GDT: Jackrabbits #9 vs Orange #8 @ Frank Erwin Center 4:30pm ESPN2

[AZjack]

We need Greer to stay as we have zero guard depth.

Hoping the freshman can contribute plus Herzberg makes a jump in levels will make Greer look pretty good coming off the bench as the 3rd point guard.

Lindsay struggles with shooting, but her defense and rebounding make her pretty valuable. Just need shooters to step up and it sucks Stapleton is done for most of next year.

[jackdaniel]

i think maybe some are underestimating the loss of myah a bit??

she was NOT just our best player!! she was the RUNAWAY best player in our conference. and also BY FAR our best facilitator. i am NOT putting her quite at n walter level at this time, but i think losing her would be nearly equal to taking nate off of those teams and then playing an ncaa tourney caliber team. how ya think that goes??? that is what i thought- N O T good

and AGAIN!!! do you realize how freaking close we were to winning this game. i know final score ended at about down 15 but we were a bucket down with about 6 minutes and they WERE NOT scoring well either YEAH we shot 33% from field but they shot under 37% we make a couple buckets and get a 2 possession lead in last 5 minutes i am not sure they dont crumble. heaven knows if they have the same level of composure as thier coach that is what happens

did you think somehow we were gonna come in without myah against ALL THAT size and have a pretty game and an easy win???? come on folks!! there was no way other than win ugly and the jacks came damn close to doing that.

that said i think haley is a super good kid or they would not have brought her in for 1 year, now 2. and i hope with additional time with team and so on that she will settle in a bit more bc she still seems to force quite a bit. IRONICALLY i would like and i think many of us would like to see tylee force a bit more. she seems to be the player we needed to just put her head down and try to make something happen but it seems she is never gonna do that. haley seems to want to try and i think would be better if she STOP.

she had 8 turnover in under 25 minutes game time. that is about a TO in 1 of 3 possession by one player. again they struggled as a team for most part and they win and lose as a team but that is a lot of turnovers. like i said yesterday i think take away 3-5 TO we probably win

anyway REALLY not trying to rip on haley but it was a bad day

Agree completely, not only is Myah a great player, she makes everyone around her better too, she exudes confidence into the whole team, that's why I have high optimism for next season, and faith in the whole team generally.

[98Jackfarmer]

HG and LT are not the answer. Now, one person didn't lose this game. But when you throw in Tylee only scoring 3 points when she had to know the team needed more out of her is a real let down. Syracuse was a animal we hadn't seen this year. The girls did what they could but the three I mentioned needed to perform better than what they did.

[LetsGoRabbits]

well idk exactly what to call it, but YES i think i agree with the intent of what you say. UNLESS there is a jump in quality of play by one or both, i do NOT think the HG LT combo puts up the same type of minutes again next year. there are many candidates to cut into the time

currently the player who has proven ability to be productive at this level is maddie v. is there some way for the jacks to get by with some combo of maddie, tylee, myah, and maybe even a little tori bringing the ball up?? it feels doubtful but i would NOT say it could not happen. that said, even though tori and myah kinda interchange at 3 and 4, i do not think tori is a particularly good ball handler and she still makes some questionable decisions

maybe i should have started by saying i do not think that there is a lot of reason that anyone has to be able to break a press by themselves. we can move the ball more with cutting and passing. i always think less dribbling is a good thing. i would rather that if a player puts the ball on the floor they are taking 3-5 purposeful dribbles to create somethng for themself or a teammate. we do not really need someone to stand at front of the offense and dribble dribble dribble. i think we have PLENTY of players who can put together 3-5 strong purposeful dribbles so again i do not think it is impossible to put a team on the floor that really does not have a 1 guard

IF we would put that group on the floor my guess is maddie would be more the 2 and tylee and myah would share duties for "running the show"

maybe emily h adds to her game. EVERYTHING i have ever heard about her sounds great. i have to say i am VERY surprised she played as little as she did this year. going into the year i really thought she would be the most impactful freshman- some of that is also due to having lots of posts and having more of a need at guard- but i also really expected big things from her! hopefully that still is true in some capacity

i think the other options are the 2 incoming frosh

i feel like timmer is a little more known quantity, also 6 ft tall, which we know is a thing for this program, and a thing i agree with just to be clear. i know there has been some dispute here, but i believe she can handle the ball well enough. i think there is a chance that she is the best facilitator on the team next year after myah- please let myah be healthy and ready to be myah, at least by Christmas.

