NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

[jacksfan29]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

The difference in fees between the schools is under $50 per student. And although I stand corrected, I do believe the students themselves voted on this last spring. So nice try.

However, you may want to examine how many dollars each respective schools foundation has given to make the D1 thing happen. I'm not positive that those that give had what has happened in mind when they gave. It looks like one entity has leveraged their future.

I'm wondering, one; where do you get your numbers? Two, has USD announced details on how they intend to fund FCOA for all athletes? I don't recall seeing any details so as a Coyote fan maybe you can help me out.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

What are you saying here? There may be some questionable decisions on how this money is spent?

You hear all the sad stories about how an athlete couldn't make it home for Christmas or something because they couldn't afford a plane ticket. The reality is that most of this money is going to be spent on things similar to a BMW. I think that's the reason some people dislike the idea.

Just illustrating that $570 wouldn't just be extra beer money for a college student that already has tuition, fees, room, board, and books paid for. Which could upset the "normal" students whose fees go toward what they see as a lavish lifestyle.

[goon]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

What are you saying here? There may be some questionable decisions on how this money is spent?

You hear all the sad stories about how an athlete couldn't make it home for Christmas or something because they couldn't afford a plane ticket. The reality is that most of this money is going to be spent on things similar to a BMW. I think that's the reason some people dislike the idea.

To me thats part of the issue. Also No one ever forces kids to play college sports. If they dont have the means to have family money to help in college, or they dont take loans like most college kids do, I dont know if paying all college athletes who choose to be college athletes is the right thing.

The 2nd issue I see is, where does it stop. to me the amount of money is more then enough. Frankly I would rather the confrence have more say in how much or how its decided. but thats still a slippery slope. Right now its X number of dollars, Maybe in 5 years its XYZ. That eventually it will comes down to paying college athletes with little control or ability to stop it.

[goon]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

Just illustrating that $570 wouldn't just be extra beer money for a college student that already has tuition, fees, room, board, and books paid for. Which could upset the "normal" students whose fees go toward what they see as a lavish lifestyle.

Or even kids or academic or music or any other scholarship. There are many that take huge work loads for classes, for labs and research and all sorts of things that really limit their ability to work or have extra income because of how of busy they are. So they might see it as some athlete who is taking 12 easy credits gets paid extra to cover costs, while someone who is wokring their butts off in the classroom doesnt get anything to help them out like the athlete gets.

[MontanaRabbit]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

Or even kids or academic or music or any other scholarship. There are many that take huge work loads for classes, for labs and research and all sorts of things that really limit their ability to work or have extra income because of how of busy they are. So they might see it as some athlete who is taking 12 easy credits gets paid extra to cover costs, while someone who is wokring their butts off in the classroom doesnt get anything to help them out like the athlete gets.

Not many people are paying thousands of dollars per year to watch trumpet solos.

The NCAA is exploiting college athletes (mainly FB and MBB) and FCOA is the NCAA trying to say well look we are paying the athletes now. I don't like the idea but understand why it's happening. Their current model is lining the pockets of a lot of adults and something needs to be done or the NCAA will cease to exist as we currently know it. I'm not sure FCOA is going to solve the issue.

The value of a full-ride scholarship is worth something but the NCAA is making way too much money to just point to that.

[jbjack]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

I dislike COA but if we are going to play in the realm, it needs to be offered. Between the lines of Sell's comments I read "we have too many obligations and our funding sources may be tapped to potential, we just can't afford across the board COA right now." If that is true, I think that SDSU must give a long hard look at cutting non-revenue programs and bring our offerings in line with our peers.

Although we are not fully funding scholarships in many nonrevenue sports, there is fairly significant expense in running the programs themselves (think coaching salaries, travel, etc.). That in and of itself is a problem. Golf, Swimming, Diving, Equestrian, Tennis, even Wrestling should be on the block. The savings should be directed in some formula towards program funding for remaining revenue and non-revenue sports such as additional scholarship funding (think track), coaching positions and salaries, and also towards funding COA. Strengthen remaining programs and remain relevant on the recruiting scene.

