Best Case Scenario for a seed

[CappinHard]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

So this garbage right here is why we have almost no shot at a seed.

Are you really surprised by this though? Central Arkansas is the only team on here that imo shouldn't be, but either them or SHSU should fall off depending on who wins that game. Other than that, the positions are somewhat puzzling, but the teams listed aren't big surprises in my eyes.

[thumper_76]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

Are you really surprised by this though? Central Arkansas is the only team on here that imo shouldn't be, but either them or SHSU should fall off depending on who wins that game. Other than that, the positions are somewhat puzzling, but the teams listed aren't big surprises in my eyes.

To you and Bits, I am surprised by a couple of things that are particularly troubling for us this year and for what we can look to see in the future for our scheduling purposes. The positions and inclusion of UCA are the biggest red flag that tell me SOS has exactly zero to do with getting ranked. SHSU has a schedule that is only stronger than Pioneer League teams. Let that sink in. Their schedule, as it sits, is almost as weak as playing in a conference THAT DOESN'T OFFER SCHOLARSHIPS. Its not so much that SHSU is in the top two either. Its that niether EWU or NDSU are inside the top two seeds. Also that The Citadel is as far down as they are. Its showing that style points vs weak competition count for more than playing better teams and having close games. Add JMU at number five, and they are sending a message that style points count. That means we need to schedule weak teams and putting up 60 points on them seems to be encouraged. Chattanooga has beaten exactly one good team, played a OOC with a DII school called Shorter and another slack program and lost to a top ten team. They really have done nothing but beat the slack teams on their schedule and one fringe top 25 team. But they put up a lot of points on those slack teams. The way this top ten sits I would be honestly surprised if we were even in the top 15 of the committee. I would bet dollars to doughnuts that not only is UCA ahead of us but so are teams like UND, Lehigh, YSU, and maybe even WIU are above us. I figured they would have most of these top ten teams in there that they do, but the order tells me that SOS matters exactly zero, as do good wins. It shows you will be punished severly for a poor loss but rewarded greatly for victories over lesser competition and a "good loss" will not hurt you barely at all. We would have been better off losing to NDSU and beating ISUr as far as these rankings show me, which is a crime IMHO.

[thumper_76]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

All in if this is what the committee is going to reward, I hope we play as slack of a schedule OOC as we can find to stack up wins. Legitimately the best path to a seed for us is not to win challenging OOC games, but to have and FBS and two Pioneer schools and beat the hell out of them. And try to put up 60+ on them as well.

[goon]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

To you and Bits, I am surprised by a couple of things that are particularly troubling for us this year and for what we can look to see in the future for our scheduling purposes. The positions and inclusion of UCA are the biggest red flag that tell me SOS has exactly zero to do with getting ranked. SHSU has a schedule that is only stronger than Pioneer League teams. Let that sink in. Their schedule, as it sits, is almost as weak as playing in a conference THAT DOESN'T OFFER SCHOLARSHIPS. Its not so much that SHSU is in the top two either. Its that niether EWU or NDSU are inside the top two seeds. Also that The Citadel is as far down as they are. Its showing that style points vs weak competition count for more than playing better teams and having close games. Add JMU at number five, and they are sending a message that style points count. That means we need to schedule weak teams and putting up 60 points on them seems to be encouraged. Chattanooga has beaten exactly one good team, played a OOC with a DII school called Shorter and another slack program and lost to a top ten team. They really have done nothing but beat the slack teams on their schedule and one fringe top 25 team. But they put up a lot of points on those slack teams. The way this top ten sits I would be honestly surprised if we were even in the top 15 of the committee. I would bet dollars to doughnuts that not only is UCA ahead of us but so are teams like UND, Lehigh, YSU, and maybe even WIU are above us. I figured they would have most of these top ten teams in there that they do, but the order tells me that SOS matters exactly zero, as do good wins. It shows you will be punished severly for a poor loss but rewarded greatly for victories over lesser competition and a "good loss" will not hurt you barely at all. We would have been better off losing to NDSU and beating ISUr as far as these rankings show me, which is a crime IMHO.

