ORU talking with Southland

[zooropa]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

until there are 4 major conferences each with at least 16 schools

I don't believe it. This would require collusion or some coordination of effort, and these commissioners don't trust each other far enough to do this.

I don't think you'll see a major restructure of FBS, because none of the bowls want to give up the shot of landing the occasional down-on-its-luck yet high profile BCS program. Nor do the BCS conferences want to give up the appearance money generated by some of the more popular non-BCS bowls.

I just don't see a scenario where SDSU moves to an all sports conference with, say, Iowa State. Nor do I think that the Summit is anywhere near being a multiple bid conference in MBB.

Finally, to the persistent notion that schools may be unhappy having a tournament in SF: One of the things that Douple has mentioned in the past is that the conference wants its tournaments to feel like tournaments. When you look at attendance figures and realize that there is a significant gap between SF/Tulsa and everyone else, it becomes clear that a Summit tournament in, oh, say, Fort Wayne would lack the 'tournament' atmosphere that SF is able to present.

The venue/city/conference all need to have some balance; a major conference tournament in SF at the Arena would be ridiculous, but it would be ridiculous as well to stage a mid-major tournament in a major metro in a major-league venue like Conseco or Auburn Hills.

I think most of the university presidents understand this and understand that the best way to strengthen the Summit is by raising the stature of their schools, so that they can legitimately challenge the apparent stranglehold that SF has on the BB tournament.

If Oakland/IPFW/IUPUI raise the stature of their programs such that an Oakland/IUPUI championship match would draw 10k+ to the Palace or Conseco, that's great for the entire conference, including SDSU. In such a scenario, SF, Omaha, Detroit, Fort Wayne and Indianapolis should be engaged in a bidding war for the tournament.

But rotating the tournament away from a popular, well supported, profitable venue in order to lose money and publicity, and reinforce the league's 'second tier' status.... (Nothing would do that better than having the Detroit Free Press or Indy Star give significant coverage to a Big Ten tournament in Chicago, while relegating the Summit tournament in the city itself to a blurb on the sports section front page, if not worse).

[LakeJack]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

The money it generates doesn't come close to having the tournament in or close to their respective schools. It is great the tournament makes money in SF but if having it there constantly is a problem for other members in the league it is the conference's job to balance things out.

Since the Presidents of the member schools are the ones who voted to accept SF bid, I will respectfully disagree with you.

[filbert]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

If the conference realignment moves shake all the way down to the Valley, it's possible that SDSU might be a Valley candidate. An awful lot of dominoes need to fall before that happens--if it ever does happen.

We need to concentrate on making the Summit the strongest league we can--mainly because we don't have a heck of a lot of other reasonable options.

[zooropa]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

awful lot of dominoes

IMO, it would require a Bradley or an Evansville to accept an invite into the Horizon. Which would require a Horizon member being invited into the Big East 2.0, or the A10 2.0. It would also require that UMKC and WIU remain sort of spotty competitors in the Summit, as they're better fits into the Valley footprint. Also, SLU would have to be unavailable, either because it's already in the Valley or because they don't want to be in the Valley.

If all that happens, I think the breadth of SDSU's athletic program and its comparative strength might get it a bit of a sniff, provided the Valley doesn't mind bringing in a basketball school with a smaller arena.

[jackmd]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

We need to concentrate on making the Summit the strongest league we can--mainly because we don't have a heck of a lot of other reasonable options.

This is obvious but limited by what SDSU can actually control and what decisions at the conference level can be influenced. I don't think anybody at Kansas was worried about needing to find a new conference 5 years ago and right now, issues largely out of their control, are forcing a major reconsideration of their position.

[LakeJack]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

I seem to remember that Lamar and Stephen F. Austin from the Southland Conference were also linked to WAC expansion rumors. The Southland could have a whole new look before it is all said and done. One might expect that UT-Pan American, and Houston Baptist might also be getting looks from the Southland. They are also going to need more football playing schools, so I assume they will be looking at some of the D-II schools in Texas and Oklahoma.

[joeboo22]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

When it comes to the BBall tourny its all about money. That is the way the conference rules are setup. I think Oral Roberts wants the Summit League to commit to the South. I think they want 1 team in the South added. If I'm the Summit I'm looking at those options.

As far as moving up? I just don't know why SDSU would want to, The MVC has declined a lot in the past 2-3 years. The NCAA and the public found out that they weren't quite as good as their RPI's made them look. On top of that if SDSU and NDSU join the MVC they will be bottom feeders, the closest the tourny would be is Omaha with Kansas City and St. Louis being more common. I think the best thing for SDSU/NDSU is to make the Summit League stable. Getting rid of SUU and Century and replacing them with USD and UNO were good moves.

