Summit League to Visit USD

[Cowbell]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I would like to be a mouse in the corner when the USD officials explain their financial qualifications to join any new league. All corporate sponsorships to colleges will suffer the next few years. Donor gifts will go down dramatically as people reflect on their ability to give contributions to any non-profit or educational group. Universities have lost 25-35% of their portfolios the last few months. Given the fact that most regional schools offer programs similar to the Jackrabbit Guarantee, university officials are now scrambling to meet those obligations. Ticket revenue, already low at USD, will be further reduced as companies and individuals give up their season tickets. These are facts.

So, in the end, Commissioner Douple must ask every possible new school: "Show me the money."

By the way, it isn't going to be a fun time for SDSU, either.

[Nidaros]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Without a doubt SDSU and every educational institution is going to be hurt by our current economic downturn. NDSU and UND have both put out press releases that in general less scholarship money will be available in the coming year due to investment returns being anything but positive on foundation assets. We only have to verify that by looking at our own IRA's and 401k's. But by summer things could turn around. Thats what I am hoping.

I am thinking maybe the economic downturn could also work to USD advantage in those 177 meeting scheduled with the Summit officals. Who knows?

[rabidrabbit]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

The following teams are SUMMIT CORE MEMBERS (been together 5 years & D-I institutions before rules change requiring 13 years to reach core status)

ORU
SUU
WIU
Oakland
IUPUI
UMKC

The following are CORE members, but haven't been with Summit for five years.

Centenary (after 2009, 5 year member)
IPFW (after 2012 5 year member)

Not Core, not SUMMIT adequate time.

SDSU (2016 core)
NDSU (2016 core)

Hammersmith/Filbert, please correct, but IIRC, must have 6 CORE members, playing together for 5 years to obtain an AQ for men's BB.

Chicago St, as an ex-Mid Con (Summit) member is both core, and has played these Summit teams so would be a slam dunk (provided they've resolved poisonous violation issues, that led to their choice to leave Summit before getting kicked out).

USD/UND won't be through to core until 2020.

Summit can afford to lose ONE but NOT TWO core members.

Yes, a major conferences shake up will occur in 2012-2013 as the Big East splits into two conferences. How that shakes up down the food chain will be interesting. Unfortunately for the Summit, it is at, or is near the bottom of the heirachy of conferences.

[West-River_Jack]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I think that the Summit League knows that a stable future includes the Dakotas. Too many of the other teams sit within or near the footprint of other conferences, and those conferences probably have a smaller geographic footprint than the Summit. I am surprised that this visit is coming during this transition year instead of later. Obviously, Mr. Douple is aware that he needs to plan ahead in this process.

I recall that the Summit League announced within the last year or two that it is in the process of encouraging improvements by its members. I know that someone can address this better than I can but I do seem to recall that improving the facilities and RPI of its member schools was part of it. I hope that someone will do so and perhaps address where USD can be expected to fall within this scenario.

I am betting that UND will be holding a meeting this week to see how fast they can speed up the resolution to that whole nickname/mascot mess. I wonder if there will be public statements or press releases or if they will just try to quietly expedite the process toward a quick resolution.

Lastly, I notice that my good friend CF and his contemporaries from USD have not posted on this thread. I am hoping that one or more of them will have some insight from someone in the know at USD about this topic.

[BTownJack]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

A more complete article in today's Argus:

Summit visit may rekindle rivalry
SDSU's conference to consider USD
Mick Garry • January 7, 2009

The idle rivalry between South Dakota's two largest universities will get one step closer to restarting when Summit League officials visit USD on a fact-finding tour this month.

The visit, announced Tuesday by USD and scheduled for Jan. 20-21 in Vermillion, is a necessary step toward a possible invitation to the conference.

Membership would mean the Coyotes would be able to resume rivalries with both SDSU and another conference member, North Dakota State.

Neither Summit League nor USD officials would comment on whether a visit ultimately would end in an invitation.

"We feel really good about it, but it's just another step - not the final step by any means," USD athletic director Joel Nielsen said. "I think, though, that we can make a strong case for the academic profile of our university and our geographic footprint fitting in with the current membership."

.....

Douple's contingent has conducted on-site visits at SDSU, NDSU and Indiana-Fort Wayne during his tenure. All eventually became Summit members. Any decision on USD's status will depend on the presidents, one of whom is SDSU's David Chicoine.

"I think all the presidents are in the position to look at every opportunity to strengthen the league," Chicoine said. "If in fact USD is in the position to strengthen the league, we would give collectively very serious consideration to them. We're a long ways from that point. They're just beginning the transition."

(read more)

[zooropa]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Bear in mind also that the NCAA can waive the core membership requirement for AQ status.

--

A couple things with USD:

They sponsor fewer sports than SDSU (which factors in their favor when it comes to membership), and AFAIK, their track and XC programs are pretty good (those are the two programs that they fast tracked).

--

Also, travel possibilities.....

USD & SDSU might be paired as travel partners with NDSU & UMKC paired (assuming SUU bolts and Centenary stays).

Then the UMKC/NDSU combo would be a plane flight travel pairing just like UMKC & SUU.

Alternatively, if Summit expansion includes Chicago State, (and assumes SUU drops out), then we're looking at an 'odd man out' conference rotation, and for that, NDSU becomes a single destination...

