Want a good reason to move to D-I

[89rabbit]

I was reading my copy of The College on the Hill and I hit Chapter 27 Tragedy and Triumph which deals with our 1963 NCAA D-II Men's Basketball Championship.  As Amy Dunkle wrote of the teams that we crossed paths with on our way to the Championship, it occurred to me that none of the teams were still in D-II.

Our Elite 8 run started by beating Fresno State (now D-I, playing in the WAC), next we beat Evansville Univeresity (now D-I, playing in the MVC)  Evansville beat Southern Illinois for the chance to play SDSU  (now D-I, playing in the MVC), we next played Wittenburg College (now University, but has moved down to D-III) and won the National Championship.

Which schools have you heard of?  If your like me, Fresno State, Evansville, and Southern Illinois.  I was not even sure that Wittenburg still existed until I looked them up on line.  The move to D-I is long over due.

Go State!

[SDSUFAN]

Re: Want a good reason to move to D-I

89Rabbit:
The Southern Illinois was the Carbondale Campus, the one that is now in Missouri Valley Conference. The Salukies, which I understand is a dog of some sort.

Wittenberg was unbelievabley good and was coached by a 22 year old Eldon Miller, who later coached Navy, Ohio State and Northern Iowa.

Eldon had played for Wittenberg the year before in 1962.

Wittenberg is very much in existence, they are  in Springfield Ohio and are in between Dayton and Columbus Ohio.  When I lived in Dayton 1973-76 I used to go to Wittenberg football and basketball games.  Their basketball facility has since been replaced, but was the pits for opponents.  Its a good thing the game was played in Evansville and not Springfield.  Wittensberg moved to D3 in 1973 and have no scholarships, but the football coach seem have mysteriously to come up with all those small but fast running backs from Detriot.  Supposely the recruiting was done by letter, but I really wonder how they did that. Mauer the football coach won several D3 NC and they fun to watch in the 1970's. Academics are very important at Wittenberg. When I was following them, they had a top recruit in Ohio that could not make grades and he was out more than he was in. So thats one reason, you dont hear much about Wittenberg athletics in recent years. Try to get your children enrolled at Wittenberg. It will not be easy and they better have 4.0 high school GPA'S. The tuition is about like the Augustana Advantage if not more.


 Wittenberg is named after the German University that once had an important professor named Martin Luther.

[89rabbit]

Re: Want a good reason to move to D-I

A Saluki is an Egyptian hunting dog.  Here is a link to a nice picture:

http://www.kingsnake.com/fowler/saluki/saluki.htm

My point in the last post was not to run down Wittenberg.  I am sure they are a fine institution.  They are probably well know in their part of Ohio.  However to the casual fan (and employer) in most parts of the USA,  they are not as well known (if at all) as the school that went D-I.  The ones that chose to move up to D-I are know all over the country and that gives their Alumni a leg up.  

My hope is for SDSU to become one of those well known (or at least heard of) schools.  It would be nice to tell someone that you went to South Dakota State and not have that blank look come over their face.  Like if you told them you went to Wittenburg.  

There are many fine schools all across the fruited plain that are well known in their region (and overpriced) Augie in the upper midwest, Rockhurst around KC, Wittenburg in Ohio, but leave their domain and to those who have not heard of them,  they may as well be a glorified Vo-Techs.  Lets face it Perception is Reality.

As far as the "Wittenberg advantage" for my children. . .lets just say my kids will be Jackrabbits if I am paying for school.    

Go SDSU!

[SDSUFAN]

Re: Want a good reason to move to D-I

89 Rabbit
I understand.  Most people have not heard much about Wittenberg either.  I was just having fun with the famous professor associated with Wittenberg in Germany.

If they had not faced the Jacks in 1963 and if I had not lived in Dayton, I would probably not know much about them.  Also being a Lutheran helps.    

Prior to 1957, there was no competition in the NCAA for programs that were not considered Major Colleges. In 1957 the NCAA started the College Division and then had the University or Major division.  The entire NCC applied and received NCAA membership that year.
Prior to 1957 the entire NCC had NAIA membership and getting to the 64 team big Dance in KC was a big deal.  They did in 1956 and lost in first round to Pacific Lutheran.

In 1973, you have the start of D1, D2 and D3, so lots things have changed since 1963.

Evansville was very tough at the D2 level, but they still have good crowds being members of Missouri Valley Conference.  I would concur that those who have move up to D1 are better off than when they were D2.

[89rabbit]

Re: Want a good reason to move to D-I

I guess you could sum up my drive for D-I to an event that happened this past summer.  I went to the Indy Car races out at Kansas Speedway and wore an SDSU shirt.  I gentlemen about my father's age leaned into me and asked about State.

Turns out he went to Indiana St. and he told me all kinds of stories about SDSU and ISU going head to head in the '60s.  He ended up by saying "what happened to you guys".  Kind of like we were left behind and I think we were.  Back then we were on equal footing with school like that.  It many ways we still are today, but again our inability to keep up with our peers athletically has tainted our whole image.

