Joe Paterno Passes

[NorCalJack]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

So when I see the words Penn State, I think of Penitentiary State.

[NoVaJack]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

Of course, that same Bible verse also includes "Go, and sin no more." The one is meaningless without the other.

Context is everything, isn't it?

[filbert]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

He who is without sin shall cast the first stone.

Of course, that same Bible verse also includes "Go, and sin no more." The one is meaningless without the other.

[filbert]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

it is the beginning, not the end, of the pain for Penn State.

I see on Fox Business Network that Moody's is putting Penn State's debt rating on review.

when you let people in your organization get away with doing bad things, bad things can start happening to your organization.

NoVaJack is correct. For the organization named the Pennsylvania State University, the real pain is only beginning.

[Nidaros]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

I, too, am angry about the lack of basic morality in a few powerful men. I think the punishment was proper and it is the beginning, not the end, of the pain for Penn State.

But for the sake of argument, after listening to the announcement today, I was left wondering: How far does NCAA President Emmert's pious, after-the-fact declarations about the absolute imperative to not put university sports programs above students and kids and academic achievements really go?

What to do about the cult of Kentucky's rent-a-player basketball program? Surely that is atheltics above academics.

Should the worship of Alabama football over, say, Alabama's math department, end?

What of the NCAA-sanctioned pay scales that reward a football coach 10 times or 100 times what a damned good English or biology teacher is paid?

What of the billions in sports brand promotion that go into athletic programs, while tuition for kids paying their own way skyrockets and student debt approaches a trillon dollars?

And in the name of putting academics above athletics, what of the countless, countless cases where kids who are not academically qualified but athletically gifted get into top univerisites while kids who are more qualified, academically, do not? How far does Emmert's sermon go for these kids who can't run a 4.4 40? .

The NCAA showed today it can punish after the fact, but I point out that this esteemed organization came in after after someone else did the heavy lifting of oversight and prosecution. What is not mentioned enough is the list of heavy lifters who helped expose this includes the Pulitzer-prize-winning work of a young Penn State University graduate, whose accomplishments also tell a far different story about what a great university Penn State is.

Oh, for sure, the NCAA will have Penn State to kick around for years because of the actions of a few men. One of whom, I might add, was revered and held up as an example within the NCAA for years until someone else exposed him.

But will the NCAA now show it can govern in ways that remotely approach Emmert's high-minded rhetoric from today's pile-on?

Not holding my breath.

Excellent post. I am not a real religious person, but the words from Jesus Christ come to mind. He who is without sin shall cast the first stone. There is a need for soul searching among the membership of the NCAA. Granted innocent people have been hurt by the NCAA moves. I saw Mr Emmert on CBS Good Morning show, and he said the reason the death penalty had not been chosen for punishment was that it would have affected the hot dog vendor, the marching band and many others.

I have a feeling that the following of PS will respond in a supportive manner and they will get through this. I dont think it will be as bad as the South Carolina Coach who said "with the scholarship limits for the next four years, Penn State has been reduced to a D1AA school."

[NoVaJack]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

While I am not sure where I stand on the severity of the punishment or the Freeh Report, I do take some issue with the "lack of institutional control" argument people continue to throw out. In reality, there was complete institutional control from the top down here. The president, AD, and Coach Paterno controlled the entire situation to prevent any negative press or damage to the football program. They completely controlled the manner in which they dealt with the situation, even if it is utterly reprehensible.

I do feel sorry for students, faculty, and alumni who will feel the effects of this situation. However, I also agree with the need to break a culture of worship that gave those men who failed to report these crimes a sense that they were above the law and could decide for those children and society in general what punishment Sandusky should receive. Turns out, it was simply early retirement. That gives me the creeps like few other stories ever have.

I, too, am angry about the lack of basic morality in a few powerful men. I think the punishment was proper and it is the beginning, not the end, of the pain for Penn State.

But for the sake of argument, after listening to the announcement today, I was left wondering: How far does NCAA President Emmert's pious, after-the-fact declarations about the absolute imperative to not put university sports programs above students and kids and academic achievements really go?

What to do about the cult of Kentucky's rent-a-player basketball program? Surely that is atheltics above academics.

Should the worship of Alabama football over, say, Alabama's math department, end?

What of the NCAA-sanctioned pay scales that reward a football coach 10 times or 100 times what a damned good English or biology teacher is paid?

What of the billions in sports brand promotion that go into athletic programs, while tuition for kids paying their own way skyrockets and student debt approaches a trillon dollars?

And in the name of putting academics above athletics, what of the countless, countless cases where kids who are not academically qualified but athletically gifted get into top univerisites while kids who are more qualified, academically, do not? How far does Emmert's sermon go for these kids who can't run a 4.4 40? .

