Article about andy moeller from omaha world herald

[OK_Jackrabbit]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

Congrats to UNO. I'll be rooting for the Mavs from here on out. They have a good thing going there in DII. The NCC is lucky to have them or that would be a really shaky conference.

Regarding all the bluster about 'playing for something,' etc. Can we back up a little and keep in mind that this isn't about Andy Moeller or any single player? SDSU athletics is bigger than one year or one player. UNO has a bright future in DII athletics and I'm happy for them. SDSU is building something in DI. Can we just accept both of those things and move on? Change is just a part of life. Our move to DI doesn't reflect poorly on UNO, which is a fine school with excellent athletics. And their success in DII has no relevance to SDSU's efforts to build something in DI.

[jack100]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

But the thing I find most disturbing is that coach nagy sacrificed this year and made those people who did show loyalty get their brains beat out by holding out the redshirts that people on this site continually say are really good. If he held players out who could have helped him this year - that is a shame to the current players. MOre likely we are just hearing more unrealistic and unbridled optimism about these redshirts and in all probability they weren't ready to contribute. I mean why not play them now if they are ready - they still have 3 more years after this. It seems like coach nagy is rather dejected about this season as are the fans and if you could have been better and chose not to be it is an odd choice. Most likely the redshirts are NOT ready for prime time.

I cannot count the number of times you and your buddies have made incorrect or uninformed comments. Do you have any idea what you are talking about or do you make it up as you go along?

Here's a question for you - when is SDSU's basketball team eligible for the NCAA postseason tournament? Answer - 2008-2009 season. Another question for you - what will be Cadwell's and Gilbert's eligibility be for that season? Answer - because they redshirted this year - they will be seniors for the 2008-09 season. These players came to SDSU because they wanted a chance at the big dance their final year. It is very unlikely that these players would have even come to SDSU if that chance did not exist.

After the game last night - Nagy said nothing against the senior class but as of tomorrow that the SDSU's team already has more talent than this year. He went on to say - the fans here got a good look at what the future's gonna be like.

You and your UNO buddies comments are ridiculous. You know nothing about the situation and are either too stupid or ignorant to learn more. I could make comments about UNO's recruiting but I would not know what was saying. This is a pattern with you guys and am sick of it. It is fine to be critical of SDSU - at least have your facts in order before you speak.

I am trying to figure out your motivation and desire to have SDSU fail. The only thing that keeps coming back to me is that when SDSU was in the NCC - no one at SDSU could have cared less about UNO and what they were doing. Maybe the fans at UNO thought SDSU was dissing them and giving them no respect. If that is the case, I will personally mail apology letters to all of these UNO fans that felt dissed. At least I will only have to mail out 3 letters - very few at UNO care about their athletic program much less SDSU's.

[OK_Jackrabbit]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

But the thing I find most disturbing is that coach nagy sacrificed this year and made those people who did show loyalty get their brains beat out by holding out the redshirts that people on this site continually say are really good.  If he held players out who could have helped him this year - that is a shame to the current players.

Oh, please. The university doesn't owe those players anything beyond putting them in a position to compete and giving them the opportunity to earn a degree. As I recall, these are student athletes. Pro athletes may get to pressure their organizations to pay or play certain players and set conditions for their participation. Student athletes don't have that right, nor should they have that expectation. Nobody owes them anything beyond an education and opportunity to compete, and they don't get to set the conditions of their educational or intercollegiate athletics experience. To suggest that they got shorted because Nagy redshirted other student athletes really plays into the worst ideas of what athletics is or should be. Ultimately, this is about education... something some people, in their zeal to win at all costs, seem to forget.

[bigjake]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

Another thing that could have happened to coach nagy this year is that he possibly underestimated the talent necessary to compete successfully in d1.  I suspect there is a learning curve for coaches to figure out the kind of talent they need and the kind of talent they can get in order to be successful.  I am a Husker fan and Barry Collier is on the fence here bc he has consistently underestimated the kind of players you need to compete in the BIg 12.  He has been recruiting players that you can win with at Butler but not in the Big 12 and maybe that is happening and will happen to coach nagy.  It will be interesting to watch bc there is no doubt coach nagy knew what it took to win in d2 but d1 is a whole new ball game where the stakes are much higher.
Okla_jackrabbit - I agree in theory. with your eloquent assessment of what players can expect from their univ.  But in reality if I was a player left behind trying to compete this year I would be rather angry about  busting my rear while help is right on the end of the bench that is not being used.
Jack100 - A lot of people around here do care about UNO. We were 3rd nationally last year in hockey attendance and we draw well for fb and bb get a 2k a game for league games. While it is not what it should be IMHO it is pretty good and a lot of people do care around here.

[OK_Jackrabbit]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

But in reality if I was a player left behind trying to compete this year I would be rather angry about  busting my rear while help is right on the end of the bench that is not being used.

Maybe so. I never played college basketball, so I really don't know what I would think in that situation. I would hope that I would do my best with what I had, knowing that I was lucky to be playing at all and getting an education at the same time. But these are 18- to 22-year-olds and that sort of perspective might not always be present.

[gojacksgo]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

Those senior guards may not be starting if SDSU didn't redshirt their freshmen. Maybe they look at it as they are getting playing time, and the team wouldn't have been all that great even with those guys, so why waste a year of eligibility. They may be happy that they got as much playing time as they did. It's not like they were short players at the beginning of the year....they fielded a full team, so some players had to either be cut or given a redshirt.