I have said it before I will say it again.  SDSU should be thought of in the same way as Montana, Montana St. Northern Iowa, Indiana St., Kansas St.  We should not be thought of when folks think of Upper Iowa, Newberry, Tiffin, etc.  Again not a knock on those schools, I just want more for SDSU!

SDSUFAN, I know you and I are on the same page on this matter.  It just sometimes helps to get these feelings off my chest.  

Go State!

[SDSUFAN]

Re: Want a good reason to move to D-I

89rabbit:
I think we did meet up with Indiana State once in the playoffs or maybe it was a non conference game when Marking was coach, so that may be what the guy was refering to. I suspect that was just before they landed Larry Bird as a recruit. Up until about 25 years ago, we could get a lot of good D2 and D1 teams on our schedule. U of Minn and Iowa were on there often on the schedule though never in the Barn or at Frost. Those were usually money games, but the NCAA change some rules and a D2 school never counted towards the 20 wins that they needed. After that change, DWU, Sioux Falls, and Dakota state seemed to appear on the schedule more frequently and thats how has been since.

Yes I know what you are talking about. There is an a guy who I once watch play basketball for the White Wildcats in the Sinai gym against an older brother many many years ago.( Yes both Sinai and White once had high schools.) This individual was sitting outside in the consession area Saturday night and was lamanenting about the mistake of going D1. He is convinced that he will never live long enough to see a D1 tourney appearence by SDSU. I reminded him of the possiblity of a NIT appearence and he did not even know what I was talking about. Some of us just dont want to be confused with the facts.

[89rabbit]

Re: Want a good reason to move to D-I

SDSUFAN,

Just wondering, do you really think he didn't know what the NIT was or was he playing dumb because he is just against the move? Hasn't the NIT been around longer then the NCAA? Wasn't the NIT the bigger deal "back in the day"? Just wondering.

Go State!

[footballfan]

Re: Want a good reason to move to D-I

I believe with the approach we are taking moving to D I will be very benifical. I have watched a few others on the way they are handling it and results are not going as good. With the administration and coaches we have we are doing it the correct way. Great results will follow.....


Go SDSU

[SDSUFAN]

Re: Want a good reason to move to D-I

Talking to some about the D1 move who fall in my age group is like talking some recluse bachalor worth millions into getting a bath, a new house and a new cadillac.  No way in their mind will they waste their hard earned cash.

I honestly think that this guy could not see the difference between the NIT and the D2 Elite Eight.
I think they too have read the sports section like I have and that is to scan the pages for small college stories and ignore whats going on in the B10 and B12.  Its a different world in those conferences and not relevant.
Any one who can vision SDSU as a force in D1 is goofy in their minds.  Seeing is believing and that why this one individual had not thought much about NIT.  

If attendence has a bearing in team selection for the NIT, then we have a good chance of being part of it.

I learned from a reliable source that Troy Larson has not found the true point guard that we need in the High school ranks, but I suspect he has got some real winners about to sign that will make Green, Beran and Wennig look secondary.  I could be making an over statement here as those three are very good players.

I don know if the walk-ons that Nagy and staff have developed in players like Gass, Creiver and Hokanson will be part of the future. You never know amongst the 11000 students, there are probably some great ball players that were never recruited. Its hard to say what the future holds.

The bottom line is I am not worried about living long enough to see SDSU in big Dance.  Who knows Richard Vitale could be telling ESPN fans about the Pork Classic and the auctioning of the hog off at halftime.  Can you imagine that. : ;D :

[89rabbit]

Re: Want a good reason to move to D-I

SDSUFAN,

That is a great analogy, it really helps me understand those types. That being said they should take a moment and remember that SDSU was here long before they were and will be around long after my children's children.

Something else struck me while I was reading your post. While I was talking with Julie Ackerwold-Smith (dropping off my check for the Jackrabbit Club) she said that many of the folks who are against the move to D-I are the same people who threw a fit that we scheduled Si-Tanka and Presentation this year and stayed home for those games (making those games break even at best). You can't have your cake and eat it too.

I am looking forward to the day when Augie, USD and Northern are our Si-Tankas and Presentations, and when schools like UNI, Minnesota, Montana, Nebraska, Creighton are part our "good" non-conf. games. Then we head into Conf. play with a trip to the "Big Dance" on the line. Can you imagine what that will do for attendence and the Athletic Dept.

The funny part is that SDSU will be doing BIG things at the D-I level while many of these FES members are still around. I have watched a ton of Mid-Major Basketball, we are ready to go head to head TODAY. That being said I live very close to Missouri (the "show me" state) so I know what you are up against. I am looking forward to the Jacks doing just that.

You also talked about Troy's hunt for a point guard. It is still early and I hope he finds one at the HS ranks if not we can always look to the JC ranks as a stop gap. As far as walk-ons go. Once we hit the D-I level they are usually the last two guys off the bench and you don't see them much after the non-Conf. games unless it is a blow-out. It is always fun to see those kids get into the game though. Looking forward to seeing the Jacks in the NIT sooner rather then later! ;D

Go State!