Lujan or Christion?

[Nidaros]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

That may be taking it a bit too far! haha But I do here that Tyler is a phenomenal guy. Zimmer had a good write up about him at the start of the year.

Seems like there was one game last year when Lujan sort of lost it, and they put Tyler in for one series and he was more surprised than all the fans together as he did not do well as I recall. Poor guy, I understand he was a real good QB in high school and would do good if he got his chance other than a surprise chance. I guess I tire of all the pros and cons of Lujan and TC.

[WestSideRabbit]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

I should find Goon tomorrow during tailgating and we will indian leg wrestle to determine it. If I win, TC starts, if Goon wins, Lujan starts. We should do it early enough so the coaches have time to set the offensive plan accordingly. Let the wagering begin. (insider info: I have thighs like tree trunks)

Goon, please come to the Still Hares tomorrow at 11am! I will take the bets.

[Justwin]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

And for us to discuss!

....and we shall....that's what fans do...IMO most of us agree we have 2 QB's that are very DIFFERENT from each other. I would agree with SF Rabbitt that TC didn't have the Presence of mind to throw the ball at the end of the half but our coaching staff didn't have the presence of mind to not call that play either. Now before you all jump on me for coach bashing that is not my point. Players need to be put in a position to be successful. I would hope the type of offense we implement would be quite different depending on TC or Zach as QB. TC is a very new Style QB for us at SDSU and to our offensive scheme. One argument I tend to differ with most on is about playing a true freshman. Players have to be freshman sometime. You can't simulate game experience in practice. Your going to have growing pains with inexperienced players, just the way it works.

[sfjacksfan99]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

Seems like there was one game last year when Lujan sort of lost it, and they put Tyler in for one series and he was more surprised than all the fans together as he did not do well as I recall. Poor guy, I understand he was a real good QB in high school and would do good if he got his chance other than a surprise chance. I guess I tire of all the pros and cons of Lujan and TC.

Misery State. Lujan was a wreck out of the gate. Finnes came in and promptly threw a pick that either got returned for a TD or was very close. Lujan came back in and was much more settled and we came back and won. I think we were down 21 before anyone's buzz wore off.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

....and we shall....that's what fans do...IMO most of us agree we have 2 QB's that are very DIFFERENT from each other. I would agree with SF Rabbitt that TC didn't have the Presence of mind to throw the ball at the end of the half but our coaching staff didn't have the presence of mind to not call that play either. Now before you all jump on me for coach bashing that is not my point. Players need to be put in a position to be successful. I would hope the type of offense we implement would be quite different depending on TC or Zach as QB. TC is a very new Style QB for us at SDSU and to our offensive scheme. One argument I tend to differ with most on is about playing a true freshman. Players have to be freshman sometime. You can't simulate game experience in practice. Your going to have growing pains with inexperienced players, just the way it works.

The point being, with Lujan they don't have to worry about holding the QB's hand through that situation because he has more experience. Call that exact same play in that exact same situation, and Lujan probably makes the right decision every time.

Some have downplayed Zach starting 10 games at SDSU, but he also played in 11 JUCO games. That experience is worth something, and TC doesn't have that yet. TC does bring things to the game that Zach doesn't too.

Bottom line, we want to go 1-0 on Saturday. I hope the coaches make the right decision and we meet that goal.

The good news is, if we end up losing we can all meet here to talk about how we were right/wrong all along!

[CappinHard]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

we can all meet here

Idk about you, but win or lose, I'll be downtown.

[Jacks-02]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

Keep in mind that Christion missed a few series in his first start due to cramping up and also missed the first two series against UNI due to Lujan getting the start, so he didn't even play 3 complete games compared to the 7 games for the running backs. He is averaging 78 yards a game and leading the team in YPC.

Jacks Rushing Stats.jpg

Now, here are the passing stats. He is completing a very impressive 65% of his passes with zero interceptions and has the highest passing efficiency

Jacks Passing Stats.png


I don't really see how there can be a question as to who is the better offensive threat to lead our offense.

[tck9199]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

Keep in mind that Christion missed a few series in his first start due to cramping up and also missed the first two series against UNI due to Lujan getting the start, so he didn't even play 3 complete games compared to the 7 games for the running backs. He is averaging 78 yards a game and leading the team in YPC.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]716[/ATTACH]

Now, here are the passing stats. He is completing a very impressive 65% of his passes with zero interceptions and has the highest passing efficiency

[ATTACH=CONFIG]717[/ATTACH]


I don't really see how there can be a question as to who is the better offensive threat to lead our offense.

Understand your point but not an accurate comparison with the running backs. They have shared time all through the year and Wallace hasn't played more then one snap since Ndsu. Where the qbs for the most part are getting complete games. Now comparing his net running to Lujan is heads and shoulders difference. I would like to see the comparison of down field completions between the two qbs (not yd after catch) I have to believe lujan has taken more shots downfield so naturally his percentage will be lower. Problem with most stats is you can make them show pretty much anything you want if you leave an incomplete picture.

