Grass v Turf

[NoVaJack]

Re: Grass v Turf

The problem is that, because of the agreement, the HS no longer has another viable option to play their home games. I seem to remember being at Bob Sheldon for football games when we would come to town in high school. Hasn't the Bob now been converted to a strictly baseball venue? Of course, SDSU repaying the cost of the lights to the BHS may allow them to turn it back into a FB/BB field.

I think a problem bigger than a HS team playing on the field is having a natural surface in the climate we have. Does anyone really expect natural grass to look decent at the end of October and into November? The grounds crew struggles to keep it green in the Spring and Summer.

Actually, yeah, I do, at a land grant university with aspirations of world-class plant science and research... Consider it a challenge for a university that helped double per acre dryland grain production over a generation. I'm with the real grass crowd. What's next, artificial cows?

[RabbitObsessed]

Re: Grass v Turf

Turf is going to happen. Might as well accept it.

[rabbits64]

Re: Grass v Turf

I honestly don't see the issue of turf. If Ohio State, Wisconsin, Michigan, Nebraska, etc all have field turf I think it is OK for SDSU to have it. I live in Wisconsin, follow the Badgers very close, not once have I ever heard a player, coach or fan complaining about turf.
Before you all go crazy on me for saying it, I realize that keeping grass would be the ideal situation. But would do we ever want the field to be a determining factor of SDSU hosting a playoff game or not? I could see the NCAA not giving us a game if our field is torn up. Save your money for donations towards a new grandstand, that is what is needed more than keeping grass.

[jackmd]

Re: Grass v Turf

Without going crazy on you I am going to make a couple of points:

Artificial turf will be more expensive than natural grass both immediately and in the long term so it won't save any money to convert to artificial turf. The situations leading to artificial turf being installed at those other schools may not necessarily apply to the situation at SDSU.

Point being, artificial turf is not going to be the solution to our climate, the new stadium, nor is it going to propel us to the next level. It may not be any better than our current grass field with the exception of playability in certain conditions. Is it likely that SDSU will play on an artificial surface in the near future? We don't know that.

[RabbitObsessed]

Re: Grass v Turf

Without going crazy on you I am going to make a couple of points:

Artificial turf will be more expensive than natural grass both immediately and in the long term so it won't save any money to convert to artificial turf. The situations leading to artificial turf being installed at those other schools may not necessarily apply to the situation at SDSU.

Point being, artificial turf is not going to be the solution to our climate, the new stadium, nor is it going to propel us to the next level. It may not be any better than our current grass field with the exception of playability in certain conditions. Is it likely that SDSU will play on an artificial surface in the near future? We don't know that.

Which doesn't change the fact that the AD said that it will happen.

:/

[bigticket1]

Re: Grass v Turf

There are a number of ways to gain a home field advantage. Most people automatically think of big crowds making lots of noise that disrupts/intimidates the opposing team. But being one of the few teams with a grass field may provide just as much of a home field advantage. Even in good conditions,there is the advantage of getting in the other teams heads about whether they are wearing the right length of cleats,etc... It is much easier for the Jacks to adjust from going from grass at home to turf on the road than it is for road teams that play all their other games on turf to get prepared to play on grass. Also,if we don't have as much team speed as the opposition (which is often the case),a grass field lessens that disadvantage.

[GoJacks]

Re: Grass v Turf

Without going crazy on you I am going to make a couple of points:

Artificial turf will be more expensive than natural grass both immediately and in the long term so it won't save any money to convert to artificial turf. The situations leading to artificial turf being installed at those other schools may not necessarily apply to the situation at SDSU.

Point being, artificial turf is not going to be the solution to our climate, the new stadium, nor is it going to propel us to the next level. It may not be any better than our current grass field with the exception of playability in certain conditions. Is it likely that SDSU will play on an artificial surface in the near future? We don't know that.

I am not convinced that artificial turf is more expensive than expensive than grass. I am convinced that having a facility with artificial turf has the ability to host more events that should bring additional income. I would assume revenue would come through facility rentals, concessions, advertising (signage), sur charges for luxury boxes and suits and SDSU apparel. The additional events also brings more exposure to SDSU, gets people in town and on campus. Which creates the leverage for SDSU adminstrators to ask and receive more money for corporate sponsorships, and leverage others that these events and facilites are good for the Brookings, SDSU and South Dakota. For every event that comes to Brookings, SDSU should have the facility to host the event IMO. To me this is important in getting people on campus and hopefully looking at SDSU as an option for education, entertainment and giving.

Of course if I would have the money to fund a facility I would fund a 22,000 seat track. I wouldn't be apposed to allowing SDSU to host additional events in the stadium either. This way SDSU could play football/ soccer on the field on it as well. But I like the idea of getting the most out of my money and being practical with it and in this case giving multiple user groups (SDSU sports) to benefit from the facility. Similar to how the proposed indoor facility will and Frost Arena is currently shared.

[NightHawk78]

Re: Grass v Turf

There is no doubt the future at CAS is Field Turf. AD Sell has said so. It's going to happen.

