SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

[JACKGUYII]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

AMEN!

[MilwaukeeJacksAlum]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

I have to say I was disappointed with the game, once again.  Despite the score and how it may have sounded on the radio, it was not pretty.  I brought a couple friends-not State fans-to the game, and I don’t know if they will come back to another.  The reason the crowd seemed subdued until the last couple minutes is because there wasn’t much to get excited about until then. :P  A couple dunks, and that’s it.

I would say the final 4 minutes of regulation were some of the most entertaining and exciting I’ve seen in awhile.  Big shots kept falling, and I was hoping for an outcome like Denver.

We were helped out a ton by the officials.  They were young, does anyone know where they came from?  I would be upset with the officiating if I was a Manhatten fan.  And I would already be in a surly mood, what with the whole public transit thing going on out there. ;D

Missing free throws hurt, but if we do some other things right, we still win the game.  We did not sub enough in the second half, and our body language showed it (hands on knees, open mouths gasping for air).  We had our best team on the floor the whole second half, but we can’t use media timeouts for rest instead of substitutions.  Loney didn’t produce much in the second half because he did not play much. :-/  In my humble opinion, we need to play 7-8 players, using the bottom 2 to steal minutes of rest for the top 6.

I’m surprised no one is talking about our scoring drought.  I think we went the first 7-8 minutes of the second half without scoring.

Overtime is a new game, and we did not play well.  Gilbert made two terrible decisions driving into traffic, and then a turnover.  Eight turnovers in a college basketball game is too many for one player.  Take away eight possessions from Manhatten, and it is a different outcome.  He may be the future of the program, but he is losing games in the present.  Get him out of the game, calm him down, and get him back in.  Not to pile on, but did anyone else notice almost every time Dre made a mistake he was grabbing a different part of his body like he was hurt?  And then miraculously he would recover on the very next play.  

Once again, last night some players are allowed to make mistake after mistake, and Kleinjan was pulled after one mistake, never to return.  What happened to Mac, who showed some promise earlier in the season?  Don’t tell me he can’t keep up or he is too small.  Did you see Minor?  

I don’t think we have to look for a day when better athletes are going to arrive.  I was not impressed with Manhatten athletically at all.  Our athleticism was as good if not better than the Jaspers, with two thunderous dunks and forcing 17 turnovers.

Did anyone else think Coach Nagy seemed out of the game?  Usually he is up and down all night long, but last night he sat with his chin in his hand until about the last 3 minutes of the game. :-/  It looked like he had the flu.  He got outcoached (and that doesn’t happen often) by the Manhatten coach who was always talking to his players and the officials.  It seemed we had a different approach to this game by playing 5 guys a ton, unlike the last 2 games we won with a more balanced approach.

This was a game we should have won.  I don’t think Manhatten will be too eager to come back to SD anytime soon.

Hey, I understand being dissapointed with not winning, but your posts are always so negative. Questioning Coach Nagy merely because he didn't jump up and hollar at the ref's like an idiot? That doesn't make sense to me. I have a pretty close relationship to a member of the coaching staff and I can promise you the last thing in any of their minds is to give up. I'm sure Coach Nagy makes his mistakes and has bad games, etc., but do you really think he got to where he is by giving up whenever things became difficult? "Always talking to his players and the officials" does not a good coach make. If that's how you judge coaching, those overbearing parents who coach their kid's little league teams and end up punching a 16 year old kid who's umping the game would be the best coaches on the planet.

Finally, my frustration with Gilbert has been documented. He needs to learn to play within the system and stop forcing so much and frankly he needs to grow up. But, the alternative answer is not Andy. I guarantee you Nagy wishes Andy was the answer as Andy is a great kid and works hard. However, he's yet to show he's able to keep up at this level.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

Call me crazy, but I think Frias playing last night had more to do with our opponent being from his hometown than his defense and quickness. He seemed to know some of the players from the other team. While very agreesive, 25 turnovers to 8 assists is not good by any means, and any player with those kind of stats should not be on the floor at the end of a game.

I don't want this to turn into another nightmare thread about Kleinjan or Mac, but I will say it would be difficult to play aggressive while always worrying about getting yanked for a mistake. Andy has been quick enough to gaurd the opponents best player most of the time he is in and we're not playing zone. To me it seems like Gilbert has been given a very long rope, and last night it cost us a chance at winning the game in OT.

[JACKGUYII]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

You really think Nagy would throw Frias into the game simply because they are playing a team from his hometown? And yes I'm sure Jose knows every basketball player in New York. Their seems to be a theme to your posts that is pretty sad and I will leave it at that!

[jackmd]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

I have to get something off my chest with regards to men's BB at state.

