Boo Summit League

[joeboo22]

Re: Boo Summit League

basketball there will be a rivalry....... same conference..... players from same region for most part... and so on..... football I wonder about.... partly because I just don't think USD is on the same level, and partly because I think that USD football is not that popular because they don't play anybody that anybody knows..... SDSU had the same problem there first couple of years but they had a solid NDSU team to go through it with and got into a good regional conference..... I just don't know if USD can do the same thing....

[Grizzled_Jack]

Re: Boo Summit League

I disagree. What is your reasoning behind this? You state this over and over again but its just rhetoric without any reasoning. A rivalry that dates back over 100 years doesn't disappear after 7-8 years of absence.

Personally, I don't think the rivalry ever left. Why else would the smack section be full of udot posts? Why are there two threads about USD in this section alone full of posts? I know that I will attend every chance I can as will a large number of people I went to school with. We went from 100 years of a hot war to a period of cold war and we are getting ready to kick it off again. That's awesome IMO. Bring it on.

I think the grads will care but you have a generation of students (a freshman-senior generation, not twenty years) that have never experienced the rivalry, plus there seems to be a different emphasis from students these days. I'm sure I missed some football and basketball games during my days in Brookings but don't remember doing so.

I had to ask a number of students at WIU before I found out where the field house was, and that's a residential school-- not IUPUI. There's more things to do on campus now plus a new generation of kids that aren't into the same things.

To old timers, there are tons of memories about the rivalry, both good and bad that make for these spirited posts. I'm not at all sure that the same feelings will transfer to the students-- this is a pretty long break when you're 21 and have never seen a game. I think the rivalry is more fragile than others do and I suspect it won't be an automatic renewal of a big-time game.

[boxerboy]

Re: Boo Summit League

How?

How will USD being D-1 affect SDSU in WBB? SDSU was ranked this year, USD caught North Carolina off-guard and scared them silly. You think USD is going to close that gap enough to impact SDSU's recruiting in 'four or five years?' I don't think so. Assuming that USD can interfere with what SDSU has in WBB does a disservice to just how good a coach AJ is. 3rd in the country for AP coach of the year. You think USD can touch that with a ten-foot pole? You've got this 9th grader in Canby whose parents are allegedly 'waiting' to hear from SDSU. That's what SDSU is in WBB. USD can't compete with that.

As to the whole 'not enough talent' line or reasoning, I'm not buying it. Minnesota has only one D-1 school. Five million people. One D-1 school.

That is a gross UNDER-representation.

Geez dude get some Ritalin, this is my opinion. If there are four teams in an area going after the same people with an opportunity for the same prize it only makes sense that we may very well lose some quality talent to USD or UND in the future. I still believe we will have good teams but I sincerely believe in regards to balance in the Summit between these 4 Dakota teams that it will become closer.
AJ is a fine coach no doubt about it. Yet even in the days when UCLA was dominating mens BB and John Wooden was asked about his success the first thing he always referenced was getting the best talent available. AJ has been able for the most part to do that with fewer Div I teams in the area. There will more than likely be two new Div I teams in the conf. and in our backyard within 5 years. If you do not think that will have an impact on recruiting your fooling yourself.
Let's also be real here, SDSU has had some great years recently with womens BB but if you believe that has made them a team that is nationally recognized as a place where the top national recruits want to go and play your mistaken. We are a regional force and we still need a lot more success before we can be that national team. This means our base rightfully will continue to be the upper Midwest. However once girls know they can go for the same prize at USD then we will see some of these girls start to go there. I do believe SDSU will continue to be a regional force but...

[TeaJackrabbit]

Re: Boo Summit League

Some of you are angered about resuming the rivalry, others think it's wonderful. Frankly, I don't think the rivalry's coming back. I doubt if USD will draw much better than WIU. After all WIU's a rival in football as well as basketball and the posts on their board mentioned what a good game the last second victory over SDSU was. I just think people are sweating about nothing. This is no big deal. I bet in a few years the Summit will wish they picked up UVSU as a partner for SUU and left USD alone. SDSU-USD will turn into one big yawn with 2500 fans (if lucky) showing up at either site. The fact that it WAS one of the oldest rivalries in the country should (and will) count for nothing.

You don't think SDSU-USD will draw much better than WIU? 2,500? Boy, with all due respect, I just don't agree with that. I think it will be much hyped and standing room only. I can't wait!

[zooropa]

Re: Boo Summit League

Geez dude get some Ritalin, this is my opinion. If there are four teams in an area going after the same people with an opportunity for the same prize

What's the same prize?

USD, NDSU: Get a scholarship & try and knock off SDSU

SDSU: Get a scholarship and try and knock off Maryland, Baylor, Tennessee, etc.

