Why USD CAN go DI.

[SUPERBUNNY]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

I've said it numerous times on this board, thank goodness we've had the administration that we have to not only have researched the move to D-I thoroughly but to succesfully guide us this far through the transition and help us find homes for all of our sports!

This is big time stuff and deserves due dillegence from the administration at USD. I feel I know enough about the process SDSU went through and I just don't see how it can work for USD without a massive infusion of cash immediately and on an on-going basis. Scholarships, facilities, and staff would need to be increased by huge amounts and that doesn't cover anything outside of athletics.

My guess is CatchEmAll is onto something because I don't believe even a hand-picked rubber-stamp committee could look at this deal and sign off on it unless there is a huge amount of cash coming from somewhere. I could be dead wrong but I don't think so.

Best of luck to USD on their search for "the right place". They are in a tough spot and I hope it all turns out well.

SUPERBUNNY

[Rabbitlivinginverm]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

It's my opinion that USD will declare their intent to reclassify to DI. I also think it will be good for SDSU if the do make the move. But, I don't think they'll be successful financially. How tough must things be in the Athletic Department if they have to bus 13 hours to a road game against UCA? That would be like us busing to UNC. I don't know when the last time that would have happened. I think Neilson and Abbot are good leaders for USD and hopefully they have their house in order...

[Coyote_Fan]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

Just to make a point. USD's budget is very close to where SDSU's budget was when they first announced their intentions to move up. Obviously SDSU had alot of work to do and so does USD if they decide to move up. The biggest difference is that USD's choice is as much being made for them as it is their own. They have nowhere to go because the NCC will soon be gone and they won't go to the MIAA or NSIC so the only step that is not considered a downgrade is to move up.

[CatchEmAll]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

Just to make a point.  USD's budget is very close to where SDSU's budget was when they first announced their intentions to move up.  Obviously SDSU had alot of work to do and so does USD if they decide to move up.  The biggest difference is that USD's choice is as much being made for them as it is their own.  They have nowhere to go because the NCC will soon be gone and they won't go to the MIAA or NSIC so the only step that is not considered a downgrade is to move up.  

Is the decision made for them because the MIAA and NSIC won't take USD as a member? Seems like the arrogance of the NCC being the superior conference isn't doing any favors for the remaining members as the NCC falls apart.  Or does USD have that big of a chip on it's shoulder that it sees itself as that much superior to the MIAA and NSIC schools?  Not taking a jab at USD (OK, a small one), just wondering what USD's position is on those two conferences, if they would even consider taking the yotes.

[Rabbitlivinginverm]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

Just to make a point.  USD's budget is very close to where SDSU's budget was when they first announced their intentions to move up.  Obviously SDSU had alot of work to do and so does USD if they decide to move up.  The biggest difference is that USD's choice is as much being made for them as it is their own.  They have nowhere to go because the NCC will soon be gone and they won't go to the MIAA or NSIC so the only step that is not considered a downgrade is to move up.  

I realize this....but, that was 3 years ago. I wonder how much our budget would have increased if we were still d2? IMO, I don't think it's good for USD that the 2006 USD budget in almost equal to the 2003 SDSU budget.

I also wonder why the MIAA or NSIC aren't options for USD? I guess I have to agree with Cathem's thoughts...

[Haldersham]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

It's my opinion that USD will declare their intent to reclassify to DI.  I also think it will be good for SDSU if the do make the move.  But, I don't think they'll be successful financially.  How tough must things be in the Athletic Department if they have to bus 13 hours to a road game against UCA?  That would be like us busing to UNC.  I don't know when the last time that would have happened.  I think Neilson and Abbot are good leaders for USD and hopefully they have their house in order...

Not trying to defend USD here, but I suspect some factors of flying vs busing came into play.

1. What was UCA guarentee? $10,000, or 30,000. This information is probably not for publlic consumption and I can understand AD and Admin people wanting not to flaunt this in public as it could have reprecussions.

2. I know from my own experience, from last month that a round trip between Sioux Falls and Houston was about 1350 for one person.
The comp price between Sioux City and Little Rock probably would be about the same or depending what the charter flight cost would be per person I suspect it would be in that $1000 to 1500 dollar range. Mulitply that times 55 players plus coaches and what have you and you soon have more cost than what you were guarenteed. A charter bus apparently fit the guarentee amount. This is why its so hard to put a schedule together. Lots of cost factors come into play.

The advantage of SDSU flights were that the charters were probably set up before the fuel crisis that we are apparently coming out of but I dont think USD had any choice but to bus. I don't think they would do that as a standard operating policy.

Agreed there are no deep pockets among the USD family coming forward to avoid bus trips and other things. so the D1 move to USD is going to be a rough road. Maybe there will be more passionate Coyote Fans with wide pocket books. We might be waking a sleep giant. ;D

I believe SDSU did ride the bus to UNC about 1981 as I have a good friend who was on that team and has told me that it was indeed a very long ride.
Also SDSU rode to Chadron Ne on a bus as it was much cheaper than flying from Sioux Falls to Rapid and taking a bus to Chadron.

[NightHawk78]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

We also have to remember that USD already had to add one plane trip to their schedule this year when the NCC added the two Washington teams as football affliates. I think that trip likely added $40K (or more) to the 'Yote travel budget and the decision to bus was likely made early on in order to help avoid the breaking the budget.