Certainly, there are people who post on this site that have a lot more knowledge, connections, and contacts with SDSU and high school basketball in the state of SD than others. Recently, some of those posters have provided information and opinions that have been received with varied response.

I am frustrated by the unwillingness of some posters, (who as best as I know or can tell, have virtually no experience with college or high school BB) disregarding information provided by those individuals. By this I mean the recruiting process, eligbility issues, scholarship disbursement, etc... There seems to be a tendency for those individuals with less experience and knowledge to blantantly disregard potentially valuable information. To me this makes no sense. The more information (correct information) the better.

Expecting the current men's team to compete and win on a night-in-night-out basis at the DI level right now isn't realistic. Posts suggesting it will happen don't seem logical to me. Look at the source, Nagy. He has mentioned in public interviews and private conversations that this team is not ready and right now he isn't sure he can get them there.

Losing out on Tveidt and ending up with Frias doesn't look too great right now. We can survive that mistake if similar problems don't arise with future recruits. If we don't learn from the mistakes of the last 2 years this transition will be even longer and more painful.

In summary, don't be too proud to listen to information from people who have more knowledge and experience than you. I must admit that I have made that mistake in the past and for it I have suffered. We all want SDSU to succeed and the more information from sources who make a difference, the better.

Lastly, I welcome all disagreement with this post but must prefice things by saying, its not negative to state the facts. I welcome the recent influx of information from people privy to more information than me.

Best of luck to Scott and the Jacks on Friday. I'll be at William's arena cheering them on.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

You really think Nagy would throw Frias into the game simply because they are playing a team from his hometown? And yes I'm sure Jose knows every basketball player in New York. Their seems to be a theme to your posts that is pretty sad and I will leave it at that!

Just posting my observations as a fan. I am not an expert as some clearly are. I don't think I'm the only one who has these opinions. Breath deeply, I’m just making my personal observations, no need to freak out. I will stand by my statement that we should have won last night’s game, and I believe we can win Friday. If some want apologize for missed opportunity, that is fine, but we should have won the game last night nonetheless.

You are right, I do not know for certain Coach Nagy would play someone more because we were playing their hometown. I do think it is interesting that a player who hasn’t played for the last two games plays in a clutch situation. No matter the size of the city, players do get to know each other. I said he seemed to know, I did not say he did know players from the other team.

As for Coach Nagy, he has had a ton of wins since he has been as SDSU. He just seemed different last night than usual to me, that is all. That is why I asked if he had the flu. On a side note, he himself has said he is having a hard time reaching this group of players, and his coaching style hasn’t changed much up to this point. Maybe he changed and that is why he seemed different.

If you want to play 5 on 9 the rest of the year, I suspect we will see a lot more missed free throws, mental errors, lost games we should win (so far I count 2), etc… When you get tired, you make more mistakes. I can see Kleinjan, Mac, Frias, etc aren’t All-Americans, or even big contributors to the stat sheet, but I thought the guys on the floor looked tired, and our bench players are at least good enough to give them a rest once in a while. :-/

And I have always said I am partial to the local kids. I believe I was talking about Heien before some on this board even knew how to pronounce his last name.

Many are already looking to redshirts for next year, which is fine-I’m sure they are fine players who will do well. I am excited about their potential. ;D The problem is we have several games yet to play this year.

Andre, Cadwell, and the redshirts are the future of this team. Unfortunately, we are playing in the present, and in the present Andre’s play cost us the game. He is very exciting to watch and made big plays early in the contest, which is good. He made terrible plays when the game is on the line, which is very bad. I suspect that I will be a huge fan of Andre in years to come. I have alluded to that in previous posts.

As far as a theme to my posts, there is. I am critical of mistakes, excited when I see good things, I like the locals, and I’m a fan of SDSU. I think that pretty much sums it up. If you think differently, PM me and hopefully we can work it out. ;D

Oh yeah, please don't call me an idiot. Although I may seem a bit dense, name calling is not very nice, and it doesn't make points well either. ;D

[SD-STATE]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

We’re talking here together let’s be friends

You’re not alone I’ve always known that we’d get along

And someone I know says life is good and he can’t be wrong

There’s fun and laughter just waiting round the bend

Let’s find them now together let’s be friends

Let’s find them now together let’s be friends

Elvis

[MilwaukeeJacksAlum]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

I'm caught in a trap,
I can't get out,
Because I love you too much baby.

- Elvis

Has always been my favorite Elvis songs, since we're on that subject.

[MilwaukeeJacksAlum]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

I'm a lone Rhinocerus,
There ain't one h*ell of a lots of us,
Left in this world.

- Adrian Belew

[MilwaukeeJacksAlum]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

And now you've have another piece of my mind,
A cup of coffee and a slice of time.
If you'll excuse me I should say goodbye,
Gotta go now.

