NCAA rule changes

[89rabbit]

Re: NCAA rule changes

I agree 100% with SDSUFAN.  What Roger Thomas is outlining is a bluring of the lines between D-I and D-II.  This is  the exact opposite of what the NCAA is trying to do.  Over on the Bison board people have asked who is Roger Thomas working for?  If this idea passed, and it won't because it dosen't benifit D-I, the only school that have expressed a desire to add football scholarships are UND, and UNO.  Does anyone really think that MSU-Mankato, Augie, or USD with it's financial woes would really want to add cost to play I-AA football.  I don't think so.  The effect would be that UND and UNO would leave the NCC for football.  Currently, with UND and UNO, we hear how hard it is for NCC schools to schedule football, how does this benefit the NCC?  So the question again needs to be asked, who is Roger Thomas working for?


Sorry, this plan would beneifit just a few schools that would like to get by on the cheap by doing an a la carte program and would hurt the vast majority who understand there is more to college athletics then just football, and basketball.  The plan certainly would have an adverse impact on non-revenue sports.  This is a bad plan that I predict will be DOA if it comes before the NCAA as a whole.  Who knows, this could be simply posturing for the next round of debate about scholarship cuts in D-II.  If UND or any other D-II school wants to play I-AA football I say welcome.  Step up to the plate and become D-I, don't try and waterdown what we have and muddy up the classification system.

Go State!  ;D

[Lurking_Dog]

Re: NCAA rule changes

Why would D1AA go for this? Why would the entire D1 membership want this?

Why, in the early 1990s, did D-I support the rule change requiring schools to play football at the same division level as their other sports? Well, some supported it, and some didn't. The NCAA makes a lot of changes without the unanimous support of D-I.

It is myopic to believe that all D-I schools are in lockstep with South Dakota State. In fact, many in I-AA have been denied access to the playoffs for 12 years. They will support change. Most of D-II isn't fully funded. They will support change. The schools with top D-II football programs will also support change.

This idea may get held up in a committee, but if it ever comes to a vote, the support will be there.

[89rabbit]

Re: NCAA rule changes

I hear what you are saying Lurking Dog that the NCAA is not a monolithic organization but the question remains how does Roger's idea benefit the majority of D-I schools as a whole?  What problem is the task force trying to solve? If there is a D-I problem that needs to be fixed why is there no D-I representation on the task force?

I understand your special circumstances (as a Drake fan whose school plays non-scholarship I-AA football and thus is for all practical purposes is excluded from the I-AA playoffs), but how would what Roger's group is talking about help Drake.  Would Drake drop it's football team to D-III.  How would you as a Drake fan like to see every school in the country playing D-I basketball?  I ask this because if schools can play football a la carte it would only be a matter of time before every D-III school in the country would want to play D-I Men's and Women's basketball and have every other sport as a D-III non-scholarship.

As I have said before this idea would benefit certain schools, but I don't believe that it would benefit the majority of NCAA schools thus it will be DOA, if it ever sees the light of day to begin with.

Go State!  ;D

[SDSUFAN]

Re: NCAA rule changes

Why, in the early 1990s, did D-I support the rule change requiring schools to play football at the same division level as their other sports?  Well, some supported it, and some didn't.  The NCAA makes a lot of changes without the unanimous support of D-I.

It is myopic to believe that all D-I schools are in lockstep with South Dakota State.  In fact, many in I-AA have been denied access to the playoffs for 12 years.  They will support change.  Most of D-II isn't fully funded.  They will support change.  The schools with top D-II football programs will also support change.

This idea may get held up in a committee, but if it ever comes to a vote, the support will be there.

Really!!!!!!! I dont think so.

[89rabbit]

Re: NCAA rule changes

If you like what Roger is talking about, I think you need to be able to answer these questions.

1.  What is broke with the current system for a majority of NCAA schools?  

2.  How does what Roger is proposing fix what is broken for a majority of NCAA schools?

3.  Are you ok with EVERY school in the nation (and this includes NAIA) playing D-I sports in Football, and Basketball and D-III in everything else?   If so please explain how that is a benefit for a majority of the current D-I members of the NCAA.

4. If D-I football has a problem that needs to be fixed, why are all the members of the task force from D-II?

Go State!  ;D

[Lurking_Dog]

Re: NCAA rule changes

89, I'm not following your references to D-III, NAIA, etc. The proposal is limited to football and limited to Division II and I-AA.

This would create postseason opportunities for at least 100 programs (80% in D-II) that either can't afford a competitive number of scholarships in D-II or are completely locked out of the postseason in I-AA. Given these numbers, D-II is obviously going to be the group developing a legislative proposal.

Don't tell them to leave and go to the NAIA. This is their NCAA. They will take it back.

[Lurking_Dog]

Re: NCAA rule changes

...plus the approximately 75 schools in playoff conferences don't want so-called mid-majors like Drake in their classification. They are absolutely hysterical about getting rid of them. So, I think there is I-AA support beyond those directly affected.

[SDSUFAN]

Re: NCAA rule changes

Ahh I just recalled, Lurking Dog is our friend from Drake.
I be willing to bet if Drake returned to regular scholarship football, they would be in the playoffs. Why some of these schools want to go the non scholarship route is beyond me. ???

[Lurking_Dog]

Re: Scholarships for Drake football

The money isn't there.

To Drake's credit, they didn't throw in the towel like Pacific, Santa Clara, and dozens of other private schools. But money for 63 scholarships does not exist at Drake.

Maybe 15-20 scholarships...why bother when the limit is 63?

[Lurking_Dog]

Re: NCAA rule changes

Anyone see the story on D-I and D-II athletic budgets on ncaa.org?

They say expenditures exceed revenues by an average of about $3.7 million in I-AA, "when institutional support is removed." In other words, most athletic departments at I-AA schools lose $3.7 million and require a subsidy from general fund, endowment, or other sources.

That loss is $1.6 million at D-II schools with football.

http://www2.ncaa.org/media_and_event...enses_rls.html

'Sheds some light on North Dakota's football proposal, doesn't it?

BTW, the period for submitting NCAA legislation starts Sunday and continues through July 15.

[FargoBison]

Re: NCAA rule changes

I don't really see the point in adding 5 D2 schools to IAA if those few D2's want to play IAA football they should move up to division one. I wish D2 would try to seperate it's division into D2A(36-24 scholarships) and D2AA(24-0) because that would make a lot more sense and would solve D2's problems much more effectively.

As for the low scholarships and non-schalorship IAA's I would either like to see them added into an expanded IAA playoffs(24 teams) or maybe the NCAA should let them play down a division. Letting the non and low scholarships IAA play down makes more sense then what D2 is wanting now.

[bisonguy]

Re: NCAA rule changes

Lurking Dog,

How do you feel about the NCAA Board of Directors agreeing to evaluate regular-season and postseason opportunities for low and nonscholarship programs?

Wouldn't that possibly take care of the needs of the 'mid-major' I-AA schools' needs?

btw- the proposal from DII will be discussed over the next year, and then they'll have to get somebody in DI-AA to propose the legislation.

[Lurking_Dog]

Re: NCAA rule changes

They are always evaluating. Occasionally, legislation has been proposed. There's been lots of empty talk over the past 12 years.

And no, that doesn't take care of their needs.