Summit League to Visit USD

[Jacks-02]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Anyone have a rough guess or know how much the Summit gets for the NCAA tournament? I think we get a certain amount per game and its split among the conference teams isn't it?

In that respect, unless a team helps as a core member (Chicago St.) or is necessary to replace a team we don't know about leaving (Centenary?) I don't know what the hurry is to add USD/UND.

Sure they could add attendance revenue for NDSU/SDSU games, but if that is the only benefit why not just schedule them non-conference and get the same effect while also having a bigger share of the NCAA Tourney money?

Is there worry that USD/UND are going to get picked up by the Big Sky or any other conference?

I understand the conference stability angle, but there really isn't any conference stability gained as far as NCAA auto-bid req's go until 2020 is there? Why add them now?

[joeboo22]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Anyone have a rough guess or know how much the Summit gets for the NCAA tournament? I think we get a certain amount per game and its split among the conference teams isn't it?

In that respect, unless a team helps as a core member (Chicago St.) or is necessary to replace a team we don't know about leaving (Centenary?) I don't know what the hurry is to add USD/UND.

Sure they could add attendance revenue for NDSU/SDSU games, but if that is the only benefit why not just schedule them non-conference and get the same effect while also having a bigger share of the NCAA Tourney money?

Is there worry that USD/UND are going to get picked up by the Big Sky or any other conference?

I understand the conference stability angle, but there really isn't any conference stability gained as far as NCAA auto-bid req's go until 2020 is there? Why add them now?

My guess/view is its just to see what they can offer the conference as a university.... So if Centenary comes out and announces tomorrow that they are moving to D-III that they can say USD come join..... I still think that there are other options.... Chicago State, a Southland Conference team possibly, or a Denver (my favorite)... Or even talk to a UWGB or a UW-Millwaulkee to see if they would ever consider coming over.... I just think that the conference should look at established teams already, maybe they have asked and the schools have said thanx but no thanx but I just don't see what USD offers the conference now.... When they get out of transition I would welcome them to the conference, could help keep the conference tournament close, would help with travel for SDSU and everything but right now I want what is best for the conference and I don't think they are it...

[EQguy]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I live about 50 miles from Verm, Its a solid 6 hour bus drive from where I am from, so I would figure right around 5..... in the summer its fine, in the Winter though, its anybodies guess.

Wow, I always figured it was only 4 hrs. from Sioux Falls. Hence the reason I started the post with I may be wrong but...

[EQguy]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I think it doesn't hurt to do due diligence early. Its not like they are going to be in the conference next year. I would bet an invite comes before their last year in transition. If I had a guess its being done to force UND to do something so they can bring them both in at the same time.

[Cowbell]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

USD does not have the money to remain at DI level. The SDSU program will struggle as well.

Ugly days are ahead. Count on it.

[Coyote_Fan]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

USD does not have the money to remain at DI level. The SDSU program will struggle as well.

Ugly days are ahead. Count on it.

Do you have any links that USD doesn't have the money to remain in D1? It seems like the building going up all around campus tend to suggest regarding USD finances. Unless it's just the business schools creative accounting.

[UWMandSDSU]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

My guess/view is its just to see what they can offer the conference as a university.... So if Centenary comes out and announces tomorrow that they are moving to D-III that they can say USD come join..... I still think that there are other options.... Chicago State, a Southland Conference team possibly, or a Denver (my favorite)... Or even talk to a UWGB or a UW-Millwaulkee to see if they would ever consider coming over.....

Joe I know you are just thinking out loud but UW-Milwaukee (IMHO) will never consider switching to the Summit League. The Horizon league and the institutions that belong to it are very different from the institutions in the Summit League.

[dozer1981]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

sounds like the main reason that they would want USD is for the Indoor Track facilities. No where in the league right now for conference meets. Just a thought

[Hammersmith]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

sounds like the main reason that they would want USD is for the Indoor Track facilities. No where in the league right now for conference meets. Just a thought

Could be true. However, NDSU will be remodeling the BSA within a few years to make it comply with NCAA DI championship regulations(it currently is a six-lane track; DI needs eight).

