Summit League to Visit USD

[rabidrabbit]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

DU is a good travel partner for SUU, as Denver to Vegas flights are readily available and direct.

Unless going charter, nobody is flying into Cedar City. Instead into Vegas, then drive 3 to 4 hours.

Much better than marrying SUU with NDSU or UND or Western IL.

Only Chicago and Detroit (Oakland) or UMKC make partner sense for SUU because of the travel.

[zooropa]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I don't see the WCC interested in DU for several reasons:

1) Horrible basketball program -- WCC lives by its March Madness checks, and DU doesn't help.

2) Travel distances ('nuff said)

3) WCC's incredibly stable makeup--IIRC they haven't added or lost a member in almost 30 years.

Conference USA is right out because, let's face it, they don't care about schools that aren't players in the revenue sports. They want to be BCS level in sports that make money.

Big West might be a possibility, though.... But travel costs would be something, IIRC the Big West is now, basically, a bus conference among the various UC-somewhere/Cal State-somewhere schools, and Pacific.

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Therefore, I would argue that an enhanced Summit (with UND and USD), if you'll follow my train of thinking on 'enhanced' becomes more attractive:

With UND & USD, you'll have five schools in the Summit that have graduate programs in medicine and law (UMKC, Oakland & IUPUI being the other three), and you'll have two Phi Beta Kappa schools--potentially five, depending on whether UMKC, IPFW & IUPUI students can gain admittance based on their relationship to Indiana, Purdue, and Mizzou.

Also, the Dakota schools (and Oakland) have exceptionally good academic credentials for their student athletes, with SDSU having, arguably, one of the strongest athletic programs in the country in terms of academic acheivement.

Finally, Denver is extremely unlikely to get invited into any other conference that has, as members, flagship institutions.

Say what you will about the comparative size of South Dakota & North Dakota, but the fact remains that SDSU and NDSU are peers of Penn State, Purdue, Clemson, Auburn, etc. in terms of heritage and origin. They are all charter land grant colleges.

While the graduate profile of the public schools in the Dakotas isn't as strong as the graduate profile at Big Ten, Big 12, and Pac 10 institutions, the undergraduate profile is remarkably stout. The Dakota school undergraduates have high academic profiles overall.

From standpoints outside of athletics, adding the other two Dakota schools makes the Summit stronger, and the decision to add NDSU & SDSU bolsters the stature of the Summit.

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But, of course, this is all hot air......

[Nidaros]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I have had my reservations about USD and UND joining the Summit, but after reading through Terry Vandervec's live blog yesterday, Terry made a great point. Some of the current Summit members do not have big drawing crowds. He cited Oakland and IPFWU as two that drew barely 700 people for their games. UND and USD would do better than that and I think its true. The Dakota's have much more of a Only game in Town attraction than anyone else. I believe this what has captured the interest of Tom Douple. Numbers and attendence and money are all very important maybe sometimes more than actual competition itself.

I also wonder what the long term affect of the UND snub will have on keeping the logo. The ghost of Ralph has too much to say in GF. Its nice to have big boosters, but for the entire agenda to center around their donations, makes it hard to operate as a public university serving the state and surrounding area.

[Jacks-02]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Terry comments about possible expansion in his blog today.

http://www.argusleader.com/apps/pbcs...rgusleader.com

Also provides link to an article discussing NDSU/UND from the Fargo Forum.
http://www.in-forum.com/Sports/articles/227147

Interesting comments from Douple in the article. Got a chuckle out of this one:
"Douple said he received “nasty” e-mails from UND supporters on Wednesday after his comments became public."

Smart move there UND fans. Write nasty e-mails to the commissioner of the conference you are trying to gain entrance to, I'm sure that will change his mind and make him want to add you

[BTownJack]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Terry comments about possible expansion in his blog today.

http://www.argusleader.com/apps/pbcs...rgusleader.com

Also provides link to an article discussing NDSU/UND from the Fargo Forum.
http://www.in-forum.com/Sports/articles/227147

Interesting comments from Douple in the article. Got a chuckle out of this one:
"Douple said he received “nasty” e-mails from UND supporters on Wednesday after his comments became public."

Smart move there UND fans. Write nasty e-mails to the commissioner of the conference you are trying to gain entrance to, I'm sure that will change his mind and make him want to add you

Wow...some pretty interesting reads there. Especially the Fargo Forum article. I'd highly suggest checking both out! This is going to get way more interesting before it settles down.

[SDSF]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I also wonder what the long term affect of the UND snub will have on keeping the logo. The ghost of Ralph has too much to say in GF. Its nice to have big boosters, but for the entire agenda to center around their donations, makes it hard to operate as a public university serving the state and surrounding area.

UND has no say in determining the course of action at this point. This may speed things up but everything is being controlled by the State Board of Higher Education. The settlement with the NCAA technically allowed for three options: keep name with permission, change the name by early 2011 (?), keep the name and face the full wrath of the NCAA... Most individuals who follow this know that options 1 and 3 are very unlikely. So expect some type of statement this fall or sooner saying that the nickname is changing. A new name will become official at some time the following year. Actually, this is all very old news. - I was very surprised that the Summit League commissioner was not more knowledgeable about the topic in general.

