USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

[NightHawk78]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

I heard UNO is anxious to play a D-1 team close to them maybe this USD thing will work out for USD after all.

The 'Yotes move up to D-1 may be the chance that the Torenos (the other USD-San Diego- for those of you in Sanborn County) get to beat a team with FB scholarships. Or, Drake may decide to play them on occassion.......Valpo might even reconsider its decision to not play teams with FB schollies....

Of course, Mount Marty, Dakota Wesleyan, USF, Buena Vista and Morningside are just a short drive away from Verminville if they need to plug some holes in the schedule......

Oh, my.......I think it's time for a USD(d-1?) smack thread........

[filbert]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

How does USD moving up affect recruiting? If kids see both schools as D-1, we lose a lot in terms of a selling point. If we play them now and beat the living snot out of them, we can point out what a sham their recent suceess is. If we lose...OUCH. Maybe I'm thinking winning and losing have too much of an affect on a potential recruits decision. What do you guys think?

I agree with EQGuy . . . USD's announcement will have zero effect on our recruiting. We're already going up against the rest of D-I now for the student-athletes we're recruiting. We go after the student-athletes we want, in the recruiting territory we've staked out. We win some, we lose some. That's life in D-I.

The big difference between SDSU and USD now is that the Jackrabbit coaches can say that they're in a D-I conference with an automatic championship qualifier. That's been used against us in the past. Guess what? It'll get used against USD--not just by SDSU, but by every college that's recruiting athletes that are considering USD. That's part of the NCAA hazing ritual called "reclassification."

USD may also discover that their current student-athletes, especially their freshmen and red-shirts, are not all looking forward to the prospect of wandering in the reclassification wilderness, as we did. (Expect Wayne State, Northern, Augie, and other D-II programs in the Upper Midwest to have some really good years in certain sports as individual student-athletes do what they think is best for them--it happened to SDSU, there's no reason to think it won't happen to USD).

[RenoRabbit]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

Here is my first post so I have a lot to say.

What happens if SDSU and NDSU are invited and join the Gateway? There is no way the Gateway will add UND and USD (bringing the number of teams to 11) until their playoff illegibility is set in 5 years, if at all. The only reason they are looking at us is our success in transition, our playoff status, and mainly WKU leaving. They need a set number of teams to keep their auto bid.

With this news I think it will not be SDSU and NDSU seeking to keep the Great West afloat by adding the U's, but SUU, Cal Poly, and UC Davis begging us to add USD and UND even though we will not have an auto bid for a couple more years than if we join the Gateway. If we leave the conference they could add the U's, but they would be back to square one making scheduling a nightmare (AKA UW LaCrosse and William Penn). We might as well accept the fact that having the U's in our conference might not happen immediately, but it WILL happen.

Money talks and we cannot keep drawing 3K to BB games (with the new Mid-Con status it will help attendance), but we need the constant 6K+ to keep the programs somewhat profitable and the interest up. After all the BS that USD has said and done through our transition (UND did the same to NDSU) we no doubt want the U's to face the same struggles that we have went through. When it comes down to it we need the U's for MONEY, MONEY, and MONEY and that will make the decision on everything when the voting and decision are made.

The U's did not LEAD they FOLLOWED. Face it their transition WILL BE much easier than ours because WE paved the way! I would rather be a leader than a follower any day. As much as I want USD to have to go to BFE to play a bunch of games, EVERYONE on this board saying they do not want to play them will count the days, hours, and minutes to when we finally do. I know I will be at CAS and Frost when it does happen.

The U is like a hot ex-girlfriend. You broke up because you couldn't stand her, but you still booty call her when your drunk at 3AM. You use her and leave before you have to look at her in the morning.

RV -out-

[filbert]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

[quote author=thebluehatman link=1164833073/45#59 date=1164862672]I heard UNO is anxious to play a D-1 team close to them maybe this USD thing will work out for USD after all.