finally, IDK?? maybe someone knows more? i know paige can score in HS, and i am pretty sure she is a 1 guard?? and from all i have seen and heard the jacks are pretty jacked about getting her) - see what i did there)) so maybe this whole conversation is a waste of breath??? maybe she will just come in and take that spot and that will be that

the whole HG LT discussion, everyone maybe has their own fav for various reasons. both good kids!! i think both are capable of contributions. both definitely have some flaws. doesnt that describe all of us)))

maybe for reason cannot totally define i feel better with LT on floor. i guess i just like what seems like toughness, but i wish that would translate to the toughness to knockdown more shots like the zags game. i think she is absolutely giving everything she has and i think she is very very team oriented kid who is far more likely to be upset about not giving more to her team than not getting something. i like her a lot but what her team really needs from her is knocking down some shots

i think there a chance and i HOPE HG makes improvements before next year. otherwise she came in as a 1 guard but the 2 things that stand out most about her game, she can inconsistently hit an open 3pt shot and she makes too many questionable decisions/ unforced errors. i am NOT talking about the times the D really tries to force the action- we need to be better than also- but i am talking strictly poor decisions and UNFORCED errors

she can provide solid D, so maybe if little changes she can provide some bench minutes with good D and if she is on from 3 land then you let her go a little more, if not she plays enough to give others a rest. i feel like LT makes significantly lower number of UNFORCED errors. she does make TO but at least i feel she is more likely to do that when the opponent is doing something to cause it, NOT saying that we want those either but it is tough to consistently give the ball away for next to no reason

anyway it seems some combo of the above will get the minutes that HG LT had this year. maybe those 2 will improve and it will be them but i think some of the others maybe have too much talent and somebody steps up to force a change. hopefully they all step up

[UWMandSDSU]

Can you give us your cliff notes after posting the long version.

[LetsGoRabbits]

well i have head that some folks like to give my posts the proper respect by printing them off and using them for toilet paper. therefore i try to give them enough material so that their hand is properly protected

and in case anyone thought that i think i know something or anything like that- based on length of posts, refer to my comments about emily h, totally saw her as an impactful part of the rotation this year if not more

so i do apologize to you all for having to put up with me!!! the jacks are one of my few great passions and i would be happy to talk about them ANY time ANY where

[98Jackfarmer]

well idk exactly what to call it, but YES i think i agree with the intent of what you say. UNLESS there is a jump in quality of play by one or both, i do NOT think the HG LT combo puts up the same type of minutes again next year. there are many candidates to cut into the time

currently the player who has proven ability to be productive at this level is maddie v. is there some way for the jacks to get by with some combo of maddie, tylee, myah, and maybe even a little tori bringing the ball up?? it feels doubtful but i would NOT say it could not happen. that said, even though tori and myah kinda interchange at 3 and 4, i do not think tori is a particularly good ball handler and she still makes some questionable decisions

maybe i should have started by saying i do not think that there is a lot of reason that anyone has to be able to break a press by themselves. we can move the ball more with cutting and passing. i always think less dribbling is a good thing. i would rather that if a player puts the ball on the floor they are taking 3-5 purposeful dribbles to create somethng for themself or a teammate. we do not really need someone to stand at front of the offense and dribble dribble dribble. i think we have PLENTY of players who can put together 3-5 strong purposeful dribbles so again i do not think it is impossible to put a team on the floor that really does not have a 1 guard

IF we would put that group on the floor my guess is maddie would be more the 2 and tylee and myah would share duties for "running the show"

maybe emily h adds to her game. EVERYTHING i have ever heard about her sounds great. i have to say i am VERY surprised she played as little as she did this year. going into the year i really thought she would be the most impactful freshman- some of that is also due to having lots of posts and having more of a need at guard- but i also really expected big things from her! hopefully that still is true in some capacity

i think the other options are the 2 incoming frosh

i feel like timmer is a little more known quantity, also 6 ft tall, which we know is a thing for this program, and a thing i agree with just to be clear. i know there has been some dispute here, but i believe she can handle the ball well enough. i think there is a chance that she is the best facilitator on the team next year after myah- please let myah be healthy and ready to be myah, at least by Christmas.