Although there is no science to it, I liken the situation to UofM and Wiscy. 25 years ago, Wiscy refocused its competitive efforts by dropping some non-revenue sports and focusing on their revenue sports and has enjoyed tremendous athletic success. By comparison, UofM has given oversized deference to non-revenue sports to a point where revenue sports are at a competitive disadvantage while the rowers have new boathouses, the women have a pavilion they do not use, etc. I don't believe its an either or proposition between having a big athletic department vs. a strong athletic department but it is certainly easier to have the latter without the former.

As much as we might like to believe COA won't have an affect on recruits, we can delude ourselves. It will matter. SDSU has much to offer students and student athletes. However, student athletes generally prefer to play at the highest level possible and for the best deal possible. In a recruiting class of 20 kids, a good number of them will be swayed by the possibility of $20,000 for doing nothing more. As much as we might like to think we don't want the kid that is swayed, we want a winner. Our 19,000 stadium will look mighty funny with 5,000 in the stands watching NDSUs also-rans - and tough to make the bond payments to boot.

[JACKGUYII]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

This is right on!

[propar80]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

Nicely done jbjack.
I absolutely despise COA and what I think it will do to college athletics over time. But at this point if we want to play with the big boys at our level just in our area/conference it's time for tough decisions to be made.
Long-Term I don't see anything wrong with putting more of our resources towards the programs that pay the bills. Even if that means cutting programs.
SDSU has to stay competitive in revenue generating sports and now with a new $65 million stadium payment...We cannot ignore COA and football even for 1 recruiting cycle.
I do trust our administration will get this right...but I'll be honest, Zimmer's article with Justin did nothing to make me feel confident about the situation the way it stands presently.

[bigticket1]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

I wish they would pro-rate the amount of COA depending on whether the student-athlete lives on or off campus. Upperclassmen that live off campus and need to pay rent and buy food should get the full amount,while freshmen and sophomores that live on campus and are on a meal plan should receive a smaller amount. Giving $570/month to freshmen who don't need to pay rent or buy food could be a disaster waiting to happen in many cases.

[JimmyJack]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

Nicely done jbjack.
I absolutely despise COA and what I think it will do to college athletics over time. But at this point if we want to play with the big boys at our level just in our area/conference it's time for tough decisions to be made.
Long-Term I don't see anything wrong with putting more of our resources towards the programs that pay the bills. Even if that means cutting programs.
SDSU has to stay competitive in revenue generating sports and now with a new $65 million stadium payment...We cannot ignore COA and football even for 1 recruiting cycle.
I do trust our administration will get this right...but I'll be honest, Zimmer's article with Justin did nothing to make me feel confident about the situation the way it stands presently.

I don't hate the idea. I understand that student athletes can't have regular jobs to pay for ordinary things that college students need. I do question whether they need $5,000 a year for those expenses. Keep in mind, though, that some of these young people come from difficult circumstances and don't necessarily have parents who can provide them with day-to-day living expenses.

Here's an interesting article about some universities going beyond the "actual" COA with their stipends. https://www.insidehighered.com/news/...pends-athletes

I'm hopeful that there is a compromise possible here whereby COA is provided, but at a lower level than the numbers being thrown around. I don't have any inside information, but that would be my hope.

[RochJack69]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

Or even kids or academic or music or any other scholarship. There are many that take huge work loads for classes, for labs and research and all sorts of things that really limit their ability to work or have extra income because of how of busy they are. So they might see it as some athlete who is taking 12 easy credits gets paid extra to cover costs, while someone who is wokring their butts off in the classroom doesnt get anything to help them out like the athlete gets.

I'm guessing that they are going to do what they are going to do, with or without our opinions. It would be nice to see deserving students get more help so they won't have to work so much in a part time job and concentrate on studies or research. Too long gone for me to know what is happening now, but I am guessing that the average student doesn't get the tutorial help that student athletes get handed to them.