There's a world of difference in what SDSU has to offer vs. USD & NDSU.

[Grizzled_Jack]

Re: Boo Summit League

You don't think SDSU-USD will draw much better than WIU? 2,500? Boy, with all due respect, I just don't agree with that. I think it will be much hyped and standing room only. I can't wait!

1/3 of the old timers can't wait.
1/3 will treat it like any other game
1/3 will make sure not to show up just to show their displeasure.

The students don't remember the rivalry and will react much like they would for any other game. Results= just another Summit game.

[filbert]

Re: Boo Summit League

1/3 of the old timers can't wait.
1/3 will treat it like any other game
1/3 will make sure not to show up just to show their displeasure.

The students don't remember the rivalry and will react much like they would for any other game. Results= just another Summit game.

I have no intention of visiting Vermillion again (at least until they build a new basketball facility, which I'd be curious to see) but won't shy away from games in Brookings (or in Sioux Falls) for that matter. Reasonable people may disagree with this stand.

I do think it's selling it a bit short to say that students won't care. There are still a lot of SD high school friends who parted ways to go to the two schools, and they will undoubtedly engage with each other on that level via the rivalry. It will be different than playing, say, UMKC.

We alumni can have a say in it by determining how vitriolic we want to be about the whole affair. The kids will play off whatever emotion the old f@rts bring to the games.

[zooropa]

Re: Boo Summit League

Re: attendance

If no more SDSU fans go to a game against USD than a game against WIU, the attendance will still be considerably higher as USD fans will go.

Subsequently, SDSU fans desiring to stand aloof and make 'no big deal' about the rivalry will end up drawn into it, as who wants 500 visiting 'Yote fans to turn Frost into 'their house'?

[mitchellrabbit]

Re: Boo Summit League

im really confused. ive been a jack fan for 35 years and have missed the usd/sdsu games. im excited about it coming back. i know the current students know nothing about it but dont you think with friends attending both universities, that it wont become a big thing again? its all going to be how many students show up for the games. there will be plenty of us old farts there. and i think the students will be there too. 2500? whatever. it will be packed at frost. the dome? not sure

[RabbitObsessed]

Re: Boo Summit League

1/3 of the old timers can't wait.
1/3 will treat it like any other game
1/3 will make sure not to show up just to show their displeasure.

The students don't remember the rivalry and will react much like they would for any other game. Results= just another Summit game.

And this is from when you talked to every student and ever alum of SDSU???

Sure most students don't remember the rivalry but a lot remember that it happened. The ones growing up in SD do anyways. And I would love for you to find me a student that could tell you **** about any other school we play except NDSU. Hell, I follow sports and I really don't know anything about IUPUI or IPFW or whatever. Most of the students do know about USD though. They have friends that go there, like mitchel said, and it will be a big game for name recognition alone.

[NoVaJack]

Re: Boo Summit League

Some of you are angered about resuming the rivalry, others think it's wonderful. Frankly, I don't think the rivalry's coming back. I doubt if USD will draw much better than WIU. After all WIU's a rival in football as well as basketball and the posts on their board mentioned what a good game the last second victory over SDSU was. I just think people are sweating about nothing. This is no big deal. I bet in a few years the Summit will wish they picked up UVSU as a partner for SUU and left USD alone. SDSU-USD will turn into one big yawn with 2500 fans (if lucky) showing up at either site. The fact that it WAS one of the oldest rivalries in the country should (and will) count for nothing.

I'd take any of the bets offered in this post.

[boxerboy]

Re: Boo Summit League

What's the same prize?

USD, NDSU: Get a scholarship & try and knock off SDSU

SDSU: Get a scholarship and try and knock off Maryland, Baylor, Tennessee, etc.

There's a world of difference in what SDSU has to offer vs. USD & NDSU.

Let us not get to high and mighty here Zooropa. USD nearly knocked off UNC at Chapel Hill. Call it a fluke if you want. USD will compete for the same athletes and they will offer them an opportunity to build on an already pretty good program. Once again your fooling yourself if you think 5 years from now it will be just as easy for AJ to get all but one of the top prospects in the state. That is if we can keep AJ that long. All of this I say because I am against USD and UND being accepted in to the Summit League

[zooropa]

Re: Boo Summit League

Let us not get to high and mighty here Zooropa.

I'm not being high and mighty, I'm being realistic.

I cannot conceive of a way to emphasize to you the gap that exists between SDSU & USD when it comes to the quality of their programs, their coaching staffs, etc.

If you believe that scaring North Carolina in a throw-away game will draw away the kind of players that THRIVE in AJ's system................. Shoot. Go look at what SDSU did during year one of their transition. Their FIRST D-1 game was against Rutgers--and they lost by 12, their second game was against Kentucky and they beat them. They beat a ranked team in their second year in D-1, and they went to the WNIT in their third.