Which may still be 10 years away (see Wellness Center and Phase II of the PAC for long-awaited project histories). Given the variable tenure of college ADs, it's possible that Sell's successor will end up making the final call on the future playing field of CAS.

Field Turf would be VERY useful IF the new CAS was used for more events than the 9-10 events per year CAS sees now. Until then, the grass and turf gurus on campus should work to make the grass field at CAS as consistent and reliable as possible.

[KUlawJack]

Re: Grass v Turf

I am not convinced that artificial turf is more expensive than expensive than grass. I am convinced that having a facility with artificial turf has the ability to host more events that should bring additional income. I would assume revenue would come through facility rentals, concessions, advertising (signage), sur charges for luxury boxes and suits and SDSU apparel. The additional events also brings more exposure to SDSU, gets people in town and on campus. Which creates the leverage for SDSU adminstrators to ask and receive more money for corporate sponsorships, and leverage others that these events and facilites are good for the Brookings, SDSU and South Dakota. For every event that comes to Brookings, SDSU should have the facility to host the event IMO. To me this is important in getting people on campus and hopefully looking at SDSU as an option for education, entertainment and giving.

Of course if I would have the money to fund a facility I would fund a 22,000 seat track. I wouldn't be apposed to allowing SDSU to host additional events in the stadium either. This way SDSU could play football/ soccer on the field on it as well. But I like the idea of getting the most out of my money and being practical with it and in this case giving multiple user groups (SDSU sports) to benefit from the facility. Similar to how the proposed indoor facility will and Frost Arena is currently shared.

Just curious, what types of events are you talking about hosting? There is no way do we play football and soccer on the same field either, its just not going to happen.

[Nidaros]

Re: Grass v Turf

Actually, yeah, I do, at a land grant university with aspirations of world-class plant science and research... Consider it a challenge for a university that helped double per acre dryland grain production over a generation. I'm with the real grass crowd. What's next, artificial cows?

Yeah soy milk from soybeans.

[TK22867]

Re: Grass v Turf

I'm pretty much indifferent when it comes to grass vs. turf so you folks have at it.

One thing I'll add is look what is happening to my beloved Bears. They are one of the last holdouts in the NFL to keep natural grass, especially in a Northern climate like ours. They had to cancel "Family Night" at Soldier Field last week because the turf seams started coming apart and they weren't going to let the players play on it for fear of injury. Something about not getting enough water during the recent heat spell or something. I believe the same seam issue happened with some artificial turf a few years ago at a Ravens game. Preseason I believe? Regardless, Mr. Urlacher was none too pleased of the cancellation and felt pretty bad for the fans.

Now if the Soldier Field sod gurus whose sole job in life is to get that field ready for play in tip-top condition can't get it done, imagine how difficult it must be for the folks up at SDSU to manage the field among their other responsibilities, especially with a BHS game on Friday night in potentially wet conditions.

I'm not sayin', but I'm sayin'.

I will second the statement by Others that whether or you like it or not, we will end up with field turf in the new stadium, whenever that happens. You can take that to the bank.

[SoDakJack]

Re: Grass v Turf

Actually, yeah, I do, at a land grant university with aspirations of world-class plant science and research... Consider it a challenge for a university that helped double per acre dryland grain production over a generation. I'm with the real grass crowd. What's next, artificial cows?

Perhaps the research has shown that developing a sod that can with-stand college athletes, in cleats, running on it for 2-3 hours every Saturday during the fall and winter isn't possible.

[Nidaros]

Re: Grass v Turf

I would hope we find some ways to do drainage and lower the water table at CAS so that the new staduim might be lowered into the ground. It would make for better wind breaks in late November and would also give way to additional seating. I was at Washington Staduim at U of Montana in 1993 and 1988 and was impressed with their staduim but they have the luxury of hills to build into the side. I have not seen their staduim recently. The water table at CAS is a bigger problem than choosing between grass and turf in my opinion.

[SoDakJack]

Re: Grass v Turf

I would hope we find some ways to do drainage and lower the water table at CAS so that the new staduim might be lowered into the ground. It would make for better wind breaks in late November and would also give way to additional seating. I was at Washington Staduim at U of Montana in 1993 and 1988 and was impressed with their staduim but they have the luxury of hills to build into the side. I have not seen their staduim recently. The water table at CAS is a bigger problem than choosing between grass and turf in my opinion.

I would agree that the water table is a huge problem. There is a good reason why the construction on campus has, to a great extent, avoided that area. I think the cost of lowering the stands to the point that would allow a good windbreak would probably double the cost of whatever a new stadium would be.

I don't know what the exact water level is at the CAS site, but I have heard that holes 4-6 feet deep were filling with water in areas of Brookings that are much higher that the stadium.

[jacksfaninne]

Re: Grass v Turf

There is no doubt the future at CAS is Field Turf. AD Sell has said so. It's going to happen.

Unless ... someone walks into Sell's office and offers to write a $25 million check, with the stipulation that the new CAS have a natural-grass playing surface forever, or until we go BCS, whichever comes first. That might sway him.