I also think you are giving Ralph way too credit on this one.. this issue has been around since the late 1960's... it was only a matter of time.. that is why I want to see the change. So, we can move on..

[joeboo22]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

UND has no say in determining the course of action at this point. This may speed things up but everything is being controlled by the State Board of Higher Education. The settlement with the NCAA technically allowed for three options: keep name with permission, change the name by early 2011 (?), keep the name and face the full wrath of the NCAA... Most individuals who follow this know that options 1 and 3 are very unlikely. So expect some type of statement this fall or sooner saying that the nickname is changing. A new name will become official at some time the following year. Actually, this is all very old news. - I was very surprised that the Summit League commissioner was not more knowledgeable about the topic in general.

I also think you are giving Ralph way too credit on this one.. this issue has been around since the late 1960's... it was only a matter of time.. that is why I want to see the change. So, we can move on..

I think it may be one of 2 things, 1 they have a different reason and are using it as a an excuse to say UND we don't like you now, but in a few years we might need you so the reason we don't like you is for this reason that will be old news by the time we need you if we need you to join the conference(if that made any sense).... Or it could be more in line with the attitude some of the officials/alum at UND are taking over the whole situation.... I don't blame them too a point because nobody wants to change a logo yet a lone a mascot name... You ask some SDSU alum and they'll say that they wish they could of kept bugs bunny's cousin as there logo.... but at the same point the NCAA has spoke and even common fans know that the NCAA is worse then the IRS when it comes to punishment, and doesn't care about your side of the situation....

[FargoBison]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandre...ege/items/1371

Did anyone else know that Denver is rated that highly academically? Schools like Denver are what we need to be looking at, not Chicago State. Give me Denver, UND, and USD, that trio is without a doubt what is best for the future of the league.

[KUlawJack]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandre...ege/items/1371

Did anyone else know that Denver is rated that highly academically? Schools like Denver are what we need to be looking at, not Chicago State. Give me Denver, UND, and USD, that trio is without a doubt what is best for the future of the league.

Lots of times academics are a small part of the puzzle in those rankings, especially for something as arbitrary as the US NEWS rankings. That said, DU is a great university and would be a great addition academically to the Summit.

[joeboo22]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Lots of times academics are a small part of the puzzle in those rankings, especially for something as arbitrary as the US NEWS rankings. That said, DU is a great university and would be a great addition academically to the Summit.

The one problem with Denver is they don't offer the whole slate of sports that the summit sponsers (neither does USD though either).... I think DU would be a great addition...

[NorCalJack]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Big Sky visit SDSU and NDSU early in our transition? How did that work out for us? A site visit does not guarantee anything.

[zooropa]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Big Sky visit SDSU and NDSU early in our transition? How did that work out for us? A site visit does not guarantee anything.

I don't think the Big Sky visited---or if they did it was a mere formality.

In fact, SDSU & NDSU were rather pointlessly optimistic, IMO, about the Big Sky---they are a LONG ways from any Big Sky school, and the fact that the conference itself is spread out over, seemingly, half the US, doesn't necessarily mean that they wanted to add another two teams that were about 500 miles from the closest conference school.

OTOH, the USD visit is incredibly comprehensive, and I think TV is spot on in his blog--the visit is so that the Summit presidents can vote on membership at the tournament and announce the invite in Sioux Falls--with a proviso that USD will be accepted after their commitment to the GW is fulfilled (and just before they're fully eligible for tournament participation)

[zooropa]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

The one problem with Denver is they don't offer the whole slate of sports that the summit sponsers (neither does USD though either).... I think DU would be a great addition...

I don't necessarily see that as a problem for existing members.

In fact, it may be a plus in that they're not 'another shark in the pool' fighting for the same tournament bids and championships.

[joeboo22]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I don't necessarily see that as a problem for existing members.

In fact, it may be a plus in that they're not 'another shark in the pool' fighting for the same tournament bids and championships.

ya, I'm sure that the only really thing the conference cares about is basketball because its the only one that makes money, but I thought maybe the schools in the conference would be hesitant to invite a school that would only offer a few of the sports....

[zooropa]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

ya, I'm sure that the only really thing the conference cares about is basketball because its the only one that makes money, but I thought maybe the schools in the conference would be hesitant to invite a school that would only offer a few of the sports....

Well, DU does nothing to advance the conference's profile in basketball either, but think about it in terms of self-interest:

You're Southern Utah, USD, or NDSU--one of your key strengths is your track and field program (assuming USD gets the invite, and barring some major meltdown, I think it's practically a foregone conclusion). If DU comes up for membership that's one less thing to worry about. DU is not going to challenge Oral Roberts' baseball program, SUU's cross country program or NDSU's track and field program for Summit supremacy.