Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

[JimmyJack]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

No doubt it's a very fine line for UPD patrolling the tailgate area. It sounds like some more education about beverages being in cups is in order.

I didn't witness the incident Jim Langer cites, but I didn't have to witness anything to agree with his suggestion that a "Welcome to SDSU" now and then is a good idea. It seems like this is more of a "community policing" situation than a hardcore law enforcement problem.

My experiences tailgating at Iowa, Purdue, and Oklahoma were different than what I'm hearing here. At Iowa, where tailgating is great fun, police officers patrol on bicycles (when the weather is nice) and are known to many of the participants by name. They handle problems (for the most part) with a quiet conversation rather than a shouted order. That seems like a better approach.

It's important to note: I'm not a law enforcement expert by any means. Still, a little common sense and understanding of the situation seems useful here... including an understanding that you show respect and deference to police officers whether you agree with what they're doing or not.

[Nidaros]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

The big things that loom in my mind and I am not anti alcohol or anti tailgating, are the fact that its against state law to have alcohol beverages on campus. The Board of Regents has stuck their neck out in allowing SDSU and USD to go forward with a tailgating area and encouraging that beverages to be covered or in a cup. If we have more serious incidents that include injury and death and encounters with UPD, then its going to make a lot a people look very, very bad.

I hope that never happens, but I never thought the students would riot as they did in 1990. Believe me I was long past being a student and it was a sad day when everyone who has a reason to take a shot at SDSU had a field day over this event. I would be very sad to see a repeat of this event again in my lifetime.

I hope this can all be resolved. Then again maybe we have a D2 UPD. They might need some training such as a trip to Ames or Iowa City for a game day experience.

[jackmd]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

I hope this can all be resolved. Then again maybe we have a D2 UPD. They might need some training such as a trip to Ames or Iowa City for a game day experience.

I think this is probably where most of the issues come from. When you experience tailgating at places like UNI, Iowa State, Iowa, Minnesota, Nebraska etc... and no one from any law enforcement agency bothers you one bit and then you return to SDSU and they are around every corner it causes irritation and creates friction. I suspect some compromise can be had, at least I hope. I would like to see less hassle from the UPD when we return for tailgating on Hobo Day.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

So can we have beer in cans with a Koozie? I haven't had a problem with that. In fact, I've talked to a couple UPD's at tailgate with a koozied beer in hand and they haven't said anything about it.

One person in our tailgate area had a glass bottle under a koozie. A UPD officer quietly walked up to them and informed that they would have to put that particular beverage in a cup. The person drinking said "ok", the officer quietly walked away, and the person put their drink in a cup. That was basically the only time an officer approached our area. I thought the system worked flawlessly.

I think UPD is in an extremely difficult position. SDSU has a history of "good clean fun" getting out of control (and it has happened at tailgating--couch burning anyone?).

Another thing to remember is that the institutions where tailgating has been such a great experience have probably had tailgating for quite awhile and people know what is acceptable and what is not acceptable. SDSU has tailgating for what, 3-4 years? Obviously, there are fans who do not understand what is acceptable (ie no glass bottles). They need to be educated, and if their friends are not willing to educate, UPD will gladly help.

Frankly, I have a basic understanding of the rules, and if I bring a friend to the game I'm going to do a quick course on what the rules are. I've herded more than one person toward the stadium as the tailgating area cleared out, and I've seen others doing the same.

By my count, there are 3 rules: no glass, tailgate closes 30 minutes before kickoff, and once the game is over we head home (or downtown). From what I hear, UPD is enforcing those 3 rules to the best of their ability.

And for the record, I don't care if the UPD arrested an 15 year old, a former football player, an NFL Hall of Famer, or my 90 year old grandfather. If he was breaking the rules and belligerent to a police officer, he probably deserved to be arrested.

[JACKGUYII]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

Was there also a problem with underage drinking? I saw some very intoxicated kids.

[KUlawJack]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

I agree that the rules have to be enforced and should be for safety, but the overbearing presence of the UPD makes the experience less enjoyable. I have tailgated in quite a few places and I have never seen the SDSU UPD's behavior reproduced anywhere. Maybe its because tailgating started only 5 years ago. Maybe its the interpretation of the rules they are trying to enforce. Either way something should be done because this type of stuff doesn't make me want to come to the Backyard. It would make me want to tailgate in someone's yard off campus and then head to the game. Maybe that is what people will begin to do. I echo Jimmy Jack's statements about Iowa, as I was there last weekend for the Iowa/Iowa State game. Wonderful atmosphere and experience with no overbearing police presence. And their tailgating is a lot larger than ours. We can make it a lot more of a fan friendly atmosphere, but maybe it just takes time to work out the kinks. And as a former student who tailgated significantly, I can say our group never had any issue with the UPD. Hopefully students/fans/alumni will show the UPD respect and issues like this will become a thing of the past. Not saying they aren't now, but a period of time without incident, could lead to a decrease in some of this tension.