[Texas_Jacks_Fan]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

UNO has redshirted plenty of players over the years, Its the way college basketball is played, Fat Jake is just being a antagonist as usual. I wish Holdren had been redshirted also.

[gojacksgo]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

I kind of wish he would have been too, but just think of how much worse this team would have been...With him, we got a few wins at least - I'm not sure if SDSU would have won a game without him. If they would have won 2 or 3 games this year, that could have hurt recruiting badly.

[Texas_Jacks_Fan]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

gojacksgo,
you definetly have a point, we definetly would have lost more games(but not all of them), and it is possible that recruiting could be effected but not likely-IMO. I looked at every game this season almost as a scrimmage to gain experience for the future. Next year the games count. Holdren will be a great player redshirt or not!!

[JACKGUYII]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

Good players want to be part of good teams but they also want plenty of playing time. The jacks can offer recruits an opportunity to come in a play immediately.

[CatchEmAll]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

I'll take a different approach to the direction this has gone. A claim (of sorts) was made that Nagy owed it to his seniors to put the best players on the court even if that meant not redshirting some players. What about the redshirts though? Is it fair to play them when, 1. this was admitidly a down year, 2. there was no guarantee of playing time, and 3. by playing this year they would not have the opportunity to make the NCAA tournament (not guaranteed, but atleast have that as a possible outcome). The redshirts should get the same consideration as the seniors when it comes to looking at the big picture. Personally, my redshirt was pulled after two games my freshman year (football). I played mostly special teams and had limited time with the offense. Was this fair to me, hell no because I basically lost a year of eligibility. After the season was I pissed, yes. In hind-sight did it really cost me that much, no. I got my degree which is the whole point of college athletics at this level. If any of our seniors had NBA scouts drooling over them then maybe putting the best players on the court regardless of class (freshman, soph, etc.) would have been more necessary. At this point of their careers these seniors have experienced more than most and knew going in to the year that this would be a tough one. The survived and will all hopefully get their degree and have successful lives after SDSU. They will have fond memories, but 20 years from now I doubt they will be bitter that Nagy redshirted a few good freshmen.

[Texas_Jacks_Fan]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

Cant say it much better than that... From someone who knows...

[twism]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

Very well put Catchem All.

[SDSUFAN]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

Another thing that could have happened to coach nagy this year is that he possibly underestimated the talent necessary to compete successfully in d1.  I suspect there is a learning curve for coaches to figure out the kind of talent they need and the kind of talent they can get in order to be successful.  I am a Husker fan and Barry Collier is on the fence here bc he has consistently underestimated the kind of players you need to compete in the BIg 12.  He has been recruiting players that you can win with at Butler but not in the Big 12 and maybe that is happening and will happen to coach nagy.  It will be interesting to watch bc there is no doubt coach nagy knew what it took to win in d2 but d1 is a whole new ball game where the stakes are much higher.
Okla_jackrabbit - I agree in theory. with your eloquent assessment of what players can expect from their univ.  But in reality if I was a player left behind trying to compete this year I would be rather angry about  busting my rear while help is right on the end of the bench that is not being used.
Jack100 - A lot of people around here do care about UNO. We were 3rd nationally last year  in hockey attendance and we draw well for fb and bb get a 2k a game for league games.  While it is not what it should be IMHO it is pretty good and a lot of people do care around here.

This just shows how little Big Jake knows about Scott Nagy. Coach Nagy did his grad work at U OF Illinois and was a grad assistant under Lou Hensen long time Illinois coach and Big 10 legend. Plus on the staff was Scott's father Dick Nagy. The head assistant at Illionis at that time was Jimmie Collins, now head coach at U of ILLinios Chicago, which the Jacks played this year. So not for a second would Coach under-estimate D1 opponents, he knows as much if not more than UNO's McKinna.

In fact Scott has contacts with a number of D1 coaches so there is no way he could have done anything to correct this situation. Moeller leaves and there was no big discussion when he was released from his letter of intent from what I have heard. Matt Jones decided to give up basketball for health reasons so, I think Coach made the best decisions he could make. Steve Holdren and McKennize Casey appeared to be able to play and they were played.

There is one other thing Big Jake does not know either otherwise he would have kept his pie hole shut, and that is Nagy has a weekly meeting individually with each player and they discuss everything that is going on in their lives. He no doubt gave each new freshman an option of playing or red shirting. Casey was a walk on so I can see him grabbing the opportunity to play this year but not sure about Holdren. With his mono bout, he may get his red shirt year in too and be eligible for the big dance season in 2008-09. Of course he will never get the opportunity to play in that dump called Sapp Fieldhouse. ;D
UNO thats a card game ;D ;D ;D ;D

[gojacksgo]

Re: Article about andy moeller from omaha world he

I thought you could only play in 25% of the games in order to get your red shirt. I may be wrong, but Holdren played much more than that if that is true. You are right though. He didn't underestimate the players ability this year. His 2 best players didn't play this year - I just want to say I don't mind that Moeller left. He did what he thought was best for him, but Nagy did what was best for SDSU - redshirted players that maybe weren't quite ready to play yet. No harm in that.