Utah State

[UWMandSDSU]

Re: Utah State

If the goal is to win the tourney and get to the dance, I'd rather have a weak conference and dance than murders row.

I do not agree. You want your conference to be considered the best mid-major conference out there. Weak conference puts you at a very tough seed to advance. The goal is not just to get to the tournament but advance in the tournament.

We are actually at 136 RPI. We were at 142 last week.
http://www.ncaa.com/rankings/basketb...basketball-rpi

[MontanaRabbit]

Re: Utah State

I do not agree. You want your conference to be considered the best mid-major conference out there. Weak conference puts you at a very tough seed to advance. The goal is not just to get to the tournament but advance in the tournament.

We are actually at 136 RPI. We were at 142 last week.
http://www.ncaa.com/rankings/basketb...basketball-rpi

Lots of truth in this post. Unless we pretty much run the table the rest of the way we are looking at a 13-14 seed assuming we win the conference tourney. Those seeds don't win many NCAA tourney games.

The numbers (wins) increase DRAMATICALLY when you are a 12 or lower seed.

[3ptJackrabbit]

Re: Utah State

The opportunities to increase your RPI dramatically are the next two games. If that happens then you can up your chances at an improved seeding. Not much of a difference if you run the conference table anyway for a mid major. Look at NDSU with the 12 seed last year with a couple of nice NC wins. What's the best seed the Summit has ever received? 12? The main thing is to get into the tourney. While advancing is the goal, I'd take a 14 seed over a really tough conference schedule and then not advancing. The money a program get's for just making the tournament is substantial andl is a 3 year financial windfall for the University.

That being said, I love the fact this conversation is even being considered! After an 0-2 start things are definitely looking up!

[MontanaRabbit]

Re: Utah State

The opportunities to increase your RPI dramatically are the next two games. If that happens then you can up your chances at an improved seeding. Not much of a difference if you run the conference table anyway for a mid major. Look at NDSU with the 12 seed last year with a couple of nice NC wins. What's the best seed the Summit has ever received? 12? The main thing is to get into the tourney. While advancing is the goal, I'd take a 14 seed over a really tough conference schedule and then not advancing. The money a program get's for just making the tournament is substantial andl is a 3 year financial windfall for the University.

That being said, I love the fact this conversation is even being considered! After an 0-2 start things are definitely looking up!

Do you understand how the money from the tourney is distributed?

The tourney representative doesn't get all the revenue. It's split between all conference members that are full DI members. Each game you play in gets you a share of the tourney money. So with the NDSU win the Summit league gets two shares from last year.

I've posted the win/loss records by seed before and the number of wins increases dramatically for seeds 12 and lower. 12 seeds have won 44 first round games. 13-16 seeds have won 50. It's a fact it's easier to win with a 12 or lower seed. Whether you want to admit it or not, NDSU getting that 12 led to their win.

The #1 seed is 120–0 against the #16 seed (1.000)
The #2 seed is 113–7 against the #15 seed (.942)
The #3 seed is 102–18 against the #14 seed (.850)
The #4 seed is 95–25 against the #13 seed (.792)
The #5 seed is 76–44 against the #12 seed (.633)
The #6 seed is 79–41 against the #11 seed (.658)
The #7 seed is 73–47 against the #10 seed (.608)
The #8 seed is 59–61 against the #9 seed (.492)

In order for the Summit to win games in the tourney (and get more money) we really need a 12 or lower seed. You get that seed by having a conference that doesn't have a slew of 250+ RPI teams. Even if we win the next two games our RPI will take a major hit because the conference teams are gonna drag it down.

[3ptJackrabbit]

Re: Utah State

I understand how the NCAA pool money is distributed. Do you understand SDSU receives a check from the NCAA for 3 years after they make a tourney appearance for making the tournament? This is the final year of their payment from the NCAA tourney for the last appearance and is completely independent form pool money.

The ship has sailed on the RPI for this year anyway. But you put a victory over a Utah or UNI on the record, you can look at more than RPI when seeding next March.

