What's wrong with the men's team?

[SDSUFAN]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

I think I have cooled down now. Apparently there are some on this board much more frustrated with the men bb team, then I am. To quote Stuart Smiley(Al Franken SLN) " And Thats okay, I am smart ........... and dog gone it people like me." ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

I suppose I am a rubber stamp and also guilty of a rose colored glasses view of the program. That said, I dont have any problem sleeping. I am not being evaluated on the progress of the BB program, so I can't lose a job I don't have. I can't be fired for bad recruiting since I don't have that duty assigned to me. All I have to do is show up and watch the games. ;D

I do think MJA comment about frustration applies namely he said something to the effect that if we feel frustrated what do you suppose our coaches feel? I am sure if anyone is losing sleep at night, it probably Coach Nagy, Wilber and Cunningham. Their bathrooms are probably well stocked with  PM over the counter medicine.  

My lady friend, who knows little about sports, but has had an ear to the WNAX post game show where Scott Nagy has blamed himself for not having the kids ready to play. My friend thinks Coach is being hard on himself and she wonders when the kids are going to be blamed for what they are not doing. She seems to feel the players are culpable at some point and I agree.
Nagy made a comment Saturday about maybe some of these kids should go somewhere else if they can not shed this shadow of fear. I agree. The ball is in the players court and not the coaches. Its up to these guys and if they develop as some on this board think they will then time will take care of fear problem. ;D

MJA, the Marquette game had to be a painful one to watch, and I am glad I dont live in or near Milwaukee, as I too would have been there to watch.

[CatchEmAll]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

13 is the NCAA max for Men's teams, and I think we are at 13.

Go State!  ;D

Since my time here is limited (unless a miracle happens on the 8th), I thought I should chime in while I can. I haven't studied the roster, or for that matter listened to more than a few minutes of a game nor attended a game yet this year, but I would have to think Scott has banked at least one scholarship for next year. Would also assume that atleast one scholarship player won't return for whatever reason (personal, injury, grades). So the scholarship situation for next year shouldn't be assumed to be zero. Nagy wouldn't do that to himself.

This thread has been very entertaining to read. Way to stir things up SF_Rabbit. Lots of fun.

[89rabbit]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

Since my time here is limited (unless a miracle happens on the 8th), I thought I should chime in while I can.  I haven't studied the roster, or for that matter listened to more than a few minutes of a game nor attended a game yet this year, but I would have to think Scott has banked at least one scholarship for next year. Would also assume that atleast one scholarship player won't return for whatever reason (personal, injury, grades). So the scholarship situation for next year shouldn't be assumed to be zero. Nagy wouldn't do that to himself.

Agreed, what I was trying to get across is that I believe the Men's program is fully funded at 13 scholarship, not that we necessarily have 13 scholarship athletes on this years team. Sorry for the confusion.

Go State! ;D

[CatchEmAll]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

I just picked your post to quote as it was the last one addressing the scholarship #'s, wasn't implying you were trying to make any point. Sorry for any confusion.

[ballz]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

I have to agree that we need to give this team some more time to develop. Our great D-II the last couple of years were made out of a large group of veterans, and that will take time to replace.

That said, our coaches knew what we had going into the season. What was the point of scheduling like this? Before the season started what did everyone anticipate our record as being right now? Two wins at the most. We're not going to beat Kentucky, Illinois etc. with two redshirt freshman in the line up. If they had that capability they wouldn't being playing for us, they would be in the Big 10. I think the coaching staff errored with the scheduling. Look at NDSU's season so far. Their record is the same as ours, but if we had their schedule, we would probably have 3 or 4 wins already, and the younger players would be gaining confidence. Instead we're playing a tougher schedule than most other teams in the nation, and we're getting setup for deafet before the season even started. We need to tone the schedule down in the next couple of years.

[Rabbitden]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

I am finally going to jump in here with my two-cents.

First of all the staff schedules whats available and if you look back at some of the athletes remarks as far as why they chose to attend SDSU, it was because of these games scheduled.

We are young...very young, we could get away with this on the DivII level but it is just not going to happen at the DivI level.  There is a major difference as far as a talent scale jumping these divisions in mens BB as compared to womens.

USD men got beat by Morningside last night at Vermillion, did our young squad? No...we do have a very talented but YOUNG squad.

The athletes (I state ATHLETES) we have right now are some of the most talented players we have ever had, if they do not pan out they will be gone.  The staff has proven this in years past.

Lets all quit being La-Z-Boy coaches and let the staff handle this.  Some of you are expecting miracles over night and its just not going to happen in Mens Div I BB.

We all want this to be the cinderella team from the midwest...it just might be.  Dont fool yourselves though, it aint happening this year and probably not next...the future is bright though.

What these boys need right now as well as our girls is the support we can give them by going to the games...cheering for them and feeling their pain when things dont go as good as we would like.

Last comment...as far as the coach yelling and screaming at the players?  Whats new, you are getting a great education for free for your abilities as an athlete.  If you are not performing up to those expectations you deserve a tounge lashing once and awhile.

I wish some of you could be a fly on the wall when Mr. Nagy has these individuals on a one-on-one conference in his office.  He genually cares about all aspects of these individuals lives.

Remember that some of the most genuine critisism is truely a compliment in disquise.  ( In other words...we some times knock down those that have potential because we know they have much more inside them).

I feel better...GO JACKS!

P.S.

I like peanut butter and banana sandwiches. ;D

[OK_Jackrabbit]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

Lets all quit being lazyboy coaches and let the staff handle this.  

