Argus Editorial on Nagy

[bub94]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Maybe Wolter's didn't sign with the Jacks because he doesn't want to play here if Coach Nagy wasn't here. Maybe if Nagy was able to say he would be here next year, Wolter's would have signed. Who knows, maybe we will lose recruits because Coach Nagy might not be here.

[1stRowFANatic]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Maybe Wolter's didn't sign with the Jacks because he doesn't want to play here if Coach Nagy wasn't here. Maybe if Nagy was able to say he would be here next year, Wolter's would have signed. Who knows, maybe we will lose recruits because Coach Nagy might not be here.

That was the point of my question of "Can the program be as successful at recruiting another year if the recruits hear that his status is still unsettled?" It works both ways, but if there is not significant improvement, the question will be there again next year. We have win totals of 10, 9, 6 & 8; if we have another year on par with those and don't do anything, another recruiting year will be done under the specter of "Is it Nagy's last year?"

If SDSU loses a recruit because they did or did not want to play for him and they weren't sure what was going to happen, in the end SDSU still lost the recruit.

[goon]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

The mens program is suffering from what we all have suffered at some point and time in our lives, bad luck. Just maybe a bit longer then what we have experienced. Like they say for some if they didnt have bad luck they wouldnt have any luck at all. Its impossible to say Nagy has not done his job. He recruited kids who had talent and wanted to play here. We have had what i would say is more then above avg when it comes to injuries, transfers, legal cases, etc. With Nagy not having a full staff to help him recruit its hard. Let alone bringing in new young players after the program lost a few after a year or two. Its hard to gain experince when your constantly playing 18 and 19 year old kids against 20-22 year olds from other programs who are fully staffed and not made a long transition. We all want to see results fast and improvements imediately but trying to reload year after year with young players playing big minutes just isnt going to happen overnite. Maybe with the commitment from Kai and the other older players that they have shown, it may in a way be a new start that we have been waiting for. From what i can tell, players are not hanging thier heads and not giving up even though things are still not going how people have been hoping for. So far they have done what they can with what they have. I still thinking counting on sophs and Jrs to be playing and winning like an experinced program is a little selfish on our part. We lost our senior leadership from last year that was the first year we even had several seniors graduate during the transition if i recall and this year we have not much still for leadership and we are asking a few jrs and key sophs to be making a huge stride in one year. I think we are correct to trust nagy and the players atleast one more year to get to where we think we should be going. We have senior leadership with solid contributing players from Jr, soph and fresh able to help next year. Sorry for the long rant but not losing players and not getting experince except for a few players is hard for a coach to work with. A full coaching staff able to recruit is the next piece of the puzzle, along with a little loyalty from the fans and administration couldnt hurt either.

Goon

[RabbitObsessed]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

As most of you know (or those that venture into the Smack section know) I'm a USD fan. A lot of the posts I've made in the smack section have been anti-SDSU men's basketball. I've of course got some negative rep (my favorite was "U lover") but I really don't care about that too much. Since I am a Udot fan you would think I want SDSU's basketball team to (continue to) crash and burn. That is very, very false.

I love basketball. Out of every sport, it is my favorite to watch and play. And I don't want to offend any females or womens basketball parents, but I love watching men's basketball the best. It's just more entertaining to me personally. Since I will be attending SDSU for the next 3 and a half years, it would be much more enjoyable for me if SDSU had a competitive men's team. I've been in Frost many times during USD games and man those games were fun. But, it's hard to get an atmosphere like that for the men's team when they just aren't very competitive in-conference.

Like goon said, a lot of it has been bad luck, but if that bad luck keeps happening over and over, is it really bad luck, or is something wrong with the program? I honestly don't know. I've been at the UIU and the SMSU games so far this year and the Jacks just don't look fluid. Kai is obviously a very talented athlete and they have other good players on the court. One thing that they are lacking is a quality PG and when the offense sputters, it is pretty apparent. On whether Naggy should stay or go, I'd give him one more year. See if with Feigen and White SDSU can show some improvement next year, or maybe there's still a shot to turn around this year. Who knows. I've just seen some of those teams that Naggy has put together in the past and I've got too much respect for him as a coach.

Hopefully I will be able to watch some good mens basketball during my time here.