[RabbitObsessed]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

I hope every big time college football star spends all of their COA on BMW leases, drives around wearing gold chains, and fuels the Beemers with the burning paper of every "outraged" newspaper column from some old white dude who is upset. GFY if you're going to tell someone else how to spend their own money. Don't like that they get paid? Stop watching ESPN college football, stop spending money on tickets and donations to athletic departments, stop participating in March Madness pools, and convince everyone you know do the same. "Can't believe these college kids are spending their money on something stupid! *15 minutes earlier* "When can I start buying tickets to the conference tournament that I wouldn't be going to if these athletes weren't providing entertainment."

/inb4 "they get paid by their free education!"

[jack power]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

I hope every big time college football star spends all of their COA on BMW leases, drives around wearing gold chains, and fuels the Beemers with the burning paper of every "outraged" newspaper column from some old white dude who is upset. GFY if you're going to tell someone else how to spend their own money. Don't like that they get paid? Stop watching ESPN college football, stop spending money on tickets and donations to athletic departments, stop participating in March Madness pools, and convince everyone you know do the same. "Can't believe these college kids are spending their money on something stupid! *15 minutes earlier* "When can I start buying tickets to the conference tournament that I wouldn't be going to if these athletes weren't providing entertainment."

/inb4 "they get paid by their free education!"

^ Rep points ^

Im all for FCOA. The University financial aid office calculates what the full cost of attendance is. That number affects school loans and Pell grants. While you can challenge their figures and what goes in to them, it's a real number. If AJ calls a recruit and offers them a full scholarship, then give them the full amount that SDSU says it costs to attend.

[filbert]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

I hope every big time college football star spends all of their COA on BMW leases, drives around wearing gold chains, and fuels the Beemers with the burning paper of every "outraged" newspaper column from some old white dude who is upset. GFY if you're going to tell someone else how to spend their own money. Don't like that they get paid? Stop watching ESPN college football, stop spending money on tickets and donations to athletic departments, stop participating in March Madness pools, and convince everyone you know do the same. "Can't believe these college kids are spending their money on something stupid! *15 minutes earlier* "When can I start buying tickets to the conference tournament that I wouldn't be going to if these athletes weren't providing entertainment."

/inb4 "they get paid by their free education!"

The fact is that the athletes, the courts, and the NCAA have turned Division I college athletics fully into professional sports. Period.

But even so, the colleges are still "exploiting" the athletes, by leaning on the slender, reed-like crutch of "cost of attendence." It's a salary by any realistic standard, and a rather meager one at that. COA equally stands for "cover our asses" for the colleges, to dodge all manner of tax and employment laws that they would otherwise be subject to if they admitted that the athletes were primarily athletes and employees, and not "student-athletes." The colleges are merely paying the athletes just a bit more for the privilege of exploiting them than they were before.

Nobody's pretending that the athletes' education has in any way improved here.

You know, education? The putative purpose of the "higher education" institutions in the first place?

ESPN is contemplating the layoff of hundreds of employees. The gravy train may not, in fact, go on forever. The hogs continue to belly up to the trough, but the trough's flow of food swill may not continue to swell as richly as it has in the past. We shall see.

Interesting times.

[SF_Rabbit_Fan]

Re: NDSU to pay "Cost of Attendence"

I wish they would pro-rate the amount of COA depending on whether the student-athlete lives on or off campus. Upperclassmen that live off campus and need to pay rent and buy food should get the full amount,while freshmen and sophomores that live on campus and are on a meal plan should receive a smaller amount. Giving $570/month to freshmen who don't need to pay rent or buy food could be a disaster waiting to happen in many cases.

Why? Students on full scholarship who choose to live off campus already receive a cash grant equivalent to what it costs to live in the dorms. Food wise, I believe they receive the equivalent of the most expensive meal plan.

Accordig to http://www.sdstate.edu/reslife/reshalls/costs/ that is likely about $4000/year towards rent and $4000/year for food.