On to IPFW

[Grizzled_Jack]

Re: On to IPFW

So you are saying that a decent ref would determine whether or not to make the call based on the time on the clock, not the rules? I've never refereed and I can see that you haven't either.

The comment brought back memories of an incident that I saw almost fifty years ago. In this case the clock determined the call although the it was a one-eighty from the goal tending call. Probably a few old timers may remember long time high school ref. Knowles Trippler who used to call games in the state B tournament in the late fifties-early sixties. He hailed from Canova if memory serves me right.

I was watching a seventh place game in the Pony Hills Conference Tournament. Carthage and Lane I believe. Two of the worst teams to ever play any kind of athletics-- probably any where in the country. I hope they've both been merged out of existence. A Carthage player (I think they were about 20 points behind with three minutes to go) picked up the ball and ran about four rows into the bleachers, ran along the bleachers and came out thirty feet down the court, ran towards the basket and made the shot. All without dribbling.

Trippler let it stand and then announced to the fans. "Hell, these people just want to go home. "

[bballfan54]

Re: On to IPFW

So you are saying that a decent ref would determine whether or not to make the call based on the time on the clock, not the rules? I've never refereed and I can see that you haven't either.

No I haven't but Kai's Dad has and still does.!!!!!!!

[bballfan54]

Re: On to IPFW

[QUOTE=propar80;76651]I refree fb but not basketball, but I can guarantee you there are calls that you don't make during some points of the game in every sport.
IMO, that goaltend was one of those calls.

THANKYOU MY THOUGHTS TOO.

[Jacked_Up]

Re: On to IPFW

This is a winnable game, to quote a phrase I've seen on this board before. This has been a frustrating season, mostly because of close losses, not so much because of blowout losses. I still believe this team is better than its record and far better than last year's team. Go, Jacks. Win a few more.

[Jacks#1Fan]

Re: On to IPFW

Probably a few old timers may remember long time high school ref. Knowles Trippler who used to call games in the state B tournament in the late fifties-early sixties. He hailed from Canova if memory serves me right.
"

He was indeed from Canova (where he and his brother published the Canova Herald). Everybody who ever saw him referee would have noticed his round middle, which made it hard for him to keep his pants up. So as he came down the floor, he was always using his elbows to help hitch up his pants! He called many of our games at Lake Preston and he was a great guy.

I think the ref who makes a game-changing call in the final seconds of a game, does so only if he/she is absolutely certain that the call has to be made...no doubts at all. I also believe the ref who made the goaltending call may have thought he was certain, but certainly did not understand the goaltending rules if that was the case. My final rehash of a moment I would rather forget!

[SDHoops]

Re: On to IPFW

Where is the game being played at? I hope it's not in the Gates. The thing I love about SDSU is, it's in a smaller community and everything is easily accessible. At IPFW, students who live in their housing have to walk across a bridge and mile from there just to get to class. The Memorial Coliseum parking is all messed up too. I hope SDSU beats IPFW just for being so confusing of a campus, heck even their name is so confusing you have to know them by IPFW

[Just in the crowd]

Re: On to IPFW

[quote=bballfan54;76667]

I refree fb but not basketball, but I can guarantee you there are calls that you don't make during some points of the game in every sport.
IMO, that goaltend was one of those calls.

THANKYOU MY THOUGHTS TOO.

OK, I'm fine with that. We shouldn't complain when we are down by 1 in the closing seconds and Sargent gets hacked across the arms bringing the ball into the lane and there is no call because it's the closing seconds. Or when Beran gets mauled on an over the back in the closing seconds on an offensive rebound because it isn't the right point in the game to make a call.

[1stRowFANatic]

Re: On to IPFW

I refree fb but not basketball, but I can guarantee you there are calls that you don't make during some points of the game in every sport.
IMO, that goaltend was one of those calls.

There maybe some refs that would disagree with my statement, but most coaches would give them this look, and so would a majority of "good" refs. By "good" refs, I mean the ones that know the game isn't about them, it's about the players.

Go Jacks!!