I agree with everything you wrote except that. This is a discussion board. The entire premise of an athletics discussion board is that we get to be La-Z-Boy coaches. We have a saying in academia that refers to how faculty members fight and complain about everything all the time: The fights are so bitter because the stakes are so low.

I'd say the stakes here are pretty low. No coach is going to lose his or her job because of anything anyone says here. No player is going to have a crisis of confidence because somebody posted on a bulletin board that he or she isn't playing well. It's a discussion board. Let's discuss and disagree (openly and honestly) and not worry about the implications outside of this board. And let's do so without being disagreeable.

Again, I agree with everything else you said, RabbitDen, and I appreciate you and every other poster who takes the time to write. I'm sure I'm not the only one here who enjoys the discussion on this bulletin board.

[Rabbitden]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

OK_Jackrabbit,

Thanks for the correction on La-Z-Boy.  The point I was trying to get across was this:
"What these boys need right now as well as our girls is the support we can give them by going to the games...cheering for them and feeling their pain when things dont go as good as we would like."

Maybe I should of started my comment like that? I didnt think I was implying anyone would lose their job over things said on this board.

GO JACKS!

[SDSUFAN]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

Rabbitden:
Your comments are right on, and you are not rubber stamping nor are you viewing through rose colored glasses, only the glasses of factual reality. Perhaps you are 20/20 in that case no glasses at all.  ;D

[OK_Jackrabbit]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

OK_Jackrabbit,

Thanks for the correction on La-Z-Boy.  The point I was trying to get across was this:
"What these boys need right now as well as our girls is the support we can give them by going to the games...cheering for them and feeling their pain when things dont go as good as we would like."

Maybe I should of started my comment like that? I didnt think I was implying anyone would lose their job over things said on this board.

GO JACKS!

Sorry, I should have been more clear. I know you weren't trying to silence anybody or suggest anything terrible would happen because of what people say here. I was just reiterating a point several have made in this thread. Again, I think your post was right on target.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

I'm not saying yelling is not a good motivational technique. It can be. However, any human relations study will tell you that criticism is a motivator only until the one being criticized loses trust of the person giving the criticism. Then it just leads to loss of self confidence, which I think is what the team is going through.

rabbitden stated that what the teams need is our support. I couldn't agree more, which is why I will continue to attend games and cheer for all I'm worth.

I think rabbitden would also agree that the players need support from the coaching staff as well. Like I said, the coaches are with the players for a number of hours every day. They should be instilling confidence through positive reinforcement at least some of that time.

[JACKGUYII]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

I think Nagy and his staff understand the players and their individual personalities well enough to know how to motivate them. I think they have the good coach/bad coach role down. There is a more humanstic side to Nagy that isn't seen on the court or in a interview after the game.

[Rabbitden]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

SF_Rabbit_Fan,

I may be misunderstanding you but I think your trying to make more out of something than it should. Like I said in my post, Mr. Nagy has a genuine care for these men...he doesnt always show it in public but it is there.

GO JACKS!

[SDSUFAN]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

SF_Rabbit_Fan,

I may be misunderstanding you but I think your trying to make more out of something than it should.  Like I said in my post,  Mr. Nagy has a genuine care for these men...he doesnt always show it in public but it is there.

GO JACKS!

This is what I have always heard too from different sources.

I do recall several years back the Argus did a feature article on Nagy's weekly visits.  He does care, but at the same time, he recognizes the need in overall progress of the program. I think he knows where to draw the line between hand holding and using the number eleven size shoe. I suspect Coach wears at least an eleven.

[Jacks#1Fan]

Re: What's wrong with the men's team?

I would assume everybody is getting worn out on this post, with both ends covered heavily...but better late than never as I just got to read this section on the board.
I have to laugh at some of the negative things said about Coach Nagy...when I recall how the big buzz around our opponents for years was "you'll never keep him, he will be gone in a couple of years."
And now to reiterate some answers (not rosy-colored) to a lot of posts here and on other sections:
1) I think it is way off base to say this is a bad D-II team. Never in the NCC did we play with as young a team and as disparate a team (jcs, transfers, redshirts) as this year. Why not -- because we could recruit the players to play at that level, and we always had junior and senior leadership moving up the ranks each year.
Now we are recruiting players for a different level, and Steve Holdren (who's now out for the year), would be our first "D-1 senior leader) except that he's a sophomore -- and hopefully will be next year also.
2) The schedule is the schedule is the schedule and yes to three things: Yes we are playing over our heads in many cases, considering the youthfulness of our team, but the poster who noted that we recruit based on playing good teams was right on. Yes, it would be nice to schedule some teams we could beat -- but remember this is pre-conference season and those teams have had long commitments for this time of year. And yes, we have too many games in November and December -- but what else do you suggest. Without a conference, we have to play a lot of games in these two months to get our 25 games against D-1 opponents. 3) Congratulations are due in my (rose colored) view to the coaches who are trying to recruit up a level as fast as they can (do fans just assume that Scott and Troy can walk into homes and get the best players for D-1 when we don't have a conference, have to play a large number of road games, can't qualify for the big dance for several more years?) And congratulations for making the schedule work, which is not easy during transition (knowing deep down they will be asking a lot of their young players), and for beating Northern Colorado, which is a year ahead of us in transition, and for beating Morningside, which just beat our old NCC foes, USD.
Finally, and I know this is long, but a plea to everybody to keep their cool for the rest of this year. As Nagy said, "we're not pulling the redshirts", so this is the team you will have. That doesn't mean posters can post negative comments, but let's keep them to a justifiable and decent level -- beyond that it seems like the smack board is a better place to be.