[MontanaRabbit]

Re: Utah State

Do you understand SDSU receives a check from the NCAA for 3 years after they make a tourney appearance for making the tournament? This is the final year of their payment from the NCAA tourney for the last appearance and is completely independent form pool money.

Wrong wrong wrong.

SDSU will get a check next year even if USD makes the tourney this year. The pool money is given to the conference and distributed to DI conference members (Omaha doesn't get a check). SDSU gets no more money than any other conference member even if they are the conference rep.

That's the reason it's important to win games. Means more shares for ALL conference members.

[3ptJackrabbit]

Re: Utah State

DM me if you'd like and I'll explain why I'm correct.

[Jacks-02]

Re: Utah State

I urge anyone with questions on the NCAA Basketball disbursements to conferences read up on the Division I Revenue Distribution Plan

Here is the important information:

The basketball fund is distributed to Division I conferences based on their performance in the Division I Men’s Basketball tournament over a six-year rolling period. The 2014 distribution is based on units earned from 2008 to 2013. Independent institutions receive a full unit share based on its tournament participation over the same rolling six-year period. The basketball fund payments are sent to conferences and independent institutions in mid-April.

If a new member participates in the Division I Men’s basketball tournament in March-April 2014, the units for participants will be included in the Basketball Distribution in April 2015.

One unit is awarded to each institution participating in each game, except the championship game. Units are retained by the Conference in which they are earned. In 2013,
each basketball unit was approximately $245,500 for a total $188.3 million distribution.

In 2014, each basketball unit will be approximately $250,100 for a total $193.58 million distribution.

If I am interpreting correctly, for NDSU's win the tourney last year, the Summit League will receive an extra $245,500 for each of the next 6 years to be split among the league members.

[MontanaRabbit]

Re: Utah State

DM me if you'd like and I'll explain why I'm correct.

Please explain right here so everyone can see it.

SDSU earns no more money from the NCAA for making the tourney than any other conference member. See the post from Jacks-02.

Important Part:

One unit is awarded to each institution participating in each game, except the championship game. Units are retained by the Conference in which they are earned. In 2013,
each basketball unit was approximately $245,500 for a total $188.3 million distribution.

[NorCalJack]

Re: Utah State

Well I can try to explain. The Summit League distributes the monies to its qualifying members equally, but if you represent the conference in the NCAA tourney you get two distribution checks. I remember an article in the Argus where Nagy indicated that we get 1 more share than everyone else when we were in the NCAA. I may be a little off on this but this is how I remember it.

[3ptJackrabbit]

Re: Utah State

And that second distribution check is for the 3 years immediately proceeding an appearance in the tournament.

[MontanaRabbit]

Re: Utah State

Well I can try to explain. The Summit League distributes the monies to its qualifying members equally, but if you represent the conference in the NCAA tourney you get two distribution checks. I remember an article in the Argus where Nagy indicated that we get 1 more share than everyone else when we were in the NCAA. I may be a little off on this but this is how I remember it.

If true I've never seen or heard that. Could be what 3pt is referring to.

So if that's true last year we had 7 members and the payout was $245,500. Split between 8 (7 teams last year with one team getting 2 shares) is $35071/share. Over three years that's $11,670 extra per year for the conference rep on a year where no game was won. Small percentage of the basketball budget.

It's still much better for the representative and the conference for a team to win games in the tourney. Tough to do with a 13 or lower seed. In order to get a 12 seed the conference has to be decent. The Summit is weak this year that's not good.

[3ptJackrabbit]

Re: Utah State

As it was explained to me it's much larger than $12k and goes to the general fund of the school not the bb budget.

[MontanaRabbit]

Re: Utah State

As it was explained to me it's much larger than $12k and goes to the general fund of the school not the bb budget.

Do you have a source for this? Many here would be interested.

I'm pretty certain in the athletic budget, there is a line item for NCAA tourney revenues. It's usually posted on this site.

[3ptJackrabbit]

Re: Utah State

I do but I'm pretty sure he wouldn't appreciate being included on a message board.

Let's just say I'm confident in the second distribution but not in the $ amount.