How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

[jackdaniel]

Re: 2015 recruiting

About the only thing I might agree with completely with granting colleges autonomy, if it doesn't put an unfair disadvantage on Institutions who have not tremendously benefited from the expoitation of student athletes monetarily (guilty by association?) like the power 5 have, is mandating that scholarship athletes be given scholarships for a full four years, not one as is the current method.

These power five conferences have stockpiled tons of money throughout the years of exploitation of student athletes, now they want to use these Ill gotten funds to drive out the completion for recruits and put burdens on less financially secure institutions who more or less were only following NCAA guidelines as far as offering anything other than basic scholarship help to student athletes?

The NCAA didn't fail the power five in the least, the Institutions they've failed are the ones who remained true to their Idea's and are now being forced to drop further behind the Power five with the NCAA's blessing.The NCAA is admitting their failure by kowtowing to the Power five (Institutions who understand Capitalism)When in a position of power, use that power to crush the completion,and gain what you really want,complete control.

The NCAA is a complete and utter failure, by abandoning the virtue of fairness to all and succumbing to the allure of greed, they have destroyed the very ideas they were founded to uphold....ironic isn't it?

Maybe it's not them, maybe they just lost control. Actually ,it's sad and disheartening to see your champion ,who was once great, fall.

[propar80]

Re: 2015 recruiting

About the only thing I might agree with completely with granting colleges autonomy, if it doesn't put an unfair disadvantage on Institutions who have not tremendously benefited from the expoitation of student athletes monetarily (guilty by association?) like the power 5 have, is mandating that scholarship athletes be given scholarships for a full four years, not one as is the current method.

These power five conferences have stockpiled tons of money throughout the years of exploitation of student athletes, now they want to use these Ill gotten funds to drive out the completion for recruits and put burdens on less financially secure institutions who more or less were only following NCAA guidelines as far as offering anything other than basic scholarship help to student athletes?

The NCAA didn't fail the power five in the least, the Institutions they've failed are the ones who remained true to their Idea's and are now being forced to drop further behind the Power five with the NCAA's blessing.The NCAA is admitting their failure by kowtowing to the Power five (Institutions who understand Capitalism)When in a position of power, use that power to crush the completion,and gain what you really want,complete control.

The NCAA is a complete and utter failure, by abandoning the virtue of fairness to all and succumbing to the allure of greed, they have destroyed the very ideas they were founded to uphold....ironic isn't it?

Maybe it's not them, maybe they just lost control. Actually ,it's sad and disheartening to see your champion ,who was once great, fall.

This is a great post. I will add that IMO with the the passage of this, college athletics will look completely different going forward. You thought the conference shake-up that has been going on was messy, get ready.
As someone that loves college sports I am fearful of what's to come of this...this is a door that I have a feeling we'll all look back on one that should've never been opened. Especially as fans of a smaller D1 school like SDSU.

Edit: and with that I just realized what thread I was in...sorry for the drift.

[GopherHole]

Re: 2015 recruiting

About the only thing I might agree with completely with granting colleges autonomy, if it doesn't put an unfair disadvantage on Institutions who have not tremendously benefited from the expoitation of student athletes monetarily (guilty by association?) like the power 5 have, is mandating that scholarship athletes be given scholarships for a full four years, not one as is the current method.

These power five conferences have stockpiled tons of money throughout the years of exploitation of student athletes, now they want to use these Ill gotten funds to drive out the completion for recruits and put burdens on less financially secure institutions who more or less were only following NCAA guidelines as far as offering anything other than basic scholarship help to student athletes?

The NCAA didn't fail the power five in the least, the Institutions they've failed are the ones who remained true to their Idea's and are now being forced to drop further behind the Power five with the NCAA's blessing.The NCAA is admitting their failure by kowtowing to the Power five (Institutions who understand Capitalism)When in a position of power, use that power to crush the completion,and gain what you really want,complete control.

The NCAA is a complete and utter failure, by abandoning the virtue of fairness to all and succumbing to the allure of greed, they have destroyed the very ideas they were founded to uphold....ironic isn't it?