finally, IDK?? maybe someone knows more? i know paige can score in HS, and i am pretty sure she is a 1 guard?? and from all i have seen and heard the jacks are pretty jacked about getting her) - see what i did there)) so maybe this whole conversation is a waste of breath??? maybe she will just come in and take that spot and that will be that

the whole HG LT discussion, everyone maybe has their own fav for various reasons. both good kids!! i think both are capable of contributions. both definitely have some flaws. doesnt that describe all of us)))

maybe for reason cannot totally define i feel better with LT on floor. i guess i just like what seems like toughness, but i wish that would translate to the toughness to knockdown more shots like the zags game. i think she is absolutely giving everything she has and i think she is very very team oriented kid who is far more likely to be upset about not giving more to her team than not getting something. i like her a lot but what her team really needs from her is knocking down some shots

i think there a chance and i HOPE HG makes improvements before next year. otherwise she came in as a 1 guard but the 2 things that stand out most about her game, she can inconsistently hit an open 3pt shot and she makes too many questionable decisions/ unforced errors. i am NOT talking about the times the D really tries to force the action- we need to be better than also- but i am talking strictly poor decisions and UNFORCED errors

she can provide solid D, so maybe if little changes she can provide some bench minutes with good D and if she is on from 3 land then you let her go a little more, if not she plays enough to give others a rest. i feel like LT makes significantly lower number of UNFORCED errors. she does make TO but at least i feel she is more likely to do that when the opponent is doing something to cause it, NOT saying that we want those either but it is tough to consistently give the ball away for next to no reason

anyway it seems some combo of the above will get the minutes that HG LT had this year. maybe those 2 will improve and it will be them but i think some of the others maybe have too much talent and somebody steps up to force a change. hopefully they all step up

Well, here is what I have. I agree, I like LT better than HG for her overall intense play. But, neither are good enough, as of now. Tori has no chance of bringing it up, Myah can though. I am not against any of the girls, but this is D1 BB. BB in D1 is a business, they need to perform or they need to get replaced by the best option available. (not saying we cut them), just saying.

[AZjack]

We can debate our poor offensive production at the point guard position, but we are still in better shape than USeD. They are getting throttled by Oregon at the half, feels like the SDSU/Louisville game when Macy was hurt the game before. 34-9 at half.

The Yotes miss Arens a lot, but otherwise healthy and look completely lost. Lamb looks like a freshman and Sjerven can't do anything against the 6'7'' gal.

USD playing hard and not giving up, Oregon just as intense and they have McDonald's AA's at every position.

Kelly Graves is a great coach, let's hope we see Oregon in Frost before Selland is done.

Those were fun games even in the losses, Oregon was a far better team that year than the team they have going against USD tonight. Makes the Jacks tourney wins and Sweet 16 appearance all that more impressive. Wouldn't have cheered for them, but USD did lose out on a great chance at a couple tourney wins last year. This USD team isn't close to last years team. Duffy was that good and Selland may be even better.

[LetsGoRabbits]

TOTALLY agree with you farmer. i dont care what great kids they are or how much i like them. it is still D1 competition and there is ZERO expectation that kids play bc they are good kids!! obviously we did not have anyone this year who was ready to take playing time away from the HG LT combo or i have NO DOUBT their time would have been reduced without hesitation and it should have been

i do absolutely think that one of the girls or some combo from my previous post will force those 2 to pick their game up some notches OR lose playing time. i do not know who it will be and maybe one of the incumbents will surprise people and hold the job but i do not think the play from that spot next year will look the same as it did this year. IF it looks anything like it did this year, that would mean neither of those two improved and none of the others forced them to improve

i highly highly doubt that will happen but it would obviously be a HUGE disappointment

Also i agree with you Tori is NOT bringing it up or certainly not looking like a primary ballhandler while she does. she would bring it up ONLY in a situation where she is being guarded by a post player who does not have the ability to put pressure on her, in a scenario where the guards are getting a lot of pressure. i think she can improve her ballhandling but not to anything like a myah level

[SteelSD]

We can debate our poor offensive production at the point guard position, but we are still in better shape than USeD. They are getting throttled by Oregon at the half, feels like the SDSU/Louisville game when Macy was hurt the game before. 34-9 at half.