[jackmd]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

I agree that the rules have to be enforced and should be for safety, but the overbearing presence of the UPD makes the experience less enjoyable. I have tailgated in quite a few places and I have never seen the SDSU UPD's behavior reproduced anywhere. Maybe its because tailgating started only 5 years ago. Maybe its the interpretation of the rules they are trying to enforce. Either way something should be done because this type of stuff doesn't make me want to come to the Backyard. It would make me want to tailgate in someone's yard off campus and then head to the game. Maybe that is what people will begin to do. I echo Jimmy Jack's statements about Iowa, as I was there last weekend for the Iowa/Iowa State game. Wonderful atmosphere and experience with no overbearing police presence. And their tailgating is a lot larger than ours. We can make it a lot more of a fan friendly atmosphere, but maybe it just takes time to work out the kinks. And as a former student who tailgated significantly, I can say our group never had any issue with the UPD. Hopefully students/fans/alumni will show the UPD respect and issues like this will become a thing of the past. Not saying they aren't now, but a period of time without incident, could lead to a decrease in some of this tension.

My thoughts on the issue are similar to KU's. If people aren't following the clearly stated rules someone in authority should remind them that tailgating is a privelage and failure to obey the rules will result in removal of that privelage. I don't think there is much benefit in placing the cuffs on someone and hauling them off to jail, unless or course, they are a potential harm to themselves or others at that moment.

Finally, if they could clearly separate the students from the alumni and other fans attending the tailgating festivities I think it would help. Clearly, the most likely place for trouble is with the students. Most other places I have tailgated have a separate area quite a distance from others for the students. I think our students are for the most part well-behaved but you mix in the booze and trouble certainly can and often does follow.

Bottom line, I enjoy tailgaiting and I think its been a positive experience thus far for all parties involved. Sure, there have been a few hiccups but lets not let that ruin a great thing. See everyone in the Backyard on October 4th!

[RABBITALUM08]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

I can't really comment on my own personal experience because I haven't had the oppertunity to enjoy a tailgating at SDSU yet but from what my parents have told me, then can be quite annoying. Constantly being harassed while getting sweatshirts at halftime, being pushed out of the area as they pick up their tailgating stuff, etc. Personally I think it is ridiculous that you can't go enjoy a beverage at half time or after the game. Everyone wants to see SDSU be bigger and better as a university, sports, etc... i can speak about other places I have tailgated: Iowa St., Iowa, Neb, etc and they don't seem to have any of the problems that SDSU does. I think some things need to be looked at and changed a bit.

[2002jack]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register



Respect my authoritah!!!

[juniorjackgrownold]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

This is probably my first post. I just wanted to say that two years ago, after a Jackrabbit win, I was on my way to my vehicle. It was parked in the "Backyard." While I was walking to my vehicle, I was hit by a vehicle, hit me on my blindside. I was stunned when I realized it was a UPD vehicle. To make things worse, the officer that was driving the vehicle jumped out, and instantly blamed me. The first thing the officer said to me was that he needed to see my ID. I called his bluff, he was hoping that I was under the age of 21 (i was 23 at the time). I simply replied that I didn't have my ID. To get to the point, the officer made a huge mistake, and tried to cover it up by busting me underage drinking. I don't know why I didn't make a big deal out of it, but I found it very foolish, and stupid that his first concern wasn't about my well being, but about my age. It just proves the point that the UPD, and the university leadership, do not really care about the well being of the die hard Jackrabbit fans. All they care about is busting people, and we all know they, "high five" each other when they "catch" one. I don't know what you fellow Jackrabbit fans are gonna think of this, but I just had to say that. Simply, there has to be a change!! I have been to every game this year, and you can count on me being there tomorrow when the Jacks beat UNI!! Go Jacks!!

[RabbitinTea]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

Overall, I agree that the UPD seems to overstep their bounds. I don't want to add fuel to the fire, but something definitely changed starting around 1999-2000. I was a Junior then. When I got to school, I didn't notice too many people pulled over on campus...it was about as often as you see someone pulled over around town by the Brookings PD. However, around that time something changed with UPD. It was very drastic as I began to notice people being pulled over on a daily basis. I paid close attention and noticed someone pulled over pretty much everyday. Did studentsall of a sudden break more laws? How can it be possible to see more UPD cars with someone pulled over than BPD cars? UPD doesn't have enough to keep them busy and they hire power hungry kids trying to make a name for themselves. I like Mr. Heaton, but I think he's got a real problem on his hands...especially if they can't even manage a tailgate properly. Too much resistance and intimidation techniques are going to lead to dangerous results. I am certain of that fact.