Maybe it's not them, maybe they just lost control. Actually ,it's sad and disheartening to see your champion ,who was once great, fall.

I too think this is a great recruiting class! Uh, was that what you were talking about? It really was a great post and I love your passion for stating your position. I also really like pie, we haven't talked about that in this thread from what I can remember.

[jackdaniel]

Re: 2015 recruiting

I too think this is a great recruiting class! Uh, was that what you were talking about? It really was a great post and I love your passion for stating your position. I also really like pie, we haven't talked about that in this thread from what I can remember.

Thanks, sometimes words just come flooding out, Just my opinion and I'll have some of that pie also.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

Anybody feel free to correct my memory:

IIRC, in DII some conferences dictated lower than NCAA allowed scholarship levels to ensure a more level playing field among their members. Could the MVFC/Summit vote on this and make it mandatory that their members follow the same criteria? ie, the other 9 members vote against these measures and NDSU isn't allowed to offer this benefit to their athletes and remain in the leagues?

Not saying that I want that to happen or that it should happen or anything, just asking if - in theory - it could go down like that?

[propar80]

Re: How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

Anybody feel free to correct my memory:

IIRC, in DII some conferences dictated lower than NCAA allowed scholarship levels to ensure a more level playing field among their members. Could the MVFC/Summit vote on this and make it mandatory that their members follow the same criteria? ie, the other 9 members vote against these measures and NDSU isn't allowed to offer this benefit to their athletes and remain in the leagues?

Not saying that I want that to happen or that it should happen or anything, just asking if - in theory - it could go down like that?

i think you are right. I also think the FCS needs to institute this rule immediately. If you want to pay your football players beyond their scholarship then go ahead and move up and compete with the P5.

[scbison]

Re: How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

Serious non-smack Question. South Dakota as a state has a larger population than ND and has 2 D1 Universities just like ND. How can SDSU build a new stadium yet not want to fund this additional $500K per year? Both ND D1 colleges have said they are all in for their premier sports, football at NDSU, hockey at UND.

[goon]

Re: How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

Anybody feel free to correct my memory:

IIRC, in DII some conferences dictated lower than NCAA allowed scholarship levels to ensure a more level playing field among their members. Could the MVFC/Summit vote on this and make it mandatory that their members follow the same criteria? ie, the other 9 members vote against these measures and NDSU isn't allowed to offer this benefit to their athletes and remain in the leagues?

Not saying that I want that to happen or that it should happen or anything, just asking if - in theory - it could go down like that?

Maybe I dont remember correctly either, but I thought the ability to pay or give a cost of living stipend to players would be based and voted on my confrences and not just individual schools? Maybe there has been talk to do just school by school to decide, I havent paid close attention to it.

[Nidaros]

Re: How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

Serious non-smack Question. South Dakota as a state has a larger population than ND and has 2 D1 Universities just like ND. How can SDSU build a new stadium yet not want to fund this additional $500K per year? Both ND D1 colleges have said they are all in for their premier sports, football at NDSU, hockey at UND.

I don't think SDSU has issued any official stand on this matter at all. I think we can afford it, but dealing with the BOR is another matter.. Larger population? I don't think so. If oil prices regain some, the boom will continue. Seems like the Fargo Forum had a big feature about ND soon hitting the one million mark. SD even with SF growth will take a couple more decades to exceed one million. I can see why UND with the hockey program is for it. Some of their guys are in and out of the NHL. A real weird sport to follow. I think there are a bunch of issues here and they are not easily resolved.

[scbison]

Re: How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

I don't think SDSU has issued any official stand on this matter at all. I think we can afford it, but dealing with the BOR is another matter.. Larger population? I don't think so. If oil prices regain some, the boom will continue. Seems like the Fargo Forum had a big feature about ND soon hitting the one million mark. SD even with SF growth will take a couple more decades to exceed one million. I can see why UND with the hockey program is for it. Some of their guys are in and out of the NHL. A real weird sport to follow. I think there are a bunch of issues here and they are not easily resolved.

