Blasphemy

[Cowbell]

I'm going to write something most people on this board won't like. That being I am more than a little angry about both the men's and women's basketball teams plans to jet off to exotic places later this year. It isn't right.

My family has taken a significant hit during the recent downturn in the economy. State government in South Dakota, trying to hang onto employees, if offering no pay raises. Businesses everywhere are laying off people - that's if they keep their doors open.

The call to increase my gift to the athletic department this year will fall on deaf ears. This country is in a hell of a fix right now and I find it highly irresponsible to send college athletes to tropical islands for fun in the sun when there is a world of hurt going on.

[UWMandSDSU]

Re: Blasphemy

I'm going to write something most people on this board won't like. That being I am more than a little angry about both the men's and women's basketball teams plans to jet off to exotic places later this year. It isn't right.

My family has taken a significant hit during the recent downturn in the economy. State government in South Dakota, trying to hang onto employees, if offering no pay raises. Businesses everywhere are laying off people - that's if they keep their doors open.

The call to increase my gift to the athletic department this year will fall on deaf ears. This country is in a hell of a fix right now and I find it highly irresponsible to send college athletes to tropical islands for fun in the sun when there is a world of hurt going on.

I believe a lot of the costs are picked up by the Tournament organizers (now I may be wrong). But I do know the Men's team made money this year when they went to the Bahamas.

[BTownJack]

Re: Blasphemy

I'm going to write something most people on this board won't like. That being I am more than a little angry about both the men's and women's basketball teams plans to jet off to exotic places later this year. It isn't right.

My family has taken a significant hit during the recent downturn in the economy. State government in South Dakota, trying to hang onto employees, if offering no pay raises. Businesses everywhere are laying off people - that's if they keep their doors open.

The call to increase my gift to the athletic department this year will fall on deaf ears. This country is in a hell of a fix right now and I find it highly irresponsible to send college athletes to tropical islands for fun in the sun when there is a world of hurt going on.

Maybe you should wait and do some reasearch on the finances of this trip before going off the and calling the basketbal teams/athletic department irresponsible. Realize the men's and women's teams will be playing 3-4 games during their time at their "exotic places" against some top-quality competition. If they were to travel to those opponent's locations separetely to play these games I bet the finances are very close in comparison or possibly even more. That along with the ease of scheduling the rest of the year's games when you can knock out 3-4 games in one trip is hard to put price tag on. Also, we are getting the chance to play quality teams at these kind of tournaments that we would have a hard time scheduling otherwise. Remember the women's BB first BCS win against Kentucky when they traveled to the Virgin Islands the last time? That was extremely significant in their progress between now and then. You certainly can't put a price tag on that.

[BTownJack]

Re: Blasphemy

I believe a lot of the costs are picked up by the Tournament organizers (now I may be wrong). But I do know the Men's team made money this year when they went to the Bahamas.

This is also correct. The men received guarantees to play in Cancun this year. The women had to pay their way but per my argument above it makes financial sense to schedule such a trip, regardless of the location.

[Cowbell]

Re: Blasphemy

True, there are guarantees but the teams do not make money on the trips. That is a falacy.

By the way, I'm not "popping off." I believe there will be a public relation's nightmare which will hurt the entire athletic program if a hurting public sees teams from public institutions taking what they perceive to be taxpayer funded vacations. Now, taxpayer money won't be used, we know that. But, the general public will see it differently. Mark my words.

[Nidaros]

Re: Blasphemy

Listening to CNBC, the experts expect some turnaround in the economy by the first of next year which means that by November a number of things could have turned around. It may be not as bleak as it appears now.

I think for our programs to grow at SDSU, we need to grab all the exposure we can. I tend to believe this is the objective in making the trips.

If the budget can not tolerate the travel, then I dont think it will happen. If guarentees will pay our way, then we are fools not to take the opportunity and make the most of it.

I recall a few people writing letters to editor when Stig's football team took off on a Thursday for Oregan for a Saturday game at Western Oregan, one of the last years in D2, but since that there has not been much public outcry about all the travel during the transition period. It seems the only ones that seem to notice this and make a outcry often have no interest in athletics at SDSU. So their opinions have little impact.