It has been quite some time since I did it, but when I ref'd basketball (not at college level, so maybe there is a difference), but I would never change a call because of the time on the clock. That is favoritism, which an official should never do, for the team that violated the rules. The game is about the players, and the refs are there to make sure they compete on an even basis. Swallowing the whistle is when the official affects the outcome of a game. If the player violated the rules and the ref calls it, remember that the PLAYER violated the rules, not the ref. And when is it so close to the end of the game that you start swallowing the whistle, 5 seconds, 10, 45?

Saying all that, I do think that there are calls that are not made in games all the time. However, if I think that the good refs make the same calls in the first 5 seconds of the game as they do in the last 5 seconds. Every team should adjust to how the game is being called, and most teams do as long as the refs are consistent. IMO, the worst thing a ref can hear after the game is a comment like "It was hard playing tonight because we never knew what was going to be called.

[propar80]

Re: On to IPFW

It has been quite some time since I did it, but when I ref'd basketball (not at college level, so maybe there is a difference), but I would never change a call because of the time on the clock. That is favoritism, which an official should never do, for the team that violated the rules. The game is about the players, and the refs are there to make sure they compete on an even basis. Swallowing the whistle is when the official affects the outcome of a game. If the player violated the rules and the ref calls it, remember that the PLAYER violated the rules, not the ref. And when is it so close to the end of the game that you start swallowing the whistle, 5 seconds, 10, 45?

Saying all that, I do think that there are calls that are not made in games all the time. However, if I think that the good refs make the same calls in the first 5 seconds of the game as they do in the last 5 seconds. Every team should adjust to how the game is being called, and most teams do as long as the refs are consistent. IMO, the worst thing a ref can hear after the game is a comment like "It was hard playing tonight because we never knew what was going to be called.

As a ref, if there is any doubt in your mind that you should blow your whistle/throw your flag...then you shouldn't. That doesn't apply just to the end of games, and it was probably my bad that my previous post made it sound like that. The best advice I've ever received was from an NFL referee last summer. "If you KNOW it's a foul call it, if you THINK it's a foul...move on."

Don't get me wrong, if there are 5 seconds left and someone is blantley fouled, it should be called.
As far as the goal-tend in question...shouldn't have been a whistle there if the ref didn't "KNOW" it was goal-tending. He "Thought" is was goal-tending and he was wrong in the end, as most refs are 50% of the time when they "think" they saw something.

Hopefully tonight against IPFW we see refs that make calls they "KNOW" are calls. How's that for trying to get us back on track?!

Go Jacks!!

[HoboD]

Re: On to IPFW

I think this thread is entitled "On to IPFW" seems like the ref banter has drifted far afield.

[1stRowFANatic]

Re: On to IPFW

You are correct and my apologies. I think that propar and I probably agree for the most part on refereeing philosophies, and I did not express myself as well as I should have.

[Jacks#1Fan]

Re: On to IPFW

As a ref, if there is any doubt in your mind that you should blow your whistle/throw your flag...then you shouldn't. That doesn't apply just to the end of games, and it was probably my bad that my previous post made it sound like that. The best advice I've ever received was from an NFL referee last summer. "If you KNOW it's a foul call it, if you THINK it's a foul...move on."

Don't get me wrong, if there are 5 seconds left and someone is blantley fouled, it should be called.
As far as the goal-tend in question...shouldn't have been a whistle there if the ref didn't "KNOW" it was goal-tending. He "Thought" is was goal-tending and he was wrong in the end, as most refs are 50% of the time when they "think" they saw something.

Hopefully tonight against IPFW we see refs that make calls they "KNOW" are calls. How's that for trying to get us back on track?!

Go Jacks!!

Said much better than in my earlier post on the subject, but in 100% agreement with what I was trying to say! Every referee in many calls during a game, "guesses" on a call. The good ones are better at seeing it (being in proper place sometimes helps) and not "guessing" as much. Fouls (and other infractions) are often on a gray scale. Was it or wasn't it? Again, I believe the good referees are likely to sort that out in their heads before they blow the whistle...that's why they are good! Now on to IPFW...GO JACKS!!

[SUPERBUNNY]

Re: On to IPFW

Awww, the hell with all of the stuff from last week!

Let's get the Mastadon off our back tonight!

Come on Jacks!!!

SUPERBUNNY

[filbert]

Re: On to IPFW

It's a GREAT day to be a Jackrabbit!

[thebluehatman]

Re: On to IPFW

Game time is 10 minutes away.