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Big Man Issues

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  • #1

    Big Man Issues

    I think there are 3 issues that have really hurt this team during it's transition. They are turnovers, 3-point shooting and not having big men. I don't really understand the turnovers and shooting because we've always had a small team. Hopefully, our guards will pickup in those 2 categories. They have a couple years of experience under their belts.

    This is really about the big men.
    In the game on Monday, we had Moss(6'4") and Kai(6'6") as our power forwards the whole game. I'm not saying that they can't handle it but they both shouldn't play that position. Last year, Moss played some point guard. That's a big jump from PG to PF. Kai has played a lot of PF but he's really a SF.
    The center position was played by Engen and Cordova. I think Cordova can hold his own down there. It would be nice if he was a couple inches taller but it's not needed.
    Engen on the other hand has the height but not the weight. The guy from SMSU must have had him by 50 lbs. He tried but just didn't have a low enough center of gravity to hold him out. He got pushed 1 time and as he was falling to the ground, he got called for holding. On offense, he likes shooting the 3. I guess if he makes them it could open up the middle but I think the big man should post up(most of the time).
    I remember 2 years ago when Andy Kleinjan played some PF. Ben was taking care of his family. Berte and Gilbert were out. I think somebody(Loney?) fouled out and Andy was the 2nd biggest player we had. It was before we picked up the football players. He was a senior so he had a few years of lifting but still was small and just 6'3". (I think all of this is correct but don't remember for sure).

    I hope that Cassaday(6'6"-225), DeBoer(6'6"-215) and Davis(6'10"-240) can come back. I hear that Davis is out but just decided to include him anyway.

    Next year, should be a different story. We lose 2 guys that are 6'. We pickup Rader(6'7"-220), Pederson(6'8"), White(6'6") and Feigen(6'7").
    Kai would be ideal at SF but it looks like this year he'll be our PF again. Next year should be a different story.

    I'm not saying anything about being bad this year. It hasn't even started and I think we'll be better than last year. I'm just pointing out that we haven't had any depth at the bag men positions in 5 years. It looks that that will finally change, next year.
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  • #2
    Re: Big Man Issues

    Good post. Only problem I have is that for 5 years we've been saying "next year should be better." This program is in a constant state of flux right now (and not the cool flux that allows for time travel). At some point, there needs to be some foundation set and some building begun. This was to be that season. I hope it is. Injuries seem to have already derailed that somewhat (how many analogies can I fit in one post?). It's always something for the past 5 years.
    "You just stood their screaming. Fearing no one was listening to you. Hearing only what you wanna hear. Knowing only what you heard." Metallica

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    • #3
      Re: Big Man Issues

      I think one thing I've always noticed is that if you look at St. Clouds, Mankato, etc. rosters, they always have a bunch of 6'7 to 6'10" guys. Now I understand that it's tough to get GOOD players that are that height level, but we need to start bringing in some height for this team. Anthony Davis, James Radar, Chad White, and Tony Fiegen is a start, but it needs to continue. A dominant guard is going to be needed to be added when Kai and Garrett leave as well.

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      • #4
        Re: Big Man Issues

        Chad White is a wing player. Tony Fiegen is a "4", maybe swing to a "3" if he continues to develop. Most of the players mentioned in previous posts were not recruited to play specifically a "4" or a "5" at SDSU(Cordova and Engen are the exception). They are playing there because of need. The Jacks give up about 2" or 3" at every position if they are forced to play the line-up they had the other night. Dale Moss didn't even play the "4" spot in high school. For at least awhile, that is line-up they have.

        The Jacks will get better, but it is unrealistic to think any of their freshmen are going to come in and be a 15 pt./ 8 rebound inside player - which is what this team needs. "Better" will happen by getting/keeping players in each class and letting them develop. There is no quick fix. Things are really pointed in a better direction in terms of talent flowing into the program, but the lack of big players is a real issue and is very evident this year.

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        • #5
          Re: Big Man Issues

          Originally posted by Patkran View Post
          Chad White is a wing player. Tony Fiegen is a "4", maybe swing to a "3" if he continues to develop. Most of the players mentioned in previous posts were not recruited to play specifically a "4" or a "5" at SDSU(Cordova and Engen are the exception). They are playing there because of need. The Jacks give up about 2" or 3" at every position if they are forced to play the line-up they had the other night. Dale Moss didn't even play the "4" spot in high school. For at least awhile, that is line-up they have.