I think we will be okay. Our economy can not get much worse than its right now. I dont have any reason to consider this thread blasphemy. You raised a interesting issue.

[filbert]

Re: Blasphemy

. . . Our economy can not get much worse than its right now.

Actually, it can indeed get a LOT worse than it is today. An awful lot worse. 1970's worse. Or 1930's worse. Double-digit unemployment and double-digit inflation worse. The old saying "it's a recession if your neighbor loses his job, it's a depression if you lose yours" comes into play here. It was the Congressional Budget Office that, prior to the 'stimulus bill' passing, said that things would start to improve by Q3 2009. This is cold comfort to those who have already been hurt, or won't financially make it to Q3, of course.

I actually think Cowbell does have a point about the potential for this to look bad. The evidence there is that HE thinks it looks bad. The natural follow-up question is "well, what should they do instead?"

In the case of the men, they get to play three games that only count as one against the 29-game NCAA limit. They can't do that at home. The women's two games are in contrast "counter" games in the Bahamas). It's unlikely that either team would be able to schedule an equivalent home game or two in the same time frame, so the teams would have to travel to play somewhere anyway to get games in. Plus, it's not as if this is the first time SDSU teams have played in either of these two places.

I also think there's also a potential for a kind of a "bread and circuses" effect, too, giving people something to take their mind off of their troubles for a while. Sometimes, you never know which way people will go.

[SUPERBUNNY]

Re: Blasphemy

I agree with the above posts and might add that travelling to watch the team play in the Virgin Islands or the Bahamas has a lot more appeal then a road trip to Macomb.

Cowbell's concerns are appreciated in these tough times and I can see where that reaction would come up on the surface.

BTownJack and UWMandSDSU bring up good points. One thing that can be added is the value that these tournament have in the recruiting process. I would think it would look very attractive to a possible recruit to have the opportunity to travel to an exotic location and play games against some top notch competition. With games, practice, study, and other things going on there isn't a lot of time for the kids to sit on the beach. Now, for the fans that is a different story. Plenty of great time at a beautiful resort and a few Jacks games mixed in. Sounds like a perfect trip to me!

GB, GB, GJ!

SUPERBUNNY

[1stRowFANatic]

Re: Blasphemy

I think that Cowbell does bring up a point about the perception of this to those that have and will continue to be suffering the impact of the economic downturn.

I hope the Athletic Department views this as an opportunity to engage fans, alums and supporters and not as a negative that needs to be overcome. Many have indicated the positive aspects that these trips bring to the program in terms of costs incurred/avoided. If the AD educates people as to why this can be a smart economic move for the team can build confidence that they are looking out for taxpayers. Certain aspects of the public will never believe that any money on athletics is justified (my dad, well almost never for him), but they aren't going to listen no matter what you say.

The one thing that I think has been forgotten in this is the non-basketball opportunities involved. I remember reading about the different cultural outing the teams went on also during the trip. Is that enough to justify the trip? Many will say no, but I don't think it should be ignored either.

Do I wish I could on nice vacation this year? Yep, does that mean I think everyone that does hasn't felt any economic pain this year? Nope. Are some businesses being idiots spending money on trips for employees? Yep. Is every employee rewards program a waste of money? Nope.

And when you get right down to it, even if they had to pay every cent of the trip, it would take more than this for me to believe that the individuals in control of the money are not being as careful as they can be.

[JACKGUYII]

Re: Blasphemy

I don't know about the rest of you, but athletics gives me a needed break from the economic misery. I will cut back on many things in 2009, but SDSU athletics is not one of them!

[jacks nl]

Re: Blasphemy

You also have to look at the football team getting hundreds of thousands each year they play a BCS school that will help offset travel costs for the other sports. Also when our men’s basketball team goes to California they play just one game when they travel to the US Virgin Islands they will get three games for the price of one airline ticket. And if the men’s team would have played at the Great Alaska shoot-out I wonder if this would be an issue.

