyone let on. The temptation must have been there for him to use that as an excuse, but it was always debunked whenever Terry V or anyone tried to suggest it was bothering him. Coach Nagy takes heat for players transferring, etc, but when he decides to stick with someone who's struggling and who as a freshman he told "you have to shoot more for us to win", then he gets questioned as well? He can't win.

Cadwell, as most of our team, would have been best suited as a player who could grow in the program into the player Nagy envisioned. For reasons everyone has discussed ad naseum that couldn't happen. Cadwell's game has seemingly regressed as a result lately. I saw Williams play at the beginning of the season against UWM and he all but disappeared in that game. Now he's leading the team every night and is someone to build a team around. Same thing was being said about Cadwell at the end of last season. (That's not a knock on Williams - I think he's the real deal)

I expect Cadwell, if he returns (and I hope he does) to come back rejuvinated and ready to play. He will no longer have to shoulder the burden of being the scorer and can thrive as a 2 guard who can shoot out of a double team and occasionally create his own shot. Or maybe he'll just quit and we can all chastise him for leaving the team (or rejoice depending on your thoughts on the matter).

[rabbit_boy]

Re: IPFW Game 2

Did Coach Nagy lose many players to transfer during the NCC days?

[MontanaRabbit]

Re: IPFW Game 2

No. I can't remember any players transferring when we were DII.

Of course it seemed we were competing for a conference title year in and year out.

[89rabbit]

Re: IPFW Game 2

When you are D-II, D-I players transfer to your school.


Go State!

[collegewatcher]

Re: IPFW Game 2

MJA can I get an AMEN from the SDSU Show Choir!?! You are absolutly right, but it does not just happen here. Should I start another thread about how Joe Krabbenhoft or Mike Miller will be back to South Dakota before anyone even knows they left?

We've got MAYBE 5 kids right now that can actually play Division One basketball, and some folks want to run one of them off.

[SD-STATE]

Re: IPFW Game 2

Well it originally sounded like one of them were going to run off on their own. It was after that when one of the posters said don't let the door bite ya in the ...

[jackmd]

Re: IPFW Game 2

MJA can I get an AMEN from the SDSU Show Choir!?! You are absolutly right, but it does not just happen here. Should I start another thread about how Joe Krabbenhoft or Mike Miller will be back to South Dakota before anyone even knows they left?

We've got MAYBE 5 kids right now that can actually play Division One basketball, and some folks want to run one of them off.

I don't think any folks can run Cadwell off. Matt and Coach Nagy will discuss what each of them wants and come to an agreement. I would personally prefer that Cadwell stay but whatever Coach feals is best for the team is what I will accept. As the quote from Filbert and requote from 89 says, Nagy is not expecting any players to leave.

[89rabbit]

Re: IPFW Game 2

*From the Moderator

The good doctor is correct it was reported that Coach Nagy does not expect any players to leave the squad this year.  Please don't make me close another thread because we can't stop gossiping.  If things change there will be plenty of time to discuss this matter to death, but unless or until something changes I believe that we should leave this topic alone.


*Warning this moderator did a mountain of paperwork this afternoon and he may not be in the best of modes.  Having talked to the other moderator, about this very subject, I am not sure that he has any more patients then I do for this topic.*

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: IPFW Game 2

I think you could say every program has 5 kids who can play DI basketball. Look at most elite college teams and they have 2 MAYBE 3 good players, 5-7 average players, and 2-5 marginal players. Very few teams have 1 player who goes pro, even among the elite programs in the nation. More and more those 2-3 top players are freshman and sophomores. SDSU is the type of school where we need those 2-3 players to develop over their entire career. We will never get Greg Oden to come to SDSU, and that is probably a good thing.

Will SDSU be better next year? I would put my money on yes.

When you have your top 3 scorers as freshman or sophomores, to me it means the program has tremendous upside. IMO, it is a pretty solid core to build on for the next 3-4 years.

As a side note, I did have a couple of thoughts on the Cadwell rumors. There are probably 10's if not hundreds of people who heard rumors about Cadwell (probably closer to thousands now that it has made it onto the forum). If you are truly close enough to the program to know these things first, what good does it do to post them on a website before it is actually verified by a viable source? Probably more harm than good.

I hope it makes you feel good to have known first. Check that, you probably weren't the first to know, just the first to post it on the web. Which begs the question, what motivates you to post and not the other people who knew before you? Selfishness and pride. Mostly a desire to appear in-the-know amongst a group of several hundred strangers. Like I said, I hope you feel good. (end of sermon)

On a positive note, I've heard really good things about Cordova. Things like "he is the most explosive player SDSU had in preseason workouts." You read that right. Might be fun to watch him and Kai on the court together. Might cause some matchup problems with other teams in the Mid Con.

