SDSU on Groupon

[goon]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

of course it would be a sell out. new and improved is always a draw. you have to look past 1 game tho.

But we also have to look to the future. If we are from 10K a game to avg 13 K agame, large games 15k-16k after 10 years. Why not build for use to grow to 16K avg and large games 20K? Just beause one game has a small crowd at the end of nov does not mean we should build it to taht size. We could not fill a 28K stadium, so we are not building to that size. It will be Able to fill current growth needs and future growth needs.

Do we want to spend 10 million extra now and build to future needs, or not spend it now and in 15-20 years spend 25 million on what could have only been 10 million if done originally.

[zooropa]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

the team is averaging less than 13k for the games

Average attendance is roughly 130% of capacity.

[zooropa]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

taxpayer money get's spent

What taxpayer money?

The amount that South Dakota spends subsidizing tuition for instate (and some out of state) students? The money that goes toward paying for classroom space, etc.?

Because taxpayer money does not go toward the student activity fee.

[KI DRIVER]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

if the stadium now holds only 10k, yes then you need more seats. build it so it is expandable. what the number of seats should be, i have no idea but i think a good starting point would be in the 13k-14k range. 18k-20k is an unrealistic number at this stage. remember, empty seats aren't good. show the powers that be, you can fill it on a regular basis and then go from there. just remember the product on the field is what puts fans in the seats. if there is a bad year on the field, fans will stay away. there are fair weather fans. if the football sucks attendance will drop. like it or not, that's how i see it.

[zooropa]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

if there is a bad year on the field, fans will stay away

Then SDSU should have removable seats. If a lot of great seniors graduate, SDSU can preemptively remove 3 or 4 thousand seats.

Bidding out and building a stadium that can't hold today's crowds (~15k) and won't be open until 2014 or later would be asinine.

18k with capacity to add 4k is the minimum, IMO.

[zooropa]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

And you know who the powers that be are?

It ain't the BoR. It ain't the legislature. It's the donors. They'll pay for this stadium.

[filbert]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

And you know who the powers that be are?

It ain't the BoR. It ain't the legislature. It's the donors. They'll pay for this stadium.

Not if the BoR doesn't let them build it . . .

[zooropa]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

Not if the BoR doesn't let them build it . . .

They pretty much can't, though.

I mean Queen Elizabeth can, theoretically, dissolve parliament. But in real world terms, it's not doable.

[JimmyJack]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

Here goes my rant of the day. Not directed at you KI, just this particular line of thinking.

The current stadium has about 10,000 seats.

Here are the average attendance numbers for the last 4.5 seasons:
2010 - 11,889 (Its safe to say 3 of 5 home games will have over 12K, 11K, and 12K)
2009 - 13,265 (5 of 5 games had over 12K, 13K, 14K, 15K, and 10K)
2008 - 9906 (3 of 6 home games had over 11K, 14K, and 15K)
2007 - 11218 (4 of 6 home games had over 10K, 14K, 15K, and 16K)
2006 - 9652 (2 of 4 home games had over 12K and 15K)

We don't have enough seating for 65% of our home games. Over the last two seasons, we don't have enough seats for 80% of our home games. 4 out of 5 home games are technically a sold out right now.

In other words, at least 17,000 people have attended SDSU football games in the last 5 years knowing they might not get a seat. Do you suppose another 17,000 stayed home because they knew they might not get a seat?

Would it be out of line to suggest that we need a 14,000 seat stadium as of today (30% of games for the last 5 years would still be sellouts)? How many seats will we need in 10 years? 20 years? 30 years?

IMO here's what will happen:

The stadium that gets built will seat about 8500 on each side (17,000 total capacity).

For the time being (5-15 years), the temporary aluminum bleachers under the scoreboard will stay in place. This will create a stadium with seating capacity of around 20,000, enough for big games like NDSU, UNI, USD, Hobo Day, and Beef Bowl.