As of the 2010 census SD had 80K more people than ND. I doubt there have been 80K extra oil workers in Williston and Watford City.

College Hockey is the same as college baseball. Guys are drafted out of high school and decide; NCAA or Major Junior. If they go NCAA they can have to maintain the same amateur status as everyone else. There is the very few Crosby, Kane etc who go straight to the NHL, but it is vary rare.

[jack power]

Re: How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

Anybody feel free to correct my memory:

IIRC, in DII some conferences dictated lower than NCAA allowed scholarship levels to ensure a more level playing field among their members. Could the MVFC/Summit vote on this and make it mandatory that their members follow the same criteria? ie, the other 9 members vote against these measures and NDSU isn't allowed to offer this benefit to their athletes and remain in the leagues?

Not saying that I want that to happen or that it should happen or anything, just asking if - in theory - it could go down like that?

It's my understanding is that the conference could restrict it's members from offering stipends but i seriously doubt they will. I'm guessing that they will leave it up to the individual members.

[jack power]

Re: How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

Serious non-smack Question. South Dakota as a state has a larger population than ND and has 2 D1 Universities just like ND. How can SDSU build a new stadium yet not want to fund this additional $500K per year? Both ND D1 colleges have said they are all in for their premier sports, football at NDSU, hockey at UND.

Poor choice of words.I can assure you that nobody "wants" to add $500 K to their yearly athletic budget. That said,just because our AD is taking some time to consider all the options doesn't mean SDSU isn't willing to fund the extra cost.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

It's my understanding is that the conference could restrict it's members from offering stipends but i seriously doubt they will. I'm guessing that they will leave it up to the individual members.

Aren't conference decisions made by the school presidents and athletic directors? I certainly hope the MVFC doesn't become the FCS version of the Big 12 where Texas calls all the shots and everyone else is scewed...

Obviously, it would get complicated.

However, if enough schools say no to stipends, I can't say them just throwing their hands in the air and resigning themselves to non-competitive teams. Non-competitive teams threaten the financial viabilit of all their programs. They will either vote to restrict or drop football all together. USD, ISU-b, and WIU seem likely to not offer stipends outright.

[Hammersmith]

Re: How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

It's my understanding is that the conference could restrict it's members from offering stipends but i seriously doubt they will. I'm guessing that they will leave it up to the individual members.

There's contradictory info out there right now. The legislation that was added to the NCAA constitution back in October clearly says that anything the P5 does is also able to be done by the rest of DI at the discretion of the conference. So the conferences can choose to allow it, forbid it, or let each school decide on their own.

The legislation that was supposed to be voted on a couple weeks ago included the same language. (I posted a link to it earlier.) But I've also heard word that that resolution wasn't actually voted on. Someone who claimed to have a good source said things got very chaotic during the meeting. The representatives couldn't agree on the particulars of the case. So they just ended up voting on the concept of stipends rather than actual legislations. And they didn't keep to their own rules of order, so everything(including the votes) had to be pieced together after the fact. A mess that will need to be sorted out at the next meeting during the Final Four in April.

One other factor. There is currently at least one court case pending that involves accusations of collusion among schools and conferences to withhold benefits to student-athletes. Members of the NCAA are concerned that if conferences were to vote to forbid their members to allow stipends, it could hurt the case. It's possible that one reason the proposed legislation wasn't voted on in its current form was because of this fear. (This was the reason our AD made comments to the press that conferences would not be able forbid members from granting stipends.)

So, more questions than answers at this point.

[Nidaros]

Re: How long until Student-athletes become Athlete-students & get paid?

As of the 2010 census SD had 80K more people than ND. I doubt there have been 80K extra oil workers in Williston and Watford City.

College Hockey is the same as college baseball. Guys are drafted out of high school and decide; NCAA or Major Junior. If they go NCAA they can have to maintain the same amateur status as everyone else. There is the very few Crosby, Kane etc who go straight to the NHL, but it is vary rare.

2010 was five years ago. ND was starting to close the gap and they have since done that.