We're really caught in a tough spot right now. We need the BSA renovation more than anything else(and we've got half the money raised: ~$12M of $22M), but we can't proceed until whether we know if the Fargodome basketball addition is going to happen. We also can't tap our larger donors to complete the BSA fundraising, because we don't know if those dollars might be needed for the FD arena. Apparently, a big donor was about to buy the naming rights right up until the economy tanked. So, we're all stuck waiting for something to break the logjam.

[zooropa]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Joe I know you are just thinking out loud but UW-Milwaukee (IMHO) will never consider switching to the Summit League. The Horizon league and the institutions that belong to it are very different from the institutions in the Summit League.

Didn't half the Horizon League come from the Summit (Midcon)?

Edit:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horizon_League

It's actually 7 of 10 members that came from the Summit.

[JackJD]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Summit's Douple cautions against scheduling UND...saw this link provided by Hammersmith on BV: LINK

You may have to set up a password etc (no charge and not much hassle) to get to the article from the Fargo Forum (in-Forum password will work with the Grand Forks paper and the Fargo Forum).

Opening paragraph:
"The Summit League commissioner Tom Douple on Wednesday cautioned his members to wait until the nickname controversy at the University of North Dakota is resolved before moving into further scheduling agreements with the Sioux."
The story is a "teaser"...it ends with "For more, see tomorrow's Forum"

[joeboo22]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Didn't half the Horizon League come from the Summit (Midcon)?

Edit:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horizon_League

It's actually 7 of 10 members that came from the Summit.

I was thinking out loud but I was just wondering if there was a team or 2 in the Horizon that is currently a misfit.......

Here are other teams I'd look at
1. Central Arkansas University- they are currently in transition and will be out of transition for the 2010-2011 season.... offer mens-(football, basketball, baseball, soccer, golf, track and cross country), women-(basketball, softball, soccer, tennis, golf, track and cross country) 243 miles to Tulsa OK, about a 30 minutes from Little Rock..

2. Denver University- offer some different sports (skiing, lacrosse) but is a full pledged D-I school with good facilities and is located in a major US city

3. Chicago State University- don't really know why they left in the first place but again a major city, and full pledged university

USD, UND, maybe if you could get DU you could talk to UNC (some may dislike them but I think they'd consider it)....

[zooropa]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I was thinking out loud but I was just wondering if there was a team or 2 in the Horizon that is currently a misfit.......

I don't think so. It's a pretty tight little league.

Unfortunately it and the Valley are pretty poor models for the Summit. Instead, the Summit brass should look at the Sunbelt or C-USA for insight into how to promote and build a sprawling conference.

[FargoBison]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

I would love to add Denver, USD and UND...The profile of the league would be raised and we would be adding the right type of schools.

West
NDSU-UND
SDSU-USD
SUU-Denver

East
ORU-UMKC
WIU-IUPUI
Oak-IPFW

[Hammersmith]

Re: Summit League to Visit USD

Summit Candidates: (not all-inclusive, but close, and only in a rough order of likelihood)

1. Chicago State: Member of the Great West Conference. Mid-Con member until they were basically told to "leave or we'll kick you out" due to some widespread NCAA violations. They cleaned up their house well enough that they were never officially sanctioned by the NCAA, but the aura from that time lingers. Small school with a very limited budget located in a major media market that doesn't even know they exist. Just built a new arena through that old Illinois institution of crooked politics. The major advantage of the university is that it is one of the few NCAA core members floating around without a solid home. Good travel partner for Oakland.

2. Utah Valley University: Member of the Great West Conference. Until recently, UVU was a two-year school going by the name Utah Valley State College. As they added four-year programs, they went straight from the NJCAA to Division I; not a common occurrence. They are a large school compared to the rest of the Summit(23,000+), but much of that is still due to the many two-year students. At the moment, they offer more than 270 trade/tech programs but only 56 bachelor degrees. There is talk of UVU adding football in the future, but they have enough on their plate at the moment, so that decision is still many years away. They are located in Orem, which is only a few miles from BYU in Provo. Thus, they will never be more than a blip in their own media market. The only thing they have going for them is the roughly three-hour bus trip(all on interstate) to Southern Utah and the easy accessibility through the airport in Provo.