The Yotes miss Arens a lot, but otherwise healthy and look completely lost. Lamb looks like a freshman and Sjerven can't do anything against the 6'7'' gal.

USD playing hard and not giving up, Oregon just as intense and they have McDonald's AA's at every position.

Kelly Graves is a great coach, let's hope we see Oregon in Frost before Selland is done.

Those were fun games even in the losses, Oregon was a far better team that year than the team they have going against USD tonight. Makes the Jacks tourney wins and Sweet 16 appearance all that more impressive. Wouldn't have cheered for them, but USD did lose out on a great chance at a couple tourney wins last year. This USD team isn't close to last years team. Duffy was that good and Selland may be even better.

Maybe true, but then USD absolutely throttle the same UNO team that knocked us out of the SLT. So remind me how we are in much better shape? Now granted we are fighting injuries and are a better team with a healty Selland/Nelson. However, I would trade any of our "point guards" for Arens/Lamb/Korngable TODAY. And Sjerven ended up having a hell of a game battling that size down low. The kid is a player. I hate watching her flop defense, but she battles and had an outstanding game ultimately. We have certainly had first halves nearly that bad against top level competition as well. It happens, but they battled and cut the lead to 16 in the 4th, so kuddos to them for that (wow, that hurt to say....). But USD has loads of young talent and DP does a good job developing that talent, so they will be a force going forward. The State/U rivalry should continue to be a battle for the forseeable future.

Ultimately the numbers don't lie. Greer shot 26% from 3 point land on the season, which is obviously putrid. And while LT shot a decent 33% you would be hard pressed to find more than a handful of those where she wasn't completely wide open when she shot them. She showed ability to hit that shot early in the season, but then completely fell off the wagon. Her shot is so flat, so not sure she really is ever going to be much better than this without correcting that. Kind of like golf, short shots rarely go in.

Personally I hope the two freshman come in and immediately demand playing time. I don't think there is anyway that LT doesn't begin the season as the starter, but hopefully Greer is pushed down to a 5-8 min per game type of player. The poor shooting, excessive turnovers, and general out of control moments just don't work for me. Thanks for having the game of your life against ISU and being the key to that win, but that appears to be what it was, a once in a lifetime kind of game. And either LT develops the ability to penetrate and create more for herself and her teammates and becomes a more consistent shooter, or she gradually gives up more and more time to the two freshman.

Hopefully will see MV develop more than just purely a spot up shooter. She looks like she could be a very good to special type of player, but now needs to develop a more well rounded offensive game. Byom really seemed to come along defensively, but also needs to really work to become a better offensive weapon.

It was interesting for me to see Herzberg in the game against Syracuse. What little she's been on the court this year she really looks the part athletically. However she also doesn't really look like she grasps that the idea of the game is to put the ball in the basket as she literally never looked like she knew at some point she could try shooting the ball. I just question that mentality of a player. I mean, if I know I'm not going to get many minutes, by God when I do I'm going to jack up some shots!! Especially if it's mainly garbage time. So not sure if the game is just too fast for her right now or that she has a limited offensive skill set. I've seen no real HS game film of her so maybe someone else can fill me in more.

[AZjack]

Will disagree about the loads of young talent for USD. Some good ones coming up, but not seeing anyone at the level of a Duffy, Lamb or Sjerven except Krull. Krull will be a great one, but not as versatile as Duffy.

Obviously they will be a really good team, but they will have a bigger talent drop off after next year that may even be bigger than the Jacks losing Guebert and Miller after the Sweet 16 run. USD's year for a big run in the tourney will be next year

(Jacks definitely got the right Guebert)

[SteelSD]

Will disagree about the loads of young talent for USD. Some good ones coming up, but not seeing anyone at the level of a Duffy, Lamb or Sjerven except Krull. Krull will be a great one, but not as versatile as Duffy.