[Nidaros]

Re: Blasphemy

Actually, it can indeed get a LOT worse than it is today. An awful lot worse. 1970's worse. Or 1930's worse. Double-digit unemployment and double-digit inflation worse. The old saying "it's a recession if your neighbor loses his job, it's a depression if you lose yours" comes into play here. It was the Congressional Budget Office that, prior to the 'stimulus bill' passing, said that things would start to improve by Q3 2009. This is cold comfort to those who have already been hurt, or won't financially make it to Q3, of course.

I actually think Cowbell does have a point about the potential for this to look bad. The evidence there is that HE thinks it looks bad. The natural follow-up question is "well, what should they do instead?"

In the case of the men, they get to play three games that only count as one against the 29-game NCAA limit. They can't do that at home. The women's two games are in contrast "counter" games in the Bahamas). It's unlikely that either team would be able to schedule an equivalent home game or two in the same time frame, so the teams would have to travel to play somewhere anyway to get games in. Plus, it's not as if this is the first time SDSU teams have played in either of these two places.

I also think there's also a potential for a kind of a "bread and circuses" effect, too, giving people something to take their mind off of their troubles for a while. Sometimes, you never know which way people will go.

Where the recession ends and the depression begins, and then subsequent recovery begins is just about anyone's guess. YeS, it could get worse. I hope not though.

I do agree that Cowbell does have a point, it could be a PR problem down the road.

I suspect SDSU is contractually committed and getting out of this contract because the public has concerns about the economy would tend to make me think that there would be a cost to SDSU to breach this contract. Also could backing out of the contract have sufficent impact on the athletic department budget? Would future sponsors remember our actions of backing out of a contract? I think these questions would need to be answered if we now decided to back out and not appear in the tournaments.

Our admin can only play it out and use their best judgement. I personally have no resentment about the bb teams going to the tropics in late fall and I have to sit home with a sweater on because, I dare not touch the thermostat. Next fall my mind may change.

[jack power]

Re: Blasphemy

I'm always amazed how people can look at the same thing with such different opinions.

After reading the thread on the basketball board about this event, here were my thoughts:

1) Wow! What a great opportunity to play some high ranking teams.
2) I think we are going to have a very good team next year. This will be very interesting to see how we measure up to some top level teams.
3) This is going to be a fantastic recruiting tool.
4) I'm going to try to arrange my vacation and start putting some money aside because i would love to be there.

After opening this thread, here were my thoughts:

1) It's true, you can always find something to bitch about.
2) It's not a fallacy, Nagy himself said the trip last year made money.
3) I trust the administration to make sound financial decisions, they haven't giving me any reason to question them before.
4) Stu has just found some new material for his next anti-SDSU article.

[EQguy]

Re: Blasphemy

I'm always amazed how people can look at the same thing with such different opinions.

After reading the thread on the basketball board about this event, here were my thoughts:

1) Wow! What a great opportunity to play some high ranking teams.
2) I think we are going to have a very good team next year. This will be very interesting to see how we measure up to some top level teams.
3) This is going to be a fantastic recruiting tool.
4) I'm going to try to arrange my vacation and start putting some money aside because i would love to be there.

After opening this thread, here were my thoughts:

1) It's true, you can always find something to bitch about.
2) It's not a fallacy, Nagy himself said the trip last year made money.
3) I trust the administration to make sound financial decisions, they haven't giving me any reason to question them before.
4) Stu has just found some new material for his next anti-SDSU article.

Well said!

[BTownJack]

Re: Blasphemy

I'm always amazed how people can look at the same thing with such different opinions.

After reading the thread on the basketball board about this event, here were my thoughts:

1) Wow! What a great opportunity to play some high ranking teams.
2) I think we are going to have a very good team next year. This will be very interesting to see how we measure up to some top level teams.
3) This is going to be a fantastic recruiting tool.
4) I'm going to try to arrange my vacation and start putting some money aside because i would love to be there.

After opening this thread, here were my thoughts:

1) It's true, you can always find something to bitch about.
2) It's not a fallacy, Nagy himself said the trip last year made money.
3) I trust the administration to make sound financial decisions, they haven't giving me any reason to question them before.
4) Stu has just found some new material for his next anti-SDSU article.

Agreed...this is one of the best posts on this board in a long time! It can't be said much better.