[AnimalHouse83]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

Overall, I agree that the UPD seems to overstep their bounds. I don't want to add fuel to the fire, but something definitely changed starting around 1999-2000. I was a Junior then. When I got to school, I didn't notice too many people pulled over on campus...it was about as often as you see someone pulled over around town by the Brookings PD. However, around that time something changed with UPD. It was very drastic as I began to notice people being pulled over on a daily basis. I paid close attention and noticed someone pulled over pretty much everyday. Did studentsall of a sudden break more laws? How can it be possible to see more UPD cars with someone pulled over than BPD cars? UPD doesn't have enough to keep them busy and they hire power hungry kids trying to make a name for themselves. I like Mr. Heaton, but I think he's got a real problem on his hands...especially if they can't even manage a tailgate properly. Too much resistance and intimidation techniques are going to lead to dangerous results. I am certain of that fact.

As an alum, it's disappointing to read about stuff like this.

When I was in school, UPD was uniformed, but it didn't seem like they had authority to do much more than write parking tickets.

Someone else might be able to help me with this, but wasn't it around 1999 - 2000 that UPD became full fledged law enforcement agency? Maybe that's when their approach to "enforcement" changed.

[Jacked_Up]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

Mr. Langer and others make good points. Law enforcement has got to grow with the rest of the program. Football games aren't political conventions. Fans aren't protesters. Most of the time, laws can be enforced in low-key fashion, at least until a situation calls for stronger action. The university police should lighten up to the degree possible and help make guests' experience memorable in positive ways.

[RealityCheck]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

I also have been to tailgate parties at other colleges and they are a lot more fun. Especially NDSU. Of course for some odd reason the Alumni and other adults in Fargo seem to be a lot more mature then they are here, and for some stupid reason they seem to just have a beer or two and head to the game regardless of the rules. They need to understand that you don't leave until you are told to go three or four times. Adults should not be responsible for their own behavior in any venue. What kind of fans are they? Supporting their team sober? Geesh. On a side not, I wonder if the tailgate area would be more fun if it was just for students? It seems that UPD has to deal more with the "adults" than the students. Maybe that's what we need to lobby for, a student only Backyard. I bet UPD would still expect us to be safe and obey the law. Power trippers!

[RealityCheck]

Re: Jim Langers Editorial Brookings Register

I read this entire thread (and the letter to the editor) and could not agree more. You are all spot on! Don't people understand that supporting your team means getting as drunk as possible, acting like overgrown children and then passing out in a tree line instead of going to the game? Those sad people who just go to the game sober and actually cheer for the Jacks while actually being clear headed enough to understand what is happening make me sick. They are NOT true fans. True fans are beyond the point of intoxication and have given their own minds over to mob mentality and lack of oxygen.

UPD is evil. Period. They are so mean when they enforce the rules that we should all have been mature enough to follow on our own. Yep, the real issue here is UPD and not the grown men who urinate on the ground with children running around throwing footballs. The students who flip each other off and yell profanities while little kids look on in shock and amazement. The people who hold their Bratwurst like male sex organs and pretend to hump the air. It is UPD. After all they make the tailgate rules and they decided without any administrative direction what to do and how to do it. Not to mention the Hobo Day fiasco where people threw beer bottles at Police Officers and their cars in a drunken rage when asked to actually attend the game. I don't know how they tricked the crowd into throwing bottles, but it was clever for sure. That's UPD for you.

UPD needs to turn a blind eye when 40-50 year olds hide in the trees sucking back beers at half time. Aged Alumni should be allowed to make Freshman look like mature adults whenever they want to. After all, they do give a lot of money to the University and that entitles them to break the rules and the law. UPD also needs to smile and say "thank you Sir" when someone tells them to go "F___ themselves", that's the kind of customer service we expect from a law enforcement agency. Can't they just pick and choose what laws to enforce? Maybe a little more inconsistency would make things better? Alumni and parents are not interested in having a professional group of policeman protect their kids, not at the expense of ruining a good drunken stooper anyway.

In conclusion, UPD STOP DOING YOUR JOB! Instead can't we just designate the tailgate area as a lawless place to do whatever we want in the name of true sportsmanship and pride in SDSU? I know there is a lot of inappropriate things I have wanted to try and the tailgate area seems like the perfect place. With UPD there has never been a serious injury, rape, assault, alcohol poisoning, major theft, etc. That is NOT what we want UPD! Back off and let the mob rule! I am a true fan and supporter of SDSU. I will prove it on Hobo Days when you see me drunk and urinating in the parking lot of Coughlin Alumni Stadium. Could one you other true fans please stop by and hold my beer for me?