Once we consistently average around 17,000 a game (only 4000 more than last year, 5000 more than this year so far) the permanent structure can be built for general admission endzone seating for a total permanent seating capacity of around 22,000.

I know that's not the proposal, but I'd bet that's what will happen once things get whittled down.

BTW, I wouldn't be shocked if we sold over 5000 season tickets the first season in the new stadium. That alone would probably be a good return on investment (each season ticket holder makes at least a $100 donation).

One of the things my students have found in their research on the topic of attendance at games is that overcrowding IS definitely a reason that some students don't go to games. They don't want to stand. Granted that's just students, but I think you're right and you can imagine that there are others who stay home because of overcrowding.

[KI DRIVER]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

And you know who the powers that be are?

It ain't the BoR. It ain't the legislature. It's the donors. They'll pay for this stadium.

just curious, how much money do the donors have in the bank right now? who's in charge of it?

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

just curious, how much money do the donors have in the bank right now? who's in charge of it?

1)Enough.
2)Their wives. (Did I say too much?)

[SoDakJack]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

if the stadium now holds only 10k, yes then you need more seats. build it so it is expandable. what the number of seats should be, i have no idea but i think a good starting point would be in the 13k-14k range. 18k-20k is an unrealistic number at this stage. remember, empty seats aren't good. show the powers that be, you can fill it on a regular basis and then go from there. just remember the product on the field is what puts fans in the seats. if there is a bad year on the field, fans will stay away. there are fair weather fans. if the football sucks attendance will drop. like it or not, that's how i see it.

Building a stadium that seats 13-14K is shortsighted and lacks common sense. It is much cheaper in the long run to build a stadium that seats 20-22k and grow into it than to expand a stadium 3 or 4 times to get to that number.

If there is a top notch stadium in place you will see many of those "fairweather fans" become full-fledged fans. We are losing more fans now because of a lack of facilities than a losing season would cost the Jackrabbits.

[KI DRIVER]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

1)Enough.
2)Their wives. (Did I say too much?)

good one!!!! they don't get treated any better than anyone else i guess.
if the money is there then start building. the bigger the better. this is all internet forum talk. the conversation should be directed at "the powers that be." whoever they are? start applying some pressure.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

if the stadium now holds only 10k, yes then you need more seats. build it so it is expandable. what the number of seats should be, i have no idea but i think a good starting point would be in the 13k-14k range. 18k-20k is an unrealistic number at this stage. remember, empty seats aren't good. show the powers that be, you can fill it on a regular basis and then go from there. just remember the product on the field is what puts fans in the seats. if there is a bad year on the field, fans will stay away. there are fair weather fans. if the football sucks attendance will drop. like it or not, that's how i see it.

Over the last 5 seasons, 50% (13/26) of SDSU's home games have had attendances of greater than 12,000. 38% (10/26) have had attendance of greater than 13,000 (that's butts in the seats, tickets sold would certainly be higher numbers).

So, we could fill a 13,000 seat stadium consistently right now, hence the desire to build something in the 18K to 22K range.

Your argument is part of the reason I believe the final product will have approximately 17000 seats on the east and west side and temporary bleachers in the south endzone.

One thing to remember is that the final horseshoe will need to be built to hold at least the next 30 or so years of growth. Once permanent structures are on all 4 sides of the stadium, the only place to go is up or start over from scratch, which gets exponentially more expensive. Nebraska, for example, wants to add 5000 seats at a cost of 55.5 million. That's about the same price as SDSU's entire 22,000 seat stadium proposal.

[SDSUAlum08]

Re: SDSU on Groupon

BTW, I wouldn't be shocked if we sold over 5000 season tickets the first season in the new stadium. That alone would probably be a good return on investment (each season ticket holder makes at least a $100 donation).

Fantastic post. I only copied this over because I was thinking the same thing. I will definitely be getting season tickets when they get the new stadium and probably sooner once they announce the final building plans. (I'm in grad school living off loans so can't now)