I know others don't agree with me but that's why I don't want an FCS game every year. Sure some years is fine, but I feel that beating a avg or bad team from the east just to get an easy win at home and beat another conference would be well worth the challenge to get some teams to Brookings. we need to play more conferences so that can show the MVFC is really hard, the committee goes buy what you have on your record, not who is on your schedule. We need wins, we have enough tough games in conference, schedule one big sky as a good prep for conference play, but all other games should be other avg conferences that we can get some easy wins and have a better record. I would prefer not the pioneer unless that's the last option.

[thumper_76]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

I know others don't agree with me but that's why I don't want an FCS game every year. Sure some years is fine, but I feel that beating a avg or bad team from the east just to get an easy win at home and beat another conference would be well worth the challenge to get some teams to Brookings. we need to play more conferences so that can show the MVFC is really hard, the committee goes buy what you have on your record, not who is on your schedule. We need wins, we have enough tough games in conference, schedule one big sky as a good prep for conference play, but all other games should be other avg conferences that we can get some easy wins and have a better record. I would prefer not the pioneer unless that's the last option.

Why would we even risk a chance at a loss OOC? It should be damn near straight Pioneer schools if this is how they choose the seeds. There is zero reason to have anything other than home games unless we are at an FBS team if this is how they reward SOS. And I am dead serious. I don't want a team stronger than Butler on our schedule tbh, cause there is ZERO reward for it. What credit is NDSU gettting for only having one loss vs a schedule with a FBS and 7 ranked FCS teams? NONE. Same for EWU. Screw it. We should never leave the Dana in OOC. There is no benefit to it.

[mitchellrabbit]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

Why would we even risk a chance at a loss OOC? It should be damn near straight Pioneer schools if this is how they choose the seeds. There is zero reason to have anything other than home games unless we are at an FBS team if this is how they reward SOS. And I am dead serious. I don't want a team stronger than Butler on our schedule tbh, cause there is ZERO reward for it. What credit is NDSU gettting for only having one loss vs a schedule with a FBS and 7 ranked FCS teams? NONE. Same for EWU. Screw it. We should never leave the Dana in OOC. There is no benefit to it.

You get no arguement from me.

[goon]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

Why would we even risk a chance at a loss OOC? It should be damn near straight Pioneer schools if this is how they choose the seeds. There is zero reason to have anything other than home games unless we are at an FBS team if this is how they reward SOS. And I am dead serious. I don't want a team stronger than Butler on our schedule tbh, cause there is ZERO reward for it. What credit is NDSU gettting for only having one loss vs a schedule with a FBS and 7 ranked FCS teams? NONE. Same for EWU. Screw it. We should never leave the Dana in OOC. There is no benefit to it.

Because of the mvfc plays several caa teams and we have a wins over them. Then there is that sliver of hope the committee will see how the mvfc is better then the caa and a 8-3 mvfc should be over a 9-2 caa team. It makes sense IMHO.

[jackdaniel]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

Why would we even risk a chance at a loss OOC? It should be damn near straight Pioneer schools if this is how they choose the seeds. There is zero reason to have anything other than home games unless we are at an FBS team if this is how they reward SOS. And I am dead serious. I don't want a team stronger than Butler on our schedule tbh, cause there is ZERO reward for it. What credit is NDSU gettting for only having one loss vs a schedule with a FBS and 7 ranked FCS teams? NONE. Same for EWU. Screw it. We should never leave the Dana in OOC. There is no benefit to it.

Makes sense to me.Risk needs rewarded,otherwise it's just stupid to keep giving them excuses like losses to feed their bias.

[thumper_76]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

Because of the mvfc plays several caa teams and we have a wins over them. Then there is that sliver of hope the committee will see how the mvfc is better then the caa and a 8-3 mvfc should be over a 9-2 caa team. It makes sense IMHO.

So since there is zero evidence that this works out, IE this year. JSU and SHSU haven't played a soul in the OOC that was from a major conference. Not. One. What on Gods green earth proves that we should try to do anything as stupid as challenging ourselves in the OOC. There is zero evidence that it helps with a seed. None. The only team that UCA challenged themselves with was a boarderline top 25 team and a FBS team that is as weak if not weaker than Kansas, and is in the committees top ten. This is a joke. There is no evidence available that a tough schedule is rewarded in the seeding process. None. If we don't have the loss to Poly and beat, say, a slack SWAC team, there is a great chance we are ranked in the top ten. If UNI schedules Drake and Butler instead of Montana and EWU, they are ranked and have a great shot at the playoffs. What is better for the MVFC here? Getting to thump our chests and say we challeneged ourselves or home field advantage in the playoffs?