The 'Yotes move up to D-1 may be the chance that the Torenos (the other USD-San Diego- for those of you in Sanborn County) get to beat a team with FB scholarships. Or, Drake may decide to play them on occassion.......Valpo might even reconsider its decision to not play teams with FB schollies....

Of course, Mount Marty, Dakota Wesleyan, USF, Buena Vista and Morningside are just a short drive away from Verminville if they need to plug some holes in the schedule......

Oh, my.......I think it's time for a USD(d-1?) smack thread........[/quote]

Smack away here

[Dakota]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

SDSU announces they are in the process of signing an TV contract, they in the early afternoon the USD story breaks. Ya think there is a connection.


This TV deal would give the Jacks stae wide coverage, good for marketing. I like to see a Radio network and some more games on FM, (but it is a hard sell to FM)


Need More and better marketing from SDSU and with the new confrences things are going very well. IMO



Even though I would have rather seen USD stay DII, I say good luck to them and hope things go well.

[Haldersham]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

[quote author=ringthebells link=1164833073/45#55 date=1164862001]How does USD moving up affect recruiting?  If kids see both schools as D-1, we lose a lot in terms of a selling point.  If we play them now and beat the living snot out of them, we can point out what a sham their recent suceess is. If we lose...OUCH. Maybe I'm thinking winning and losing have too much of an affect on a potential recruits decision.  What do you guys think?

I agree with EQGuy . . . USD's announcement will have zero effect on our recruiting.  We're already going up against the rest of D-I now for the student-athletes we're recruiting.  We go after the student-athletes we want, in the recruiting territory we've staked out.  We win some, we lose some.  That's life in D-I.

The big difference between SDSU and USD now is that the Jackrabbit coaches can say that they're in a D-I conference with an automatic championship qualifier.  That's been used against us in the past.  Guess what?  It'll get used against USD--not just by SDSU, but by every college that's recruiting athletes that are considering USD.  That's part of the NCAA hazing ritual called "reclassification."  

USD may also discover that their current student-athletes, especially their freshmen and red-shirts, are not all looking forward to the prospect of wandering in the reclassification wilderness, as we did.  (Expect Wayne State, Northern, Augie, and other D-II programs in the Upper Midwest to have some really good years in certain sports as individual student-athletes do what they think is best for them--it happened to SDSU, there's no reason to think it won't happen to USD).[/quote]

I too agree that USD in recruiting will not be an immediate concern mainly because we have more financial resources and already have 4 years experience that USD does not happen. I think if you asked Stig today which he worried more about in terms of recruiting competition between USD and UND, he would tell you UND. The way I read Terry article's in the Argus today, its sounds as though USD is going to follow SDSU trail pretty close as they have no options because of there not being 10 million bucks to throw at the problem. Even for football if USD follows us to Arizona, I think having a full ride to offer will win over a one half ride. Right now Arizonia kind of stands out with some of our better players. Batten Micah Johnson and Jimmy Rogers to name a few. I look for a few more from Arizonia this coming February. Our 7 win season against 1AA opponents will hlep also.

[Haldersham]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

Here is my first post so I have a lot to say.

What happens if SDSU and NDSU are invited and join the Gateway?  There is no way the Gateway will add UND and USD (bringing the number of teams to 11) until their playoff illegibility is set in 5 years, if at all.  The only reason they are looking at us is our success in transition, our playoff status, and mainly WKU leaving.  They need a set number of teams to keep their auto bid.  

With this news I think it will not be SDSU and NDSU seeking to keep the Great West afloat by adding the U's, but SUU, Cal Poly, and UC Davis begging us to add USD and UND even though we will not have an auto bid for a couple more years than if we join the Gateway.  If we leave the conference they could add the U's, but they would be back to square one making scheduling a nightmare (AKA UW LaCrosse and William Penn).  We might as well accept the fact that having the U's in our conference might not happen immediately, but it WILL happen.  