3. & 4. University of North/South Dakota: Members of the Great West Conference. Not much needs to be said here; we know them both well enough. USD can function as the travel partner for several schools, while UND only works as NDSU's. Overall, UND has the better facilities, budget and enrollment, but the difference is not insurmountable. Both media markets are tiny, and both host cities are about the same difficulty to get to by air.

5. Houston Baptist University: Member of the Great West Conference. Once a successful member of Division I, they went through a period of terrible leadership that forced them to cut many sports and drop to the NAIA. Under new leadership, they are now trying to rebuild their athletic department, including taking back their place in Division I. Another small school(2,500), HBU will probably be trying for admission in the Southland Conference for travel reasons, but they would make a good partner for Centenary(~5 hours on US highways). They will not be able to tap into the Houston sports market to any significant degree, but air travel into Houston would be very easy.

6. University of Denver: Member of the Sun Belt Conference. DU(don't ask about the order of the letters; it's a western thing) is in mild trouble with the Sun Belt at the moment. The SBC issued a directive last year stating that all members must sponsor a minimum number of SBC sports(16, I think). DU is well beneath this number and does not appear to be interested in adding the necessary sports. It's a badly kept secret that DU is not happy in the SBC, and the feeling appears to be mutual. A very proud institution, DU would only consider the Summit as a last resort. The West Coast Conference is very attractive to them because of the shared religious roots and very strong academics, though it is highly unlikely that the WCC would be interested in a Rocky Mountain school. Both the Mountain West and Western Athletic Conferences have been mentioned as potential homes, but DU's lack of a football program is often seen as a fatal flaw. The same is true of the Big Sky Conference, though it's likely that DU considers itself "too good" for the BSC. Enrollment is around 10,000 with an even split between undergrads and grads. With it's very eclectic selection of sports and its proximity to both Colorado and Colorado State, it's unlikely that DU will ever capture much of the Denver media market with the exception of hockey(they play in the WCHA with UND, Minn, Mich, etc). Travel in and out would be incredibly easy, though it's really too far to SUU to travel by bus, especially in winter(8.5 hours at best). DU is also an NCAA core member.

7. University of New Orleans: Member of the Sun Belt Conference. The "real" UNO is in the same trouble with the Sun Belt as DU; in UNO's case, it was due to Hurricane Katrina. As the campus and the rest of New Orleans has recovered from the storm, UNO has added sports to try to return to the pre-Katrina levels. It's been slow going, however, and the SBC is getting impatient. It's unlikely that UNO will actually get forced out, but, if it does, it would be another good travel partner for Centenary(5.5 hours by bus) and would likely be willing to take what it could get. Yet another school unlikely to garner a significant share of its major media market, UNO is easy to travel to by air and is also an NCAA core member.

8. University of Texas - Pan American: Member of the Great West Conference. A medium sized school(17,000) in a terrible location, UTPA would likely only be considered if the Summit were in dire straits. Located about four hours south of San Antonio, UTPA is about as far south as you can get and still be in the continental US. The only reason it's on this list is its NCAA core member status.


Others:
The University of Central Arkansas was fully admitted to the Southland Conference last year and appears to be very happy. The Summit cannot compete with the much shorter distances in the Southland and it's very doubtful that UCA would even consider the Summit even for a moment. UCA's entire move to Division I started when the Southland approached them.

Southern Illinois University - Edwardsville is "our" SIU's little brother. Another transitional school, SIU-E would have been a decent choice for WIU's travel partner until the Ohio Valley Conference got them first. SIU-E will be slowly phased into OVC play until they become full members in 2009-10. Probably the worst acronym of the bunch(can't you hear the opponent's student section calling out: "Sooeee! Here piggy-piggy! Sooeee!").