How about this for a starting lineup:
1. Callahan
2. Cadwell
3. Williams
4. Beran
5. Berte

How about this for coming off the bench:
1. Mac
2. Yackley
3. Cardova
4. Bassett
5. Loney/Engen

Next year if we can have 1 guy average 15+ppg, 2 guys average over 10-15 ppg, 2 guys averaging 8-10ppg, and get some solid minutes from other reserves, the team will be greatly improved. These stats are entirely possible. Kai averaging 15+, Callahan with ~12, Beran with ~12, Berte with ~8, Big Tom with ~8. Heck, Engen could even average 8 a game if he continues to progress as he did at the end of the year.

One last thing: Everyone talking about how we need more size needs a reality check, IMO. Most college teams are lucky to have 1 guy over 6-9. We've got that, and by his senior season Engen could be a very good player. Anybody here remember Corliss Williamson? How about Charles Barkley? Two 6'6" guys who didn't seem to get the memo regarding how height was a requirement to play DI ball. We were only outrebounded this year by an average of 1 per game. Pretty decent production for an undersized, undertalented team. Next year, we will outrebound our opponents pretty handily, and we will probably do it with 1 guy on the roster over 6'9".

I think we are all about 12 months from being very pleased with SDSU Mens Basketball!

[SD-STATE]

Re: IPFW Game 2

> Grrrrrrrrrr...

[thebluehatman]

Re: IPFW Game 2

> Grrrrrrrrrr...  

Exactly...Back to biting my tongue about this subject.

Some thoughts about the game:
We gotta close out games better than we did against IPFW, but being young you have to learn these things and develop that killer instinct. Staying close is good and all if you're okay with losing. But you need to go on runs to take and build leads to get the almighty W. That said, I think the sting of losing is getting the team anxious to win and go on tears.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: IPFW Game 2

On a real tear here,

Out of the AP top 25 mid majors:

-Butler has 0 players at or over 6'9"

-SIU has 2 players at or over 6'9" One averages 1.1 minutes and the other 6.2 minutes

-Winthrop has 2 players at or over 6'9" One averages 27.8 minutes and the other 6.6 minutes.

-BYU has 4 players at or over 6'9" One at 28.3 minutes, one at 9.5 minutes, one at 8.1 minutes, and one at 4.2 minutes.

Out of these 4 schools in the top 25, there are 2 guys over 6'9" who get significant minutes.

-NDSU has 1 guy over 6'9". He averaged 5 pts and 6 rebs per game.

My point is that it is production, not size, that we should look to judge our big men.

[SD-STATE]

Re: IPFW Game 2

I think you could say every program has 5 kids who can play DI basketball. Look at most elite college teams and they have 2 MAYBE 3 good players, 5-7 average players, and 2-5 marginal players. Very few teams have 1 player who goes pro, even among the elite programs in the nation. More and more those 2-3 top players are freshman and sophomores. SDSU is the type of school where we need those 2-3 players to develop over their entire career. We will never get Greg Oden to come to SDSU, and that is probably a good thing.

Will SDSU be better next year? I would put my money on yes.

When you have your top 3 scorers as freshman or sophomores, to me it means the program has tremendous upside. IMO, it is a pretty solid core to build on for the next 3-4 years.

As a side note, I did have a couple of thoughts on the Cadwell rumors. There are probably 10's if not hundreds of people who heard rumors about Cadwell (probably closer to thousands now that it has made it onto the forum). If you are truly close enough to the program to know these things first, what good does it do to post them on a website before it is actually verified by a viable source? Probably more harm than good.

I hope it makes you feel good to have known first. Check that, you probably weren't the first to know, just the first to post it on the web. Which begs the question, what motivates you to post and not the other people who knew before you? Selfishness and pride. Mostly a desire to appear in-the-know amongst a group of several hundred strangers. Like I said, I hope you feel good. (end of sermon)

On a positive note, I've heard really good things about Cordova. Things like "he is the most explosive player SDSU had in preseason workouts." You read that right. Might be fun to watch him and Kai on the court together. Might cause some matchup problems with other teams in the Mid Con.

How about this for a starting lineup:
1. Callahan
2. Cadwell
3. Williams
4. Beran
5. Berte

How about this for coming off the bench:
1. Mac
2. Yackley
3. Cardova
4. Bassett
5. Loney/Engen

Next year if we can have 1 guy average 15+ppg, 2 guys average over 10-15 ppg, 2 guys averaging 8-10ppg, and get some solid minutes from other reserves, the team will be greatly improved. These stats are entirely possible. Kai averaging 15+, Callahan with ~12, Beran with ~12, Berte with ~8, Big Tom with ~8. Heck, Engen could even average 8 a game if he continues to progress as he did at the end of the year.

One last thing: Everyone talking about how we need more size needs a reality check, IMO. Most college teams are lucky to have 1 guy over 6-9. We've got that, and by his senior season Engen could be a very good player. Anybody here remember Corliss Williamson? How about Charles Barkley? Two 6'6" guys who didn't seem to get the memo regarding how height was a requirement to play DI ball. We were only outrebounded this year by an average of 1 per game. Pretty decent production for an undersized, undertalented team. Next year, we will outrebound our opponents pretty handily, and we will probably do it with 1 guy on the roster over 6'9".

I think we are all about 12 months from being very pleased with SDSU Mens Basketball!

Excellent points!