Brand Name Games

[zooropa]

Re: Brand Name Games

The Gophers would never come to Frost Arena or even the SF Arena for a game. They sell their tickets for $40-50 a ticket, and can seat 12-15,000 fans. That is a lot of lost revenue plus you don't see BCS schools coming to mid-major programs.

Mizzou went to the Mabee and lost this year.

[SturgisJeff]

Re: Brand Name Games

13 games with the Gophers and all in Minnesota. Nope don't expect to see the gophers in Brookings anytime soon.

[CatchEmAll]

Re: Brand Name Games

Until SDSU's men are consistently in the Top 25 and have made multiple tournament appearances and made a run to the sweet 16 you will not see a BCS level school in Frost arena...unless they are playing the women's team.

[rcjacks]

Re: Brand Name Games

Mizzou went to the Mabee and lost this year.

Well, I shouldn't have painted with such a broad stroke. I stand by the first part where I say you won't see Minnesota at Frost or the SF Arena.

[zooropa]

Re: Brand Name Games

Well, I shouldn't have painted with such a broad stroke. I stand by the first part where I say you won't see Minnesota at Frost or the SF Arena.

A 12,000+ seat SF Arena might be able to draw in Nebraska or Minnesota as a one-off deal. It could also be part of a package deal for SDSU or USD, provided the arena kicks in enough of the guarantee.

I would venture to guess that most regional BCS schools (and the better Valley schools) would be willing to do a 2-1 with SDSU, if the return trip came with a hefty guarantee and was at a marquee venue like the [new] SF Arena. Would Kansas come to Sioux Falls? Probably not. But it'd be something for the Sports Authority to do with their palace, once they (assuming that they do) get it built.

The key isn't necessarily the prestige of the return trip as much as it is the guarantee.

[filbert]

Re: Brand Name Games

This is actually a known, recognized structural problem with D-I basketball. The NCAA made an effort to fix it by jiggering the RPI to weight away games more heavily than home games, in an effort to get the BCS schools out of their arenas. Of course, now they just mainly play each other.

About the only solution--which will never happen--would be for the NCAA to mandate that some significant percentage of every school's non-conference games be played at another school's home arena. That would force the full-arena schools on the road enough that some of them might find their way to places like Brookings. This of course will never happen.

[rcjacks]

Re: Brand Name Games

A 12,000+ seat SF Arena might be able to draw in Nebraska or Minnesota as a one-off deal. It could also be part of a package deal for SDSU or USD, provided the arena kicks in enough of the guarantee.

I would venture to guess that most regional BCS schools (and the better Valley schools) would be willing to do a 2-1 with SDSU, if the return trip came with a hefty guarantee and was at a marquee venue like the [new] SF Arena. Would Kansas come to Sioux Falls? Probably not. But it'd be something for the Sports Authority to do with their palace, once they (assuming that they do) get it built.

The key isn't necessarily the prestige of the return trip as much as it is the guarantee.

Well, there isn't a 12,000 + Arena in Sioux Falls. The reality is that we have Frost (which is a great mid-major stadium) and/or the SF Arena to host a basketball game.

Also, I still stand by my contention that a team like Minnesota would never come to Sioux Falls to play either USD or SDSU. No reason for them to do that, and it would be one less home game for their fans. Even if there was some gate revenue guarantee, they would still have one less home game for their fans. When Mizzou played at Macabee, do they have a player on their roster from that area? I remember Kansas going to Grand Forks, if my memory serves me correctly, because the Boshee kid was from Valley City, ND. Maybe Tubby would go to Vermillion because Iverson is a Yankton kid, but I still doubt it.

[valleyrabbit]

Re: Brand Name Games

I remember a few years ago K-State played at NDSU in 2 for 1 deal. It was actually Bob Huggins first season there, but the deal was made before he came to K-State. BCS schools do play at mid-major schools, but it is usually the exception and not the rule. . .

[zooropa]

Re: Brand Name Games

Well, there isn't a 12,000 + Arena in Sioux Falls. The reality is that we have Frost (which is a great mid-major stadium) and/or the SF Arena to host a basketball game.

Also, I still stand by my contention that a team like Minnesota would never come to Sioux Falls to play either USD or SDSU. No reason for them to do that, and it would be one less home game for their fans. Even if there was some gate revenue guarantee, they would still have one less home game for their fans. When Mizzou played at Macabee, do they have a player on their roster from that area? I remember Kansas going to Grand Forks, if my memory serves me correctly, because the Boshee kid was from Valley City, ND. Maybe Tubby would go to Vermillion because Iverson is a Yankton kid, but I still doubt it.

Eventually, there will be a 12,000+ seat stadium in Sioux Falls, and we are definitely not talking near term with any 2-1 BCS trade.