[Kemo]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

When it comes to the BBall tourny its all about money. That is the way the conference rules are setup. I think Oral Roberts wants the Summit League to commit to the South. I think they want 1 team in the South added. If I'm the Summit I'm looking at those options.

As far as moving up? I just don't know why SDSU would want to, The MVC has declined a lot in the past 2-3 years. The NCAA and the public found out that they weren't quite as good as their RPI's made them look. On top of that if SDSU and NDSU join the MVC they will be bottom feeders, the closest the tourny would be is Omaha with Kansas City and St. Louis being more common. I think the best thing for SDSU/NDSU is to make the Summit League stable. Getting rid of SUU and Century and replacing them with USD and UNO were good moves.

A stable Summit League is what SDSU/NDSU should be striving for currently, but don't kid yourself if you think SDSU wouldn't jump at the opportunity to join the MVC if they were offered. The MVC has a better RPI in almost every sport than the Summit League and would bring in regional schools with name recognition such as UNI, Creighton, and Drake (teams also located in our recruiting footprints) plus non regional teams that have established name recognition in the Dakotas based on the xDSU's playing them in football (ISU-Birds, ISU-Trees, SIU, Missouri State).

[JimmyJack]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

ORU board thread on the topic: http://forum.orusports.com/index.php...nd-conference/

My take: Big step up for their baseball program. And they'll dominate in basketball.

[FargoBison]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

When it comes to the BBall tourny its all about money. That is the way the conference rules are setup. I think Oral Roberts wants the Summit League to commit to the South. I think they want 1 team in the South added. If I'm the Summit I'm looking at those options.

We could add Houston Baptist(they have interest in the Summit) and NKU(ideal) or Mankato(back up). Of course if that happens divisions wouldn't really work geographically and HBU would kind of be an outlier.

[goon]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

I seem to remember that Lamar and Stephen F. Austin from the Southland Conference were also linked to WAC expansion rumors. The Southland could have a whole new look before it is all said and done. One might expect that UT-Pan American, and Houston Baptist might also be getting looks from the Southland. They are also going to need more football playing schools, so I assume they will be looking at some of the D-II schools in Texas and Oklahoma.

Sorry, this is a bit of topic, isnt Lamar one of the (tri Lambs) Lambda lambda lambda, with the limp wrist javelin thrower in revenge of the nerds? Sorry, its been a long day at work.

Frankly I dont see the summit suffering if ORU leaves. IF anything gives SDSU a better chance at making the baseball tourney and basketall also. Not that we want it with weaker teams but if ORU leaves and UNO comes to the summit basketball tourny, there will be a bigger connection with local fans with UNO and USD then Oral bob.

[SturgisJeff]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

.... (Nothing would do that better than having the Detroit Free Press or Indy Star give significant coverage to a Big Ten tournament in Chicago, while relegating the Summit tournament in the city itself to a blurb on the sports section front page, if not worse).

About the only time you see anything about Oakland U in the Free Press is the preseason roundup of local teams, if they play Michign or Michigan State, or if they make the NCAA Tournament. Other than that they are a nonentity in that paper other than the little print at the end of a story where they list players of the week.

[zooropa]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

I wonder if UNO fans would outnumber ORU fans at a SF tournament.....

[jacksfan29]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

.... (Nothing would do that better than having the Detroit Free Press or Indy Star give significant coverage to a Big Ten tournament in Chicago, while relegating the Summit tournament in the city itself to a blurb on the sports section front page, if not worse).

About the only time you see anything about Oakland U in the Free Press is the preseason roundup of local teams, if they play Michign or Michigan State, or if they make the NCAA Tournament. Other than that they are a nonentity in that paper other than the little print at the end of a story where they list players of the week.

Or the second page in Tulsa. The reality, is having spent time in Tulsa and on ORU's campus (relatives attended) most of Tulsa could care less about ORU. I have to wonder, is ORU's looking to leave have everything to do with money? Son of Oral used the school as his own piggy bank and put them in serious jeopardy of closing the doors. Are we sure they are on solid footing?

[Prairiehaas]

Re: ORU talking with Southland

Hoping ORU doesn't leave the Summit. Loosing a leading program is not good news. Realistically, IMHO, there will be other member(s) leaving both the Summit and MVFC. Other neighboring conferences will also be loosing/gaining members as the college athletics landscape changes, pretty obvious statements.

I do hope that the SDSU administration doesn't view a Summit that looks more like a D1 NCC as a security against these changes. There are certainly advantages to a restructured NCC in terms of cost. But, I fear that D1 NCC might become an island again and contribute an inertia against improvement of SDSU athletics and SDSU in general. The coming realignments just might present opportunity for SDSU to bigger and better things outside the Summit and MVFC.