[CappinHard]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

To you and Bits, I am surprised by a couple of things that are particularly troubling for us this year and for what we can look to see in the future for our scheduling purposes. The positions and inclusion of UCA are the biggest red flag that tell me SOS has exactly zero to do with getting ranked. SHSU has a schedule that is only stronger than Pioneer League teams. Let that sink in. Their schedule, as it sits, is almost as weak as playing in a conference THAT DOESN'T OFFER SCHOLARSHIPS. Its not so much that SHSU is in the top two either. Its that niether EWU or NDSU are inside the top two seeds. Also that The Citadel is as far down as they are. Its showing that style points vs weak competition count for more than playing better teams and having close games. Add JMU at number five, and they are sending a message that style points count. That means we need to schedule weak teams and putting up 60 points on them seems to be encouraged. Chattanooga has beaten exactly one good team, played a OOC with a DII school called Shorter and another slack program and lost to a top ten team. They really have done nothing but beat the slack teams on their schedule and one fringe top 25 team. But they put up a lot of points on those slack teams. The way this top ten sits I would be honestly surprised if we were even in the top 15 of the committee. I would bet dollars to doughnuts that not only is UCA ahead of us but so are teams like UND, Lehigh, YSU, and maybe even WIU are above us. I figured they would have most of these top ten teams in there that they do, but the order tells me that SOS matters exactly zero, as do good wins. It shows you will be punished severly for a poor loss but rewarded greatly for victories over lesser competition and a "good loss" will not hurt you barely at all. We would have been better off losing to NDSU and beating ISUr as far as these rankings show me, which is a crime IMHO.

The more I let it sink in, the more I think you're right about it being garbage. Central Arkansas is the only team that doesn't deserve to be on there, but the problem is they REALLY don't deserve to be on there. There's no way they should be above Cal Poly, UND, SDSU, or YSU. It really is amazing how badly they screwed up their rankings, with EWU and NDSU the clear 1-2 or 2-1. I would love to hear some reasoning behind it all, rather than it being a craptastic mystery that has no rhyme or reason.

[mitchellrabbit]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

So since there is zero evidence that this works out, IE this year. JSU and SHSU haven't played a soul in the OOC that was from a major conference. Not. One. What on Gods green earth proves that we should try to do anything as stupid as challenging ourselves in the OOC. There is zero evidence that it helps with a seed. None. The only team that UCA challenged themselves with was a boarderline top 25 team and a FBS team that is as weak if not weaker than Kansas, and is in the committees top ten. This is a joke. There is no evidence available that a tough schedule is rewarded in the seeding process. None. If we don't have the loss to Poly and beat, say, a slack SWAC team, there is a great chance we are ranked in the top ten. If UNI schedules Drake and Butler instead of Montana and EWU, they are ranked and have a great shot at the playoffs. What is better for the MVFC here? Getting to thump our chests and say we challeneged ourselves or home field advantage in the playoffs?

I agree with not playing good teams for seeding purposes but if we play sh$t teams, what will happen to attendance?

[thumper_76]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

The more I let it sink in, the more I think you're right about it being garbage. Central Arkansas is the only team that doesn't deserve to be on there, but the problem is they REALLY don't deserve to be on there. There's no way they should be above Cal Poly, UND, SDSU, or YSU. It really is amazing how badly they screwed up their rankings, with EWU and NDSU the clear 1-2 or 2-1. I would love to hear some reasoning behind it all, rather than it being a craptastic mystery that has no rhyme or reason.