Obviously they will be a really good team, but they will have a bigger talent drop off after next year that may even be bigger than the Jacks losing Guebert and Miller after the Sweet 16 run. USD's year for a big run in the tourney will be next year

(Jacks definitely got the right Guebert)

Obviously they don't have a replacement for Sjerven, but then she sort of fell in their lap in the first place. Duffy obviously is a huge loss, but we never really replaced Guebert or Macy either. Players of that level don't come along often, so you enjoy them. Myah obviously has a chance to be mentioned in that same breath if she can stay healthy. But I agree they will need the underclassmen to really step up if they hope to not see a drop off after next year. Luckily we look good for the next few years, but will need to see some development of players ourselves.

But obviously Krull looks like she will be good. They have a recruit in Grace Larkins who is the #1 recruit in Iowa and HM All American. Will really depend on whether players like Hansen and Watson develop for them. But then that is also the case for us with the likes of Vlastuin and the upcoming recruits. Looking good in HS and being an impact player in college aren't a guaranteed thing. I've thought they were going to suffer some lows, but they seem to be able to reload right along with us.

[AZjack]

Obviously they don't have a replacement for Sjerven, but then she sort of fell in their lap in the first place. Duffy obviously is a huge loss, but we never really replaced Guebert or Macy either. Players of that level don't come along often, so you enjoy them. Myah obviously has a chance to be mentioned in that same breath if she can stay healthy. But I agree they will need the underclassmen to really step up if they hope to not see a drop off after next year. Luckily we look good for the next few years, but will need to see some development of players ourselves.

But obviously Krull looks like she will be good. They have a recruit in Grace Larkins who is the #1 recruit in Iowa and HM All American. Will really depend on whether players like Hansen and Watson develop for them. But then that is also the case for us with the likes of Vlastuin and the upcoming recruits. Looking good in HS and being an impact player in college aren't a guaranteed thing. I've thought they were going to suffer some lows, but they seem to be able to reload right along with us.

Hansen, Peplowski and Mazurek need to take big steps for them. Theisen, Nelson and Byom were all better players than those 3 this year. Watson will be good, but Timmer is more polished and has better size.. Jacks need a guard to step up and shoot as has been discussed here all season.

I do think USD has the edge next year in talent with the Selland and Stapleton injuries. The junior class not developing into productive players has hurt the Jacks, USD has some of the same issue in their sophomore class.

For the future years, I'll take the Jacks. USD also doesn't recruit the length that AJ does, we will see over the next 3-4 years which style is better for NCAA Tourney success. We know USD's formula works to dominate the SL, they need to win a tourney game though. Next year they have a great chance with all their returnees. Not that I enjoy it, but USD is now one of the top mid majors in the country and will always have quality teams if Coach P stays. Crazy for a state this size to have 2 of the top 8-10 mid major programs in the country.

Both programs now expect NCAA Tourney births and for me, wins there count more than SL regular season or even SLT titles. Jacks have the advantage so far.

[SteelSD]

For the future years, I'll take the Jacks. USD also doesn't recruit the length that AJ does, we will see over the next 3-4 years which style is better for NCAA Tourney success. We know USD's formula works to dominate the SL, they need to win a tourney game though. Next year they have a great chance with all their returnees. Not that I enjoy it, but USD is now one of the top mid majors in the country and will always have quality teams if Coach P stays. Crazy for a state this size to have 2 of the top 8-10 mid major programs in the country.

Both programs now expect NCAA Tourney births and for me, wins there count more than SL regular season or even SLT titles. Jacks have the advantage so far.

It's funny you mention this about length. USD fans are critical of SDSU for opting for "length over athleticism" and try and maintain how much more athletic they are than us. Now after this loss to Oregon they are all on in on "we need to be longer across the board." It's obvious that while they have had success, they aren't prepared for the next step like we are and are a few years behind us. Certainly you can be really good in a mid-major conference with small players that shoot the ball well. But when facing a team throwing similar players who are 3-4" taller in every position, then you have a problem. Personally I hope they keep recruiting these smaller "athletes" and then lamenting how they can't take that next step. Keeps them from fighting for some of the same players we are as we try to become an even bigger player on the national scene.

[GrandpaLee]

Syracuse WBB showing TEN transfers out.

https://twitter.com/n0ejq/status/1379238227119333376
or
https://wbbblog.com/womens-basketbal...ummer-2021/19/