[EQguy]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Seriously. How many "one more years" can this program survive? Next year some of the ostriches will find another reason that he deserves one more year. This could go on for an eternity because "he's a good guy with unfortunate circumstances" and "players X and Y deserve to play their eligibility up with Nagy". Bunch of crap. If anyone truly believes Nagy can turn this program around I've got a home that has actually appreciated 50% in this crappy ecomony that I'd like to sell you.

Oh, and someone please reference Matt Jones in defending the downturn of the MBB program. Ialwayslovethatone.

Yeah, but weren't you the guy that was calling for Stig's head in year 1?

And I do agree with the Matt Jones statement. That was D-II

By the way of everything said about Nagy here I think bbfan54's comment should ring loudest. Her son plays for the guy and I would guess her and her husband have a good idea of what is going on inside the team. If she's behind him having 1 more year I can get behind that.

[Nidaros]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

I proud of the SDSU AD keeping coaches the way they do. I think in any college sport a coach deserves at least 5 years to recruit and develop "His" players. I could name quite a few situations where frequent coaching changes has put elite programs in state of limbo.

That said, I think if they made a move at this point, I and most others would understand.

If SDSU is attractive to a coach at this point, would they be High profile enough to instantly bring in top recruits? If not they would essentially be slowly building wins over the next 5 years to get those players, unless they could get the current players to play to a much higher level than they are now. So if Nagy does gain momentum this year and the next he would be much further along.

Hopefully if the team is aware of this article it spurs them to play at their highest level. If not.....

I agree with what you have said, and of the few firings at SDSU, they have been for cause and often a good cause. Sometimes these cause reasons have leaked out and when they do, as a dedicated fan, you no longer question the action. Its old stuff, and not worthy of public airing.

Your question about attracting a high profile coach and attracting recruits immediately are valid. With so many other financial priorities, yet to be ful-filled, there is no fund to hire a high profile coach that I am aware of and if it existed, I would truly be surprised.

I also agree if things start to improve this year, why make a change?

I said I was not going to comment on this subject, but I lied. It looks like Stu is performing his function of stirring the pot at the Argus. What is that about renting space in our minds, often mentioned by JackJD?

[Nidaros]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Well we hope that Nagy gets another year, regardless if he does or does not Kai will be finishing his 4th year at SDSU.

Stu Whitney does not own President Chicione nor AD Fred Oien, and I honestly do not believe a change is going to be made any time soon such as at the end of the season.

Coach Nagy was one of the few coaches speaking loudly in favor of moving up to D1, when this topic was very unpopular amongst the Jackrabbit Family. I don't think Dr Oien will forget these public expressions. I wished I had videoed his talk at the Alumni outing in Volga about 6 years ago. I was told by many on this board that building the mens program will be the hardest to do. I tend to agree now, but did not a while back.

[Jacks99]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Coach Nagy was one of the few coaches speaking loudly in favor of moving up to D1, when this topic was very unpopular amongst the Jackrabbit Family. I don't think Dr Oien will forget these public expressions. I wished I had videoed his talk at the Alumni outing in Volga about 6 years ago. I was told by many on this board that building the mens program will be the hardest to do. I tend to agree now, but did not a while back.

I was surprised to hear this. Was under the impression that he was initially against it. Maybe that was the result of rumors that those against the move clung to. Unfortunately that included me originally.

[CatchEmAll]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Yeah, but weren't you the guy that was calling for Stig's head in year 1?

And I do agree with the Matt Jones statement. That was D-II

By the way of everything said about Nagy here I think bbfan54's comment should ring loudest. Her son plays for the guy and I would guess her and her husband have a good idea of what is going on inside the team. If she's behind him having 1 more year I can get behind that.

I wasn't pleased with the Stig hiring from Day 1 just to be clear, so there should be no comparison to my statements on the two. But, Stig has actually made progress during the transition with similar staff issues as Nagy. And I have also admitted as such that Stig's progress in the past couple of years has been very good in my personal opinion. So I am big enough to admit that I could have been wrong at one time.

People continually make excuses for coach Nagy on here (not calling you out specifically by quoting you eq just to be clear). I will admit that it's probably easier to make the transition in the women's sports, but AJ is faced with the same staffing numbers as Nagy, same scholarships as allowed by the NCAA, same facility issues and recruiting to the same city and campus. If anything the number of quality players to recruit from might be bigger for men's sports than women's. Yes, injuries are something a coach can't control. But identifying talent, developing talent and retaining talent are a core aspect of any coach's job. There's obviously something lacking in regard to that last statement as it relates to SDSU's MBB program. At one time the MBB staff was one of the best at that, now not so much.