          The Jacks will get better, but it is unrealistic to think any of their freshmen are going to come in and be a 15 pt./ 8 rebound inside player - which is what this team needs. "Better" will happen by getting/keeping players in each class and letting them develop. There is no quick fix. Things are really pointed in a better direction in terms of talent flowing into the program, but the lack of big players is a real issue and is very evident this year.
          Completely agree and I know about White and Fiegen. Just commenting on the height.

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          • #6
            Re: Big Man Issues

            Originally posted by Patkran View Post
            Chad White is a wing player. Tony Fiegen is a "4", maybe swing to a "3" if he continues to develop. Most of the players mentioned in previous posts were not recruited to play specifically a "4" or a "5" at SDSU(Cordova and Engen are the exception). They are playing there because of need. The Jacks give up about 2" or 3" at every position if they are forced to play the line-up they had the other night. Dale Moss didn't even play the "4" spot in high school. For at least awhile, that is line-up they have.

            The Jacks will get better, but it is unrealistic to think any of their freshmen are going to come in and be a 15 pt./ 8 rebound inside player - which is what this team needs. "Better" will happen by getting/keeping players in each class and letting them develop. There is no quick fix. Things are really pointed in a better direction in terms of talent flowing into the program, but the lack of big players is a real issue and is very evident this year.
            Exactly. Also exactly what we have been saying for the last 3 years. I'm a little worried about the optimism and expectations of some. Its going to be a long year with a lot of losses, it would be in the best interest of most to appreciate that. I'll be extremely please if we finish 8th or 7th in the conference and win 10 games. Look at the injuries, look at the lack of depth, look at the fact that we are likely to turn the ball over more than our opponents and shoot a lower percentage from the 3-point line. Its almost certain that most teams will out rebound us as well. We are going to need to play harder every night as our talent level won't match most opponents. I'm not saying we can't win 15 games but that is unlikely, very unlikely.
            We are here to add what we can to life, not get what we can from life. -Sir William Osler

            We do not see things as they are, we see things as we are.

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            • #7
              Re: Big Man Issues

              I have to agree with MJA; five years of saying things will get better next year means an entire class has passed through the program.

              When we started the transition I stated that what was important was to make decisions that would improve the state of the program for five years down the road. And when we go to five years the decisions should be made that would improve the program five years further down the road. At that point we could then make decisions regarding the immediate status of the program involved.

              We are at the five year point and I would say that every program has made significant progress towards being able to be a competitive D1 program, except men's basketball. That is not to say it hasn't made any progress. But can anyone really say we are any closer to be a competitive program year in and year out than we were last year, two years ago, three years ago? I don't think so, but the question is then what should the program do?

              Adding an extra assistant will help. An injury free year would help (relatively speaking since there are already some injuries). Another years worth of experience will help. But none of those will help as much as if the team doubles the number of wins from last year.

              You can't teach an old dog new tricks, but you can never teach a stupid dog anything.

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              • #8
                Re: Big Man Issues

                I think the C position is the main position that really weak at. Cordova is the only player we have for that position. Davis would be the ideal person to play there but being injured took care of that.
                There are several people that can play the PF position. Cordova, Engen, Cassaday and Kai can play there this year. Next year you can add Fiegen, Pederson, Radar and DeBoer there.
                The SF position is probably the deepest position(other than SG). I think Cassaday, Radar, Kai, Fiegen, Moss, Griffan and White could play there.
                I know the PG position doesn't have a real stud but I think there are a few people that could play that position.
                I'm sure I'm off on some of these but this should be a lot deeper that just having Engen and Cordova at C and Moss and Williams at PF.

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                • #9
                  Re: Big Man Issues

                  Just wondered what was wrong with Davis. Just heard that he was hurt. Would somebody that is in the know tell us the status of all the injurys and approximately how long all of them are out of the picture.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Big Man Issues

                    Originally posted by dozer1981 View Post
                    Just wondered what was wrong with Davis. Just heard that he was hurt. Would somebody that is in the know tell us the status of all the injurys and approximately how long all of them are out of the picture.
                    From what i understand,Davis has some kind of nerve damage in his foot-doubt fall for this year.
                    Cassady foot problem- played yesterday
                    Palarca knee sprain- should be back by the first game, don't know how much he'll play.
                    Sargent has a groin problem-played yesterday although he was taken to the ER after the scrimmage-got an elbow in the mouth.

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                    • #11
                      Re: Big Man Issues

                      I got some questions.... If they are dumb I am sorry....

                      Is there a 4 year scholarship open for next year?

                      Is there any JuCo big guys the coaches are looking at?

                      Is there a big man that the coaches are looking at for next year in the area?

                      Can Feigen and Rader be projected more as 4's then 3's?

                      If Davis can't play this year will he be granted a redshirt? I would rather have him sit out the year and become 100% healthy.

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