As far as 'no reason' for the Gophers to go to Sioux Falls, the reason is money. You put money on the table and the Gophs will come.

They went to Colorado State last year and played in front of 6,000. And the best guess I can get from the Gophs website is that was a 1-1 trade.

[joeboo22]

Re: Brand Name Games

Eventually, there will be a 12,000+ seat stadium in Sioux Falls, and we are definitely not talking near term with any 2-1 BCS trade.

As far as 'no reason' for the Gophers to go to Sioux Falls, the reason is money. You put money on the table and the Gophs will come.

They went to Colorado State last year and played in front of 6,000. And the best guess I can get from the Gophs website is that was a 1-1 trade.

1-1 with Colorado State is far different then a 1-1 with SDSU.....

The deal is this, you are NEVER going to see a tournament team from a major conference come to Frost for a men's game for the next 10 years, you won't see them come to Sioux Falls unless it is for some Holiday tournament in which there is other big teams there....

Gonzaga a team that is generally in the top-25 and usually a tournament team gets VERY FEW people to come to Spokane, every once in a great while they'll get a regional team to play them in Seattle.....

The only thing I could see is if Nagy went to Tubby and said hey, could you come to Frost once, we'd really appreciate it and Tubby was intoxicated and said yeah I could do that....

[zooropa]

Re: Brand Name Games

1-1 with Colorado State is far different then a 1-1 with SDSU.....

You're right.

If they played at Sioux Falls, they'd play in front of more than 6,000 people, travel costs would be much cheaper, and they'd probably take home a fatter guarantee check.

Regarding your intended assertion, Colorado State is not 'far different' from SDSU. Colorado State ended last year with a 212 RPI. SDSU's current RPI is 215.

[FargoBison]

Re: Brand Name Games

You're right.

If they played at Sioux Falls, they'd play in front of more than 6,000 people, travel costs would be much cheaper, and they'd probably take home a fatter guarantee check.

Regarding your intended assertion, Colorado State is not 'far different' from SDSU. Colorado State ended last year with a 212 RPI. SDSU's current RPI is 215.

MWC vs Summit. It is all about perception, and it is much easier to schedule a game with a bad MWC team than basically any Summit League team if you are a high major.

[zooropa]

Re: Brand Name Games

MWC vs Summit. It is all about perception, and it is much easier to schedule a game with a bad MWC team than basically any Summit League team if you are a high major.

Meh. Don't know that I put much stock in that.

I'm betting Colorado State had to put some money into its half of the trade, and I wouldn't expect anything different for SDSU.

SDSU might have to pay out more, given that playing a lousy team from a conference like the MWC is better than playing a good team from a conference like the Summit (25% of RPI is opponents' opponents' records)--but I figure a SDSU/SF Sports Authority combo could bid more than Colorado State too.

[FargoBison]

Re: Brand Name Games

I think coaches do put some stock into conference, the MWC is considered a to be a top 10 league. It is easier to get the conversation started when you are taking your school on the road to play a game against a team that is perceived to be in a quality league.

With that said, high major teams don't have to travel anyway, and if they do it is usually to play another high major or some team their coach or program has a relationship with.

A few years ago NDSU offered Iowa two games at Iowa City for one game in Fargo that gave them a huge guarantee...they wouldn't even give it a thought. I've pretty much come to realize that 2 for 1s with the Fresno State's and Colorado State's are as good as it is going to get along with home and homes vs teams like Green Bay and Idaho.

[zooropa]

Re: Brand Name Games

A few years ago NDSU offered Iowa two games at Iowa City for one game in Fargo that gave them a huge guarantee...they wouldn't even give it a thought. I've pretty much come to realize that 2 for 1s with the Fresno State's and Colorado State's are as good as it is going to get along with home and homes vs teams like Green Bay and Idaho.

A few notes:

- The Colorado State/Gophers series was a 1-1

- Iowa probably doesn't have much of an alumni base in Fargo

- If Iowa said no, what about Iowa State, Nebraska, Drake, or Creighton? UNI has come to Frost before, as part of a 2-1.

Minnesota has a decent alumni/fan base in both Fargo & Sioux Falls, and a guarantee game scaled to > 10-12k attendance might be attractive.

Of course such a bid might not be attractive to Minnesota, but I wouldn't flat out characterize it as out of the question for -any- BCS team.

And, in the long run, I think it should be a consideration for SDSU's MBB program when they negotiate with bigger programs (again, assuming SF gets a better facility).

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Ultimately, SDSU isn't going to level the playing field with BCS schools, but I think they could do a better job at schedule building now, while keeping an eye out for opportunities to get -something- out of BCS programs besides guarantee money.