[Jackedforlife]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

Understand your point but not an accurate comparison with the running backs. They have shared time all through the year and Wallace hasn't played more then one snap since Ndsu. Where the qbs for the most part are getting complete games. Now comparing his net running to Lujan is heads and shoulders difference. I would like to see the comparison of down field completions between the two qbs (not yd after catch) I have to believe lujan has taken more shots downfield so naturally his percentage will be lower. Problem with most stats is you can make them show pretty much anything you want if you leave an incomplete picture.

Your last statement is probably the most truthful one on this board. Yes you can skew some stats to make this guy look better or give an edge in some way. Unfortunately for you I believe you've made an even stronger case as to why TC is and should be the starter. If you think YAC has nothing to do with the QB and that's why you want to compare downfield stats, you are mistaken. The QB throwing a guy open or hitting him in stride is such an integral part of YAC. Sure WR's deserve a lot of credit but to infer(if that's what you're doing) that TC is lucky cause the WR's do all the work in YAC, yikes. To say Lujan is a better downfield passer is a dangerous statement. He may have better touch as of now but hard to be a downfield thrower when you have no time and you're not a mobile QB. Now if anyone has a ? on whether TC can chuck it downfield reference the throw to Cam Jones, 3rd and long against IN St on the run along the sideline. Downfield, accurate, frozen rope and threw his guy open with no chance of an interception

[tck9199]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

Your last statement is probably the most truthful one on this board. Yes you can skew some stats to make this guy look better or give an edge in some way. Unfortunately for you I believe you've made an even stronger case as to why TC is and should be the starter. If you think YAC has nothing to do with the QB and that's why you want to compare downfield stats, you are mistaken. The QB throwing a guy open or hitting him in stride is such an integral part of YAC. Sure WR's deserve a lot of credit but to infer(if that's what you're doing) that TC is lucky cause the WR's do all the work in YAC, yikes. To say Lujan is a better downfield passer is a dangerous statement. He may have better touch as of now but hard to be a downfield thrower when you have no time and you're not a mobile QB. Now if anyone has a ? on whether TC can chuck it downfield reference the throw to Cam Jones, 3rd and long IN St.

Actually not saying either is better just curious as to what the stats are. The bubble screen worked great yesterday coming out of half (not sure why we stopped after the first series which we scored) thing you are right in that the qb has to read that but a lot of the work of the screen itself is done by the receiver (although that's not my point). I'm sure it's a higher percentage completion then a downfield throw but really I don't know if I have ever seen that stat tracked. Just more curiosity then to say it should make a difference. And for the record I think TC should start just because of the extra dimension he brings.

[Jacks-02]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

Understand your point but not an accurate comparison with the running backs. They have shared time all through the year and Wallace hasn't played more then one snap since Ndsu. Where the qbs for the most part are getting complete games. Now comparing his net running to Lujan is heads and shoulders difference. I would like to see the comparison of down field completions between the two qbs (not yd after catch) I have to believe lujan has taken more shots downfield so naturally his percentage will be lower. Problem with most stats is you can make them show pretty much anything you want if you leave an incomplete picture.

You may have a bit of a point in the yards per game metric due to split carries from the backs, but Christion is also leading by a fair amount in yards per carry, and is doing so despite having -57 yards against him from sacks.

[Mathews Refugee]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

In my opinion, Lujan should have been the starter last week, and should have played the whole game. It was a tremendous miscalculation by the coaching staff. The redshirt shouldn't have been pulled in the first place. Stig created this monster. Lujan has performed well all year, unless someone were deluded into thinking NDSU was the qb's fault. Stig has shown he has zero regard for any of the other backups. I think this staff has taken this team off the rails in some vain effort to appease those that were hurt by another NDSU loss. I don't think we have a better team now than we did the Monday after that loss. As for the rest of the year, I think they have to finish doing to Lujan what they started, and cut him out of the picture. Why go halfway? How much confidence could he have now? A 3-and-out and you're grabbing pine anyway. Very few coaches worth a hoot platooned quarterbacks successfully, and Stig won't either.

[OldHare]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

Do know that Lujan was 100% on Saturday? The dialogue on the QB is nearing the wornout stage. It is easy to see that the current scheme used for the OL is not working for either QB or any of the running backs. It goes back to Stig indicating that the coaching has been needing some tweaking. Or it might be the preseason poll was more accurate than we like to acknowledge and we have a slot in the fifth place of the conference. The bison game was not close, but the UNI game had some opportunities for the win which coulda, shoulda, woulda made the win a reality. The 15 yard penalty on the bench belongs to the coaches after they saw the warning across the field. We can hope that the coaching staff will get this <team> ready to perform the rest of the year. Go Jacks!!

[Hareofthedog]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

Offensive struggles are directly related to trying a two QB system. Sharing time in practice doesn't work. Oline needs consistent voice, cadence and rhythm from the QB. False starts can be the results of changing QBs. TC must be louder in his cadence if necessary. Probably wasn't an issue in hs ball and probably never used a silent cadence in hs ball. All offensive players must pickup the QB cadence no matter who it is but please make it one QB to get off on the ball that split second before the defense. No more false starts will result then.

[OldHare]

Re: Lujan or Christion?

http://www.argusleader.com/story/mat...sdsu/75040774/