Here's a statement for thought, maybe the wrong coach left to take over the Mankato State program. SDSU hasn't been "right" since Margenthaler left. Could he have been that big of a factor in Nagy's success? I'll vote yes on that. Anyone agree or disagree?

[jack power]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

It looks like Stu is performing his function of stirring the pot at the Argus. What is that about renting space in our minds, often mentioned by JackJD?

I agree. His article is written in such a way to appear fair and balanced but is nothing more than an attempt to take a dig at SDSU

This thread belongs in the " Stu strikes again" thread

[EQguy]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

I don't think we disagree that much on this one Catchem.

I am of the opinion that Nagy had to re-think the situation two years ago and took a different path on recruiting. Those kids hit the floor next year. In my mind last year was year 1 on the clock for Nagy. If improvement isn't seen this year then some hard questions need to be asked. Then, if nothing gets better with his new recruits, action needs to be taken. I have no idea what Fred is thinking but I had heard once that Fred told the coaches that when the move was made they would be given the benefit of the doubt through the transition. I feel my theory would be consistent with that plan.

I also think those of you that think Stu was rabble rousing need to take off the homer lenses and re-read the article. Stu was very fair in his assesment of the situation and brought out real reasons for why Nagy could be given some benefit of the doubt. It is time for big boy decisions and this one could be the biggest as Nagy has a great history at SDSU. But the transition to D-I is about the future, not the past.

[jackwatcher]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Stu does not say one negative thing about SDSU in this article, except about MBB.

Women's basketball was going to be "easier" because South Dakota has sent many girls off to play DI the last 20 years. We have had a lot fewer men go off to play DI, although they may have been higher profile.

Bad recruiting, tough breaks, brutal schedule...we all know those have been factors. I am past looking at those.

Here is what I am now looking at. Are the kids that are here improving at a significant rate? Are the players playing smarter than they did? Can certain players now do things they could not do when they came to SDSU? Do we recognize situations and match-ups better than we used to? Are players working their way into the rotation because of improvement or because of atrition?

There will no doubt be certain players that get better, but is it happening as a group? I have not seen it.

[Chains]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Jacks fans,

The last person I want to influence or get direction from for our athletic programs is Stu pid! His last comment about making tough decission is baseless. Dr. Oien has demonstrated his willingness to make big time choices over and over again. The move to Dl itself speaks volumes for his balls! If Coach Nagy needs to go Dr. Oien will make that decission. That being said most coaching changes are made based on wins and losses. I would think Coach Nagy is on thin ice at this time. Certainly one thing that Coach Nagy does not do that the balance of the Coach's do is to be more visible in the Jackrabbit communities. Its so much easier to support any person if you feel you know that person.

Remember, if you remove the head Coach it impacts more than just that individual. It involves that rest of the staff & families, players, parents, fans etc. It gets just plain ugly. I am one willing to give additional time but would find it impossible to argue if a change was made.

Go big, go blue, go Jacks

[Nidaros]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

Stu does not say one negative thing about SDSU in this article, except about MBB.

Women's basketball was going to be "easier" because South Dakota has sent many girls off to play DI the last 20 years. We have had a lot fewer men go off to play DI, although they may have been higher profile.

Bad recruiting, tough breaks, brutal schedule...we all know those have been factors. I am past looking at those.

Here is what I am now looking at. Are the kids that are here improving at a significant rate? Are the players playing smarter than they did? Can certain players now do things they could not do when they came to SDSU? Do we recognize situations and match-ups better than we used to? Are players working their way into the rotation because of improvement or because of atrition?

There will no doubt be certain players that get better, but is it happening as a group? I have not seen it.

I went back and re-read the column by Stu, and I have to admit, its a fair column. Its like I said before, and I say again. We can all say what we think and feel, but the decision is not ours to make. I certainly can not stop anyone from emailing those who will make that decision and I sure some will do just that and with that I say "Good luck". I do not feel the urge to debate/comment this topic any further.

[rabbit_boy]

Re: Argus Editorial on Nagy

The article was very fair, just long over due. IMO, Nagy should do the honorable thing and resign NOW. This year is a loss and to give our juniors a chance at a decent senior year we need to strat the search for a competent Div I coach ASAP. Anything else is putting off the inevitable.