AJ & Melum didn't cast their net wide BEFORE this year, and going forward they'll cast it even more narrowly. The kind of players that they target are players that they will either land or lose to a BETTER school.

It's not as though SDSU & USD are even remotely comparable in what they've done, where they've been. SDSU and USD are NOT peers when it comes to WBB. SDSU has an ascendancy that USD cannot take away.

[Coyote_Fan]

Re: Boo Summit League

im really confused. ive been a jack fan for 35 years and have missed the usd/sdsu games. im excited about it coming back. i know the current students know nothing about it but dont you think with friends attending both universities, that it wont become a big thing again? its all going to be how many students show up for the games. there will be plenty of us old farts there. and i think the students will be there too. 2500? whatever. it will be packed at frost. the dome? not sure

I can tell you this much, actual attendance in the dome will be higher for that game every year in Vermillion than it will be in Brookings because Frost will have capacity of half of the number of fans that have interest in going. USD has drawn 8K to 9K in some of their games against the Jacks in the recent past which is basically double what they got for any other conference game in the NCC. Maybe not every year but many years. Even if USD had inflated the numbers I can gaurantee there were at least 6K fans at those games in Vermillion and maybe 1,000-1500 of them were SDSU fans. There are easily 2,000 minimum in the lower bleachers and 4,000 minimum everywhere else. Frost only holds 6,000 plus anymore. Vermillion will allow every fan that wants to go to be admitted but SDSU will not afford that luxury. The Dome might not be the best basketball facility in the world but as a Jacks fan that really wanted to see the game would you rather be sitting in a seat that is aways off the court or would you rather be driving back to Brookings listening on the radio?

[Coyote_Fan]

Re: Boo Summit League

I'm not being high and mighty, I'm being realistic.

I cannot conceive of a way to emphasize to you the gap that exists between SDSU & USD when it comes to the quality of their programs, their coaching staffs, etc.

If you believe that scaring North Carolina in a throw-away game will draw away the kind of players that THRIVE in AJ's system................. Shoot. Go look at what SDSU did during year one of their transition. Their FIRST D-1 game was against Rutgers--and they lost by 12, their second game was against Kentucky and they beat them. They beat a ranked team in their second year in D-1, and they went to the WNIT in their third.

AJ & Melum didn't cast their net wide BEFORE this year, and going forward they'll cast it even more narrowly. The kind of players that they target are players that they will either land or lose to a BETTER school.

It's not as though SDSU & USD are even remotely comparable in what they've done, where they've been. SDSU and USD are NOT peers when it comes to WBB. SDSU has an ascendancy that USD cannot take away.

I suppose it was also a fluke that USD football played UNI as close or even better than what SDSU did at the UNI Dome. It was also probably a fluke that USD Womens basketball just came off a national runner up finish 2 years ago. SDSU is ahead in the transition, they have some built in advantages. But to say that their is such a wide gap between programs is ridiculous. Most likely USD Mens basketball is about on the same level as SDSU already. In football SDSU is a bit ahead in scholarship maturity but USD isn't as far behind as you would like to think.

SDSU will have an advantage for awhile and a natural one but every year that both teams are competing on the same level than the "being first" advantage goes away and then it's just program vs program.

Most of you believe nothing can touch SDSU womens basketball but I invite you to look at history a bit. A bit over a decade ago SDSU was losing to NDSU and UND by 30 a game. What Bison or Sioux fan would have ever thought those tables would have been turned. A.J. is just one big opening away from turning the program over to someone else. Not that it's necessarily going to happen but it certainly could and has almost occurred as little as a couple of years ago. USD Womens basketball was a complete mess a little over a decade ago. I would actually count down each possession and said to myself in my mind that if they didn't get a shot off by 10 seconds on the shot clock that they would turn it over first. I was right a good number of times with that. USD used to challenge Morningside for the bottom spot for a few years. USD couldn't hang within 40 of the ND teams. It was embarrassing. Now USD is on very even terms with UND and probably NDSU. SDSU is now on top but that doesn't mean it will remain that way forever. You just need to enjoy the success while it is here because as soon as it's taken for granted is when it will be gone in no time, at least the era of dominance will be.

The thing about the USD SDSU rivalry is that it ebbs and flows. SDSU usually has the advantage in the overall AD but in the big sports it tends to fluctuate. As much as you would like to see it go your way you will not dominate USD in all 3 of the big sports. USD went through one of their worst times in their football program ever in the 90's and early 00's. USD football has definately risen under Meierkort and during the 70's and 80's USD was regularly beating SDSU and making the playoffs and an occassional major run at a national title. Something SDSU never really did.

You will have your share of successes but you are also going to have to accept that USD will also have their fair share of theirs.