The NCAA showed today it can punish after the fact, but I point out that this esteemed organization came in after after someone else did the heavy lifting of oversight and prosecution. What is not mentioned enough is the list of heavy lifters who helped expose this includes the Pulitzer-prize-winning work of a young Penn State University graduate, whose accomplishments also tell a far different story about what a great university Penn State is.

Oh, for sure, the NCAA will have Penn State to kick around for years because of the actions of a few men. One of whom, I might add, was revered and held up as an example within the NCAA for years until someone else exposed him.

But will the NCAA now show it can govern in ways that remotely approach Emmert's high-minded rhetoric from today's pile-on?

Not holding my breath.

[JackJD]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

ESPN today:
The elimination of Paterno-coached Penn State wins since 1998, means the last game "won" by Paterno was against Wisconsin at the end of the 1997 season. Penn State's quarterback: Mike McQueary.

[NoVaJack]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

Why were Sandusky's crimes covered up by Penn State? To protect the football program and Paterno's legacy. The actions by the NCAA and the Big Ten are targeted in those areas. Paterno's name has been removed from numerous things, including the Big Ten trophy, and now will be removed from the top of the winningest coaches list. For 14 years, Penn State put their football program ahead of Sandusky's victims. Now, it will probably be about 14 years before Penn State football can return to any sort of national glory. I'm not finding a lot of problems with the NCAA decision. My biggest worry last night was a nightmare situation where the NCAA levied sanctions and Penn State fought them and won. The consent agreement took care of those worries.

I'd be careful with the broad brush.. It's more accurate to say "for 14 years the Penn State president, two top administrators and the football coach put their football program ahead of Sandusky'victims."

[MontanaRabbit]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

They used Penn State's investigation. In other words, Penn State said "This is what happened." The NCAA took them for their word.



Penn State admitted their guilt to the NCAA via the Freeh report. A bit of the Freeh Report: "In various ways the University's administrative structure, the absence or poor enforcement of policies relating to the protection of children and employee misconduct, and the lack of emphasis on values and ethics-based action created an environment in which Spanier, Schultz, Paterno, and Curley were able to make decisions to avoid the consequences of bad publicity. Standard personnel practices were ignored or undermined by the lack of centralized control over the human resources functions of various departments - most particularly, the Athletic Department."

In other words, PSU displayed an alarming lack of institutional control.



The sanctions against PSU were contained punitive and corrective elements. Most of the media focus has been on the punitive (fine, post-season ban, scholarship reductions, etc).

There are multiple sanctions on the corrective side that relate to setting up such programs at Penn State including a requirement to implement all the recommendations of the Freeh Report (Chapter 10). The NCAA is just saying PSU has to use their own money to do it.

Great post.

I just want to add one thing. I'm not sure Paterno and several of the other leaders did anything criminal. If I recall correctly, Pennsylvania law requires someone that has knowledge of a crime to report that to a supervisor. Most of them did that. So, I'm not sure there will ever be criminal cases against any of them. Curley did lie under oath so he is facing that charge.

What they did is morally wrong without a doubt.

[JackJD]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

...potential statute of limitations issues here for some victims potentially.

So, you're saying there's some potential?

[jack power]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

And you can guarantee there are/will be more lawsuits from family members.

No question. That 60 mil will be chump change by the time this is over.

[RabbitObsessed]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

This is the kind of thing I wish the NCAA did instead of punish players who sold their stuff for tattoos.

"I wish the NCAA punished more people committing victim-less crimes."

[KUlawJack]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

And you can guarantee there are/will be more lawsuits from family members.

Oh for sure, and rightfully so. Whether Penn State just settles them and pays them out may be another story. Without looking into the issue at all or reviewing Pennsylvania's statute of limitations for this type of personal injury, I can see some potential statute of limitations issues here for some victims potentially.

[SDSUAlum08]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

Penn State accepted the Freeh report, so the NCAA used it. They also said it was more comprehensive than they have ever done.The NCAA listed several Articles and BY-laws that PSU violated in the consent decree. http://www.ncaa.com/content/penn-state-conclusions. Penn State agreed with them.Just because the 60 mil is going to an outside program doesn't mean the Sandusky victims can't use it.

And you can guarantee there are/will be more lawsuits from family members.

[jack power]

Re: Joe Paterno Passes

Penn State accepted the Freeh report, so the NCAA used it. They also said it was more comprehensive than they have ever done.

The NCAA listed several Articles and BY-laws that PSU violated in the consent decree. http://www.ncaa.com/content/penn-state-conclusions. Penn State agreed with them.

Just because the 60 mil is going to an outside program doesn't mean the Sandusky victims can't use it.