Money talks and we cannot keep drawing 3K to BB games (with the new Mid-Con status it will help attendance), but we need the constant 6K+ to keep the programs somewhat profitable and the interest up.  After all the BS that USD has said and done through our transition (UND did the same to NDSU) we no doubt want the U's to face the same struggles that we have went through.  When it comes down to it we need the U's for MONEY, MONEY, and MONEY and that will make the decision on everything when the voting and decision are made.  

The U's did not LEAD they FOLLOWED.  Face it their transition WILL BE much easier than ours because WE paved the way!  I would rather be a leader than a follower any day.  As much as I want USD to have to go to BFE to play a bunch of games, EVERYONE on this board saying they do not want to play them will count the days, hours, and minutes to when we finally do.  I know I will be at CAS and Frost when it does happen.  

The U is like a hot ex-girlfriend.  You broke up because you couldn't stand her, but you still booty call her when your drunk at 3AM.  You use her and leave before you have to look at her in the morning.

RV -out-

Agree with the Gateway scenario. As far as basketball attendence, the only cure is not more cowbell, but more hands ringing those cowbells. The cowbell ringers will show up in the 6k range when we have good products on the floor. For the Women we are close and our men are a few years back,but are making progress. The comment made by Dr Oien in the artlce about USD also has some bearing, namely as an independant we dont have much choice in dates and who we play. This has affected fans who are within driving distance from Brookings. With the Mid Con schedule, there will be more consistency with Thursday-Saturday games and Friday-Sunday game. I thing SDSU is in the drivers seat. USD seems to think its all a piece of cake, but they will not know what the challenges are until they get in the games.

I compare USD to the guy who sits two seats from me and is very vocal, to the extend that he stands and makes statements that contain profain adjectives and directs them to our very young men players and and occasionally to the refs. I would love to hand him a pair shoes, jock and a uniform and tell him to get into the game to show us how he could do better. This how I see USD right now. They need to show SDSU that they can do better, but I have my doubts as I do with my fellow fan with the foul mouth.

BTW the Sunday article also mention ticket revenue for all sports for SDSU might reach $700,000 which means it funds about 10 per cent of the total budget that is nearly 8 million. So other sources are important too, even 10 bucks from Reno Neveda would help. I guess my point is that ticket revenue does not always pay the way except at U of Nebraska and a few other places like that. We got a long ways to go but we are 5 years ahead of USD.

[1stRowFANatic]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

I have a few comments regarding this scenario:

1.  Do they REALLY have the money to do this?  We're not exactly having an easy time with the fundraising that's necessary.  They have far fewer alums...although the average salary may be higher with the doctors and lawyers.

This is what I've gleamed from current/former development personnel at SDSU, USD, Augie, Morningside, MN-Moorhead. Athletic dept donations are very strongly coordinated to undergraduate attendance, while having professional schools will help some, most athletic donations come from undergrad alums. While I can't speak about the medical school, I can tell you that most engineering grads from SDSU start make a lot more money than most of the law school grads start out at.

However, I wish USD the best of luck and assume we will be playing them at sometime in the future, too much money to be ignored forever. When Louisville and Kentucky renewed their games, most people wondered why they waited so long.

[MilwaukeeJacksAlum]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

How does USD moving up affect recruiting?  If kids see both schools as D-1, we lose a lot in terms of a selling point.  If we play them now and beat the living snot out of them, we can point out what a sham their recent suceess is. If we lose...OUCH. Maybe I'm thinking winning and losing have too much of an affect on a potential recruits decision.  What do you guys think?

I don't think USD's movement affects us much, if at all, for quite a while. Pre-D1, the recruiting heirarchy in the Dakotas was generally NDSU/UND #1/2 (and by a ways unfortunately) and then SDSU a solid #3 with USD a distant #4 and Augie a close 5th to USD's 4. If there was a good athlete in ND, he was going to either UND or NDSU almost exclusively. If there was a good athlete in SD, he was going to one of the ND schools or SDSU with SDSU probably leading the way. SDSU also did a good job of recruiting the twin cities/western MN and Norther NE and IA. USD was left looking for athletes primarily from Iowa and other outside states. Look at the rosters back in the late 90's. USD's roster was littered with transfers and Iowa players. The rare recruit chose USD over SDSU and that was usually due to family history or something similar.