- Adrian Belew

* sorry, I saw the song quote and got carried away. Today is my last day before the long weekend. And it's bonus day.

[Jacks99]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

I was at the game and was happy to see our top 5 players in the majority of the game. Yes they grew tired, but I think it gave us our best shot at winning.

Also, I like having the young potentials in there more to gain needed experience. I'd rather seem them be at the next level at the end of this year, than halfway through the next. If they are missing free throws because of this, then they need this experience to figure out how to make them. However they were missing them from the first minutes of the game.

On the topic of three throws, I think Nagy is realizing he can't just sit on his hands on this topic. They obviously aren't figuring it out. They need to get their confidence in this area if anything.

In regards to Gilbert, I agree he has massive athletic talent, but he needs to continue to conform to the game. Being as tall as he, going to the basket tall and keeping the ball high is key. His biggest mental error of the night was the frustration foul right after his deep 3 attempt. This is one thing I feel he will get over if he plays more.

Frias came in because we needed a guard due to the foul out. Nagy must have decided he wanted him to shoot. I think Nagy has done a great job of working everyone in in different situations to see how they all resopond. Maybe now Nagy has learned Frias isn't the guy. However if he had of come down the court and nailed a 3, we would be singing a different tune. Same thing with Andy. Nagy obviously seems something in him. He's giving him oportunities but pulling him out quick when he's not making the most of them. Maybe he want's Andy to provide the rest for the others.

I admit that I don't care for Nagy's harsh style. I equate it to the military. He tears his guys down and then builds them back up. It's a process and for those that it works for it does just that. However there are those that it will never work for.

However, I think he is one of the greatest coaches that can get a really good team to be a really great team. I think we are seeing, and he is admitting, that he is learning how to push along a group of youngsters that are playing with talent and size a bit greater than theirs. But all in all that is his style good or bad.

That being said, I'm more than happy to have Nagy as coach and am happy with the progress. I think he is an outstanding person and an asset to SDSU.

We all knew going in that the Men's team would be a work in progress and need to wait 3-4 years to have a respectable winning team. Not getting a conference hasn't helped either.

I'm super exited to see this team evolve going into next year and think that the year after that is when we will begin making the waves that the Women's team is doing right now. The players on this team are exiting and there is much potential for the future to draw the bodies to Frost.

Kudos so far to all Jackrabbit teams and coaches who are putting in more time than we realize and spending time away from their school and family. Good luck the rest of the season and Merry Christmas to all.

[89rabbit]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

Link to the Brookings Register story on this game:

http://www.brookingsregister.com/mai...04&page=25

Go State! ;D

[filbert]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

. . .

I admit that I don't care for Nagy's harsh style. I equate it to the military. He tears his guys down and then builds them back up. It's a process and for those that it works for it does just that. However there are those that it will never work for.

However, I think he is one of the greatest coaches that can get a really good team to be a really great team. I think we are seeing, and he is admitting, that he is learning how to push along a group of youngsters that are playing with talent and size a bit greater than theirs. But all in all that is his style good or bad.

That being said, I'm more than happy to have Nagy as coach and am happy with the progress. I think he is an outstanding person and an asset to SDSU.

We all knew going in that the Men's team would be a work in progress and need to wait 3-4 years to have a respectable winning team. Not getting a conference hasn't helped either.

. . .

I continue to think that this is the greatest professional challenge of Scott Nagy's coaching career. If he can adapt his successful top-rung-D-II coaching style to conform to the lower-rung-D-I reality, he will be a truly great coach, even if we no longer win 20 games a season for the next few years.

I think he know he needs to change, but still hasn't quite figured out what the combination of sticks and carrots are to motivate a team in this new situation.

I think he'll get there, and will solidify his place in history as the best ever basketball coach at SDSU.

[JACKGUYII]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

I don't think Nagy's style has to change moving from DII to DI. If the players ever feel he doesn't have the same expectations as we had in DII we are lost. Now if he was moving to the NBA I could understand a change in style. Some day we will have a full compliment of talent and depth and the wins will follow.

[filbert]

Re: SDSU vs Manhattan (N.Y.) in Sioux Falls

I didn't say "change" I said "adapt." And, upon reflection, it's probably more of a challenge with the hand Nagy's been dealt personnel-wise the past two years than it is any particular philosophy change going from D-II to D-I.

Still, it's as big a challenge as he's ever going to face as a coach. And I do see progress with this team--possibly not enough for some, but I do think they're getting better as the year goes on.

It's easy to forget that there are no seniors on this team. Players have had to step into roles they're not quite ready for. One of two things will happen: they'll get stronger and more experienced, and be better players later on, or they'll fold and give up.

I think they're all slowly getting stronger. That's enough for me, for now.