In addition, why would USD want to tap a donor for $25K to pay for a plane trip when they may need that same donor to make a $250K donation within the next year for a more important venture (like a move to D-1)? SDSU can't rely on the Lohrs or the Fishbacks everytime we have a particular need.......

[NorCalJack]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

1. What was UCA guarentee? $10,000, or 30,000. This information is probably not for publlic consumption and I can understand AD and Admin people wanting not to flaunt this in public as it could have reprecussions.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if we schedule a home and home with an opponent then neither team gets any guarantee.  We have a home and home with UCA so I don't think UCA gets any guarantee money.

A guarantee is only paid to the visiting team, if no return game is scheduled.  I would imagine that some guarantee money would also be paid if it was a 2 for 1.

[filbert]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

[quote author=Haldersham link=1150320172/180#185 date=1160660290]

1. What was UCA guarentee? $10,000, or 30,000. This information is probably not for publlic consumption and I can understand AD and Admin people wanting not to flaunt this in public as it could have reprecussions.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if we schedule a home and home with an opponent then neither team gets any guarantee. We have a home and home with UCA so I don't think UCA gets any guarantee money.

A guarantee is only paid to the visiting team, if no return game is scheduled. I would imagine that some guarantee money would also be paid if it was a 2 for 1.[/quote]

I read Haldersham's note as talking about UCA's guarantee to USD, but I could be wrong . . .

[CatchEmAll]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if we schedule a home and home with an opponent then neither team gets any guarantee.  We have a home and home with UCA so I don't think UCA gets any guarantee money.

A guarantee is only paid to the visiting team, if no return game is scheduled.  I would imagine that some guarantee money would also be paid if it was a 2 for 1.

Back in the days of the NCC there was a guarantee paid between schools when trips were made. It was a small amount, and zeroed out the following year, but the money was at least there for budget purposes. I would guess that SDSU and UCA are paying guarantees for a home and home just to help balance the budget each year and off set some costs of travel.

I don't think USD busing to UCA is that big of a deal personally. If they have other plane trips this year it makes sense to save some $$ as others have alluded to.

[Haldersham]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

We also have to remember that USD already had to add one plane trip to their schedule this year when the NCC added the two Washington teams as football affliates. I think that trip likely added $40K (or more) to the 'Yote travel budget and the decision to bus was likely made early on in order to help avoid the breaking the budget.

In addition, why would USD want to tap a donor for $25K to pay for a plane trip when they may need that same donor to make a $250K donation within the next year for a more important venture (like a move to D-1)? SDSU can't rely on the Lohrs or the Fishbacks everytime we have a particular need.......

I was just suggesting that could be an option for USD to pay the excess of flying over busing as it was a 12 hour stretch and its not good for those football legs. That briefness of flight travel time would most certainly would be the big advantage of flying. My point is that the cost to Little Rock and back by air probably did not fit the guarentee that UCA paid USD.  Your right though USD probably would not hit up a donor for flight expense because they need them down the road.


Catchem would know more about how these guarentees than most of us would. I have sat by or talked to Dr Oien a number of UNO games in Omaha, and I can recall atleast twice where he said" Excuse me, but I got to go pick up a check." And he proceed to the UNO press box So the budget balancing that Catchem mentioned is correct and I think it goes beyond the NCC and probably occurs with all home and home contracts. We often don't know what is all included in a contract and I repeat myself, that these contracts often make scheduling very difficult if not impossible some times.

The home and home may end up being a wash, but often travel money is needed and it seems very logical that teams would pay guarentee to the traveling team. I believe that is a common practice.

[Haldersham]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

[quote author=NorCalJack link=1150320172/180#187 date=1160667285][quote author=Haldersham link=1150320172/180#185 date=1160660290]

1. What was UCA guarentee? $10,000, or 30,000. This information is probably not for publlic consumption and I can understand AD and Admin people wanting not to flaunt this in public as it could have reprecussions.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if we schedule a home and home with an opponent then neither team gets any guarantee.  We have a home and home with UCA so I don't think UCA gets any guarantee money.

A guarantee is only paid to the visiting team, if no return game is scheduled.  I would imagine that some guarantee money would also be paid if it was a 2 for 1.[/quote]

I read Haldersham's note as talking about UCA's guarantee to USD, but I could be wrong . . . [/quote]

Yes I was referring to the UCA guarentee. Travel money has to come from some source, and often its the home team paying the away team. I dont UCA came to Sioux Falls on their own credit card. We will probably  have to pay for their charge to the credit card. Next year its the same deal only we receive and UCA pays. I say probably because we don't know whats in each contract.

[filbert]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

I don't know why I think this, but I think at least for conference games there's some sort of split of the gate proceeds between the home and away schools. Perhaps contracts for home-and-home arrangements have the same kind of gate proceeds split.

[filbert]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

Off topic replies have been moved to [link=http://www.sdsufans.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1160694256]This Thread[/link]

[Haldersham]

Re: Why USD CAN go DI.

I don't know why I think this, but I think at least for conference games there's some sort of split of the gate proceeds between the home and away schools.  Perhaps contracts for home-and-home arrangements have the same kind of gate proceeds split.

I think you are correct. Dont want to say more to make it off topic.