Now that we are in D1, we have jumped ahead of UND and are firmly ahead of USD in recruiting. Augie has become a non-factor. For one, only SDSU and NDSU were offering full rides (most D2 schools scholies are only partial rides) until UND this season. Also, both SDSU and NDSU have more scholies to throw around. Finally, with this season, SDSU and NDSU can honestly and confidently proclaim that we are playoff quality schools at the D1AA level. I would put NDSU at number 1 in the area for recruiting, with us a close second, UND third and USD a distant 4th. USD is going to go right back to having trouble getting anything but the scraps for SD athletes. Whether USD likes to admit it or not, their recruiting success in the past 3 seasons had a lot to do with SDSU moving up and in becoming more selective in their recruits. USD saw a direct trickle down effect as a result. They will do so again, but will be facing D1AA athletes with the trickle downed recruits instead of D2 athletes (and many DIII).

This is not meant to be a knock on the athletes signing with USD. They have a ton of great athletes. I'm just saying we are and will continue to win the recruiting battle and will generally be fighting with NDSU, not USD, in potential recruits.

[Yote53]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

I think this is funny. Look at USD's roster. Our players have always and are still coming from Iowa, Nebraska, Cali, Fla, Minn, now Wisconsin, and not a whole lot from SD. Even our last recruiting class was heavy with non-SD's. It has alot to with location (IA/NE right on the border) and less to do with losing in SD to other schools. We don't emphasize SD as much. It is the truth. We pick up kids all over Iowaand NE who UI, UNL and ISU pass over .

Wes B (IA), Logan (FL), Dez Allison (FL), Shepard (CO), 13 of our 17 OL are from out of state. The list goes on.

Moving up won't hurt recruiting, it will only help it.

[Statebasketballfan]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

Logan and Allison probably wouldn't have been recruited in D-I down there....

I'm not going to trash anybody, but there is a very good reason why somebody as talented as Logan ended up at a D-II school in SD.

[jackrabbit1979]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

I think this is funny.  Look at USD's roster.  Our players have always and are still coming from Iowa, Nebraska, Cali, Fla, Minn, now Wisconsin, and not a whole lot from SD.  Even our last recruiting class was heavy with non-SD's.  It has alot to with location (IA/NE right on the border) and less to do with losing in SD to other schools.  We don't emphasize SD as much.  It is the truth.  We pick up kids all over Iowaand NE who UI, UNL and ISU pass over .

Wes B (IA), Logan (FL), Dez Allison (FL), Shepard (CO),  13 of our 17 OL are from out of state.  The list goes on.

Moving up won't hurt recruiting, it will only help it.

You are truly "South Dakota's Team".... :

[BTownJack]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

[quote author=Yote53 link=1164833073/60#69 date=1164925658]I think this is funny.  Look at USD's roster.  Our players have always and are still coming from Iowa, Nebraska, Cali, Fla, Minn, now Wisconsin, and not a whole lot from SD.  Even our last recruiting class was heavy with non-SD's.  It has alot to with location (IA/NE right on the border) and less to do with losing in SD to other schools.  We don't emphasize SD as much.  It is the truth.  We pick up kids all over Iowaand NE who UI, UNL and ISU pass over .

Wes B (IA), Logan (FL), Dez Allison (FL), Shepard (CO),  13 of our 17 OL are from out of state.  The list goes on.

Moving up won't hurt recruiting, it will only help it.

You are truly "South Dakota's Team".... :[/quote]

I have to 2nd that thought in response to this post! Good work!

[MilwaukeeJacksAlum]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

I think this is funny.  Look at USD's roster.  Our players have always and are still coming from Iowa, Nebraska, Cali, Fla, Minn, now Wisconsin, and not a whole lot from SD.  Even our last recruiting class was heavy with non-SD's.  It has alot to with location (IA/NE right on the border) and less to do with losing in SD to other schools.  We don't emphasize SD as much.  It is the truth.  We pick up kids all over Iowaand NE who UI, UNL and ISU pass over .