The problem is you can see exactly their logic. They went almost purely off of record. This is like if CUSA and the Sunbelt each had an undefeated team that were both ranked 1 and 2 AND the Sunbelt had another team in the top ten from a FBS perspective. There would be riots in the streets if that happened. If SOS mattered at all there is no way two teams with P5 FBS wins and one FCS loss would be below a team that has a SOS that is only stronger than the Pioneer conference schedules. It really boils my blood to think that if we had scheduled a second Pioneer school or even a DII we would be seeded right now, which is insane. And the committee really had no choice to put SHSU and JSU as the top ten because their logic for one has to be applied to the other, they can't really select just one and say this is why and then not the other. I'm going to be tuning in to the Bison Insider tomorrow because the chair of the committee will be on at noon, after he told Dom Izzo that SOS would be an important factor. I hope they go scorched earth on him. Interesting to note that the head of the committee is from Murray St, an OVC school.

[thumper_76]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

I agree with not playing good teams for seeding purposes but if we play sh$t teams, what will happen to attendance?

If we get a high seed and homefield in the playoffs we go on a deep run. That will build more attendance than opponents brought in. Look at NDSU or Montana. They still bring in the fans because a culture of success (god I just said the Bison catch phrase, barf) has built a fanbase. Until we get a large enough fan base, the casual fans don't know that bringing in a Jacksonville St would be an epic game, or a home and home with Eastern Washington is amazing because of the lack of name recognition of a lot of schools. What is going to draw in more fans, a real good school that doesn't have any name recognition to a lot of fans whose number one team is Nebraska and Iowa or being known as the state school that went to the semi finals or national championship game? Its certainly debatable for sure, but I personally feel going deep into the playoffs will build the fan base needed to fill the stadium faster than playing a tough OOC every year, dropping one and going on the road every year to a seeded team.

[goon]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

So since there is zero evidence that this works out, IE this year. JSU and SHSU haven't played a soul in the OOC that was from a major conference. Not. One. What on Gods green earth proves that we should try to do anything as stupid as challenging ourselves in the OOC. There is zero evidence that it helps with a seed. None. The only team that UCA challenged themselves with was a boarderline top 25 team and a FBS team that is as weak if not weaker than Kansas, and is in the committees top ten. This is a joke. There is no evidence available that a tough schedule is rewarded in the seeding process. None. If we don't have the loss to Poly and beat, say, a slack SWAC team, there is a great chance we are ranked in the top ten. If UNI schedules Drake and Butler instead of Montana and EWU, they are ranked and have a great shot at the playoffs. What is better for the MVFC here? Getting to thump our chests and say we challeneged ourselves or home field advantage in the playoffs?

I think playing a 6-5 team from the caa and swac etc is playing a cupcake and not challenging the team. Top 25 and a few big Sky teams are not worth it. But bring in Delaware or Wagner or something would probably be an easy win. If that's challenging our selves and we can't win those games we have other issues. If the conference can show it has a winning record against every other conference then the league and commish can really challenge the committee on their selections. Not team sos but conference strength would be easy to point to them.

[FargoBison]

Re: Best Case Scenario for a seed

The problem is you can see exactly their logic. They went almost purely off of record. This is like if CUSA and the Sunbelt each had an undefeated team that were both ranked 1 and 2 AND the Sunbelt had another team in the top ten from a FBS perspective. There would be riots in the streets if that happened. If SOS mattered at all there is no way two teams with P5 FBS wins and one FCS loss would be below a team that has a SOS that is only stronger than the Pioneer conference schedules. It really boils my blood to think that if we had scheduled a second Pioneer school or even a DII we would be seeded right now, which is insane. And the committee really had no choice to put SHSU and JSU as the top ten because their logic for one has to be applied to the other, they can't really select just one and say this is why and then not the other. I'm going to be tuning in to the Bison Insider tomorrow because the chair of the committee will be on at noon, after he told Dom Izzo that SOS would be an important factor. I hope they go scorched earth on him. Interesting to note that the head of the committee is from Murray St, an OVC school.

The committee chair is actually from a Pioneer League school, Morehead is in the OVC but plays football in the Pioneer. So the head of the committee is the AD of a school that basically plays in a league on par with a DIII league. I'm sure he really knows how to evaluate SOS...what a joke.

Clearly NDSU would have been better off losing to Iowa and beating you guys. Amazing how little beating a 5-3 Big 10 team that I don't think has ever lost to an FCS team is worth.

Then you have EWU that beat a team that is ranked in the top 25 by the FBS committee. They would have been better off losing that game and beating NDSU.