There you'd be looking at UMKC/WIU, SDSU/USD, ORU/Cent, IPFW/Oakland, IUPUI/Chicago State, with NDSU being the 'odd man out'

---

Bear in mind, when discussing conference realignment, that RPI is everything, and that leagues like the Horizon will probably not want to dilute their RPI with an IPFW or a WIU.

----

Of course this discussion could go on forever because there's darn few facts available.

[BTownJack]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Of course this discussion could go on forever because there's darn few facts available.

Exactly...so discussing possible travel parters, your idea of NDSU being the "odd man out," and SUU bolting somwhere is all conjecture at this point and not worth mentioning.

[zooropa]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Exactly...so discussing possible travel parters, your idea of NDSU being the "odd man out," and SUU bolting somwhere is all conjecture at this point and not worth mentioning.

Why isn't it worth mentioning?

Summit is all of a sudden very interested in USD------much earlier in the transition process than they were interested in SDSU, and apparently not because Chicoine is pushing the issue.

Something, it would seem, is up.

Centenary has repeatedly committed to D-1, and they're a counter after this year (per the 7-6-5 rule), so SUU could bolt for the Big Sky without requiring an NCAA waiver for the Summit's AQs.

IMO, SUU leaving is more likely than Centenary leaving, and that explains the sudden -=serious=- interest in USD.

[jackmd]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Why isn't it worth mentioning?

Summit is all of a sudden very interested in USD------much earlier in the transition process than they were interested in SDSU, and apparently not because Chicoine is pushing the issue.

Something, it would seem, is up.

Centenary has repeatedly committed to D-1, and they're a counter after this year (per the 7-6-5 rule), so SUU could bolt for the Big Sky without requiring an NCAA waiver for the Summit's AQs.

IMO, SUU leaving is more likely than Centenary leaving, and that explains the sudden -=serious=- interest in USD.

I don't think the interest in USD is sudden but I agree that the serious interest is being pressed forward by some uncertainty. That uncertainty isn't unique to the Summit League, it persists across most of the mid-majors and has since the shake up in the major conferences 3-5 years ago. Douple and the other core members aren't dopes. They need options in case certain things happen. USD is a viable option and more importantly an interested party.

[zooropa]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I don't think the interest in USD is sudden but I agree that the serious interest is being pressed forward by some uncertainty. That uncertainty isn't unique to the Summit League, it persists across most of the mid-majors and has since the shake up in the major conferences 3-5 years ago. Douple and the other core members aren't dopes. They need options in case certain things happen. USD is a viable option and more importantly an interested party.

Douple was just on the Sports Show--said that the league wants to be more proactive--that they may have been too reactive in the past.

Although, I'm not so sure that SIU-Edwardsville is that big of a miss--the OVC isn't a particularly good conference......

[joeboo22]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I really don't care if they offer a membership or not to USD.... I think it wouldn't hurt SDSU and NDSU, but at the same time I want what is best for the conference and with that I think there is better options out there. Chicago State, for instance.... I still think they should look at Denver University, or a Southland Conference team. I believe that the Argus is making a little bit bigger deal then it is, they make it sound like the league will offer them a membership tomorrow and they will be full fledged the following day and play SDSU this weekend... And its not going to happen I would say at the fastest they would be a member in 2 years....

[zooropa]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Denver U would be interesting--they're a Sun Belt school that doesn't sponsor football.

They've also got quite the academic pedigree.

And a logo that looks like a cherry pie with a piece missing (TV came up with that one).

[Coyote_Fan]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I don't have alot of time now to post but this news is lucky and good news for USD. Obviously this is only a visit and not an invitation but on the positive for USD people is that a visit is a very big step.

This could be a win win as far as I am concerned. This could get USD into the Summit and also get conference brass to strongly recommend an improvement in facilities at USD. If there is one thing that USD and SDSU fans agree on it's that USD needs a new basketball facility. That is a slam dunk opinion. I think after USD gets on more stable ground with funding scholarships they need to make a new arena a very high priority. I think it's only a mid level priory as far as everything I have heard.

[filbert]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I think one attractive scenario if Centenary is indeed on the way out would be the Summit adding USD, Chicago State, and Utah Valley.

Then, reorganize into two 6-team divisions (grouped by travel partners):
West:
NDSU
SDSU
USD
UMKC
SUU
UVU

East:
Oral Roberts
Chicago State
Western Illinois
IUPUI
IPFW
Oakland

Play a 16-game league schedule (10 home/home in division + single games vs. the other division). Gives you two more OOC game opportunities (revenue and/or home game).

This would work for me.

[West-River_Jack]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I think one attractive scenario if Centenary is indeed on the way out would be the Summit adding USD, Chicago State, and Utah Valley.

Then, reorganize into two 6-team divisions (grouped by travel partners):
West:
NDSU
SDSU
USD
UMKC
SUU
UVU

East:
Oral Roberts
Chicago State
Western Illinois
IUPUI
IPFW
Oakland

Play a 16-game league schedule (10 home/home in division + single games vs. the other division). Gives you two more OOC game opportunities (revenue and/or home game).

This would work for me.

Sounds reasonable. I don't know if you have split any traditional rivalries into opposite divisions or not. I assume that if there are 2 schools in opposite divisions that wanted to play a home and home that they could. If that happens, would tradition hold that each gome counts as one-half game in the standings or would one of the games be a non-counter as far as conference standings are concerned?