Wes B (IA), Logan (FL), Dez Allison (FL), Shepard (CO),  13 of our 17 OL are from out of state.  The list goes on.

Moving up won't hurt recruiting, it will only help it.

Riiiiiight. That's the reason you don't recruit SD athletes. It has nothing to do with the fact that USD historically couldn't get them to come down to Vermillion. It's all a choice. Kind of like when someone slips on the ice and gets up saying "I meant to do that." Sure. It was a sure-fire, problem free recruiting strategy, I'll give you that. I mean, USD clearly didn't need all those SD athletes that SDSU signed. Just look at the last 20 years' records of the USD/SDSU game. Clearly SDSU could learn something USD's recruiting methods. I mean, when we absolutely dominated the last 10 years of meetings between the schools it was obviously a cry for help to those IA, NE (and don't forget FLORIDA!)athletes that we missed out on to maybe give us one more shot, just ONE MORE SHOT when recruiting. Typical short sighted response from a USD fan. I just wonder how you'll get anything done in Vermillion with all the butterflys around and birds chirping and chickens laying golden eggs and the 365 days of sunshine with 80 degree weather and where all the students are the smartest in the nation and all the athletes are the best in the nation and there are no budget problems and of course no problems with Title IX and definitely no problems with finding a conference and SDSU and NDSU will be begging you to play a 5 for 1 (that's 5 at USD and 1 at Sioux Falls with USD getting all the gates at Sioux Falls) deal for football and basketball and there definitely, DEFINITELY won't be a problem with recruiting. Can someone please clean my rose colored glasses? I seemed to have sullied them when I sneezed out that "BULL$HIT".

[filbert]

Re: USD (Coyotes) Go D-I

[quote author=Yote53 link=1164833073/60#69 date=1164925658]I think this is funny. Look at USD's roster. Our players have always and are still coming from Iowa, Nebraska, Cali, Fla, Minn, now Wisconsin, and not a whole lot from SD. Even our last recruiting class was heavy with non-SD's. It has alot to with location (IA/NE right on the border) and less to do with losing in SD to other schools. We don't emphasize SD as much. It is the truth. We pick up kids all over Iowaand NE who UI, UNL and ISU pass over .

Wes B (IA), Logan (FL), Dez Allison (FL), Shepard (CO), 13 of our 17 OL are from out of state. The list goes on.

Moving up won't hurt recruiting, it will only help it.

Riiiiiight. That's the reason you don't recruit SD athletes. It has nothing to do with the fact that USD historically couldn't get them to come down to Vermillion. It's all a choice. Kind of like when someone slips on the ice and gets up saying "I meant to do that." Sure. It was a sure-fire, problem free recruiting strategy, I'll give you that. I mean, USD clearly didn't need all those SD athletes that SDSU signed. Just look at the last 20 years' records of the USD/SDSU game. Clearly SDSU could learn something USD's recruiting methods. I mean, when we absolutely dominated the last 10 years of meetings between the schools it was obviously a cry for help to those IA, NE (and don't forget FLORIDA!)athletes that we missed out on to maybe give us one more shot, just ONE MORE SHOT when recruiting. Typical short sighted response from a USD fan. I just wonder how you'll get anything done in Vermillion with all the butterflys around and birds chirping and chickens laying golden eggs and the 365 days of sunshine with 80 degree weather and where all the students are the smartest in the nation and all the athletes are the best in the nation and there are no budget problems and of course no problems with Title IX and definitely no problems with finding a conference and SDSU and NDSU will be begging you to play a 5 for 1 (that's 5 at USD and 1 at Sioux Falls with USD getting all the gates at Sioux Falls) deal for football and basketball and there definitely, DEFINITELY won't be a problem with recruiting. Can someone please clean my rose colored glasses? I seemed to have sullied them when I sneezed out that "BULL$HIT".
[/quote]

Now that, my friends, is a RANT.