NCAA Financial Data

[Mr_Tibbs]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

Further explanation, USD has 6100 degree seeking (probably at normal credit load) undergraduates as of fall 2017. Sdsu has 9700 degree seeking undergraduates as of fall 2017. 3600 more full time students paying fees will have a large impact on our total number.

Dividing it out, each degree seeking undergrad at USD student is paying 262 dollars in fees to athletics over a given year. Each degree seeking undergrad at SDSU is paying 247 dollars in athletic fees per year. This calculation doesn't include graduate students, who normally are taking 3-9 credits per semester and contribute far less to the budget than undergrads who are taking twice the class load. This also doesn't include non-degree seeking students, but it does include online/off campus/part time degree seeking students, of which neither SDSU or USD have a large population.

[Mr_Tibbs]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

The student fees discrepancy is a product of SDSU enrolling approximately 10,500 Full time equivalent students, while USD enrolls about 6,700 FTE students. Not only about are there about 2000 more total students at SDSU, a larger share of our students are full time equivalent, meaning that they are taking at least 15 credits in a semester, therefore paying more in fees.

After looking at both schools website, USD general activity fee is 53.75 per credit. At SDSU, it's 43.75 per credit. I can't see exactly how each fee is broken down into what is going to athletics vs other services on campus, but Usd students are paying more per credit hour in fees than SDSU students, and I'd be surprised if the rate going to athletics isn't higher as well.

The Argus fee article misrepresents the per capita impact on each student. We have the larger university, and it would make sense that our fee total is higher.

[CondeJack]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

The question that needs to be asked about the USD numbers is the fact that 62% of their income comes from "allocated sources". Allocated sources include student fees (which were $1.6 million for USD and $2.4 for us), but the rest of the "62%' is from institutional funds or state funds. USD had $11+ million in allocated funds (but only 1.6 million from student fees, while SDSU had $8+ million in allocated funds (which included our higher $2.4 million student fees). So does that mean USD's administration is using state funds to subsidize the athletic program? I don't know, but I would sure like to see where those funds come from for the Yotes.

Post #18 of this thread says that the Argus should do an article on why the USD students should have to bear the burden of the athletics budget, but now that it is apparent that our students pay a greater share than USD, now the Argus should look into “allocated sources” spending at USD? LOL. What happened to the article about the students having to pay so much? What changed?? Why should SDSU students have such high fees?

[Jacks#1Fan]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

The question that needs to be asked about the USD numbers is the fact that 62% of their income comes from "allocated sources". Allocated sources include student fees (which were $1.6 million for USD and $2.4 for us), but the rest of the "62%' is from institutional funds or state funds. USD had $11+ million in allocated funds (but only 1.6 million from student fees, while SDSU had $8+ million in allocated funds (which included our higher $2.4 million student fees). So does that mean USD's administration is using state funds to subsidize the athletic program? I don't know, but I would sure like to see where those funds come from for the Yotes.

[Nidaros]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

It's an article but more like a regurgitation of the numbers in the USA Today article.

This what I thought too, after reading the great Zimmer, who is on a hard earned vacation by the way.

[BTownJack]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

Zim wrote about it (not sure if I got the correct weblink).

*I can't get the link to work for me today.


Try the Facebook posting.
https://www.facebook.com/argusleader...26304897430662

It's an article but more like a regurgitation of the numbers in the USA Today article.

[thumper_76]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

This is a good breakdown by NovaBison on AGS. Interesting to see.

]If you subtract the allocated portions of the revenue (student fees and school funding), since the remaining funds are what the athletic department generates itself, you get a different look... here is that Top 10:

1 Montana $19,739,927
2 NDSU $19,387,274
3 UND $15,093,410
4 SDSU $14,063,297
5 W&M $12,743,126
6 Montana State $11,734,187
7 Idaho $10,485,963
8 UNI $10,212,620
9 Missouri St $9,853,013
10 New Hampshire $9,821,259

I also compared these non allocated revenues to the rest of the G5, and Montana and NDSU have larger "non allocated" revenues than all the teams in the MAC, CUSA, and everyone in the Sun Belt (except Arkansas State who generated $26.8M. Largest non allocated revenue team in the MAC was Western Michigan at $13.6M, and the largest non allocated revenue team in CUSA was Southern Miss at $15.2M. Also, the #2 non allocated Sun Belt team was UL Lafayette at $15.5M. For the most part the MWC and AAC teams have larger non allocated revenues except for a few outliers.

So the argument for moving to the FBS to get additional revenue appears to not holdup too well if we are talking about CUSA, MAC or Sunbelt.



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[propar80]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

Zim wrote about it (not sure if I got the correct weblink).

*I can't get the link to work for me today.


Try the Facebook posting.
https://www.facebook.com/argusleader...26304897430662

Good reporting Zim...I stand corrected!

Hoping for an editorial piece from Stu with some reporting/Opinions and maybe some quotes from Herbster or the new UsD President on why their students are footing so much of the bill for athletics compared to their local peers.

Taxpayers would like to know.

[UWMandSDSU]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

And guaranteed not 1 story about the discrepancy will be in any of the state’s largest news outlets.

Zim wrote about it (not sure if I got the correct weblink).

*I can't get the link to work for me today.


Try the Facebook posting.
https://www.facebook.com/argusleader...26304897430662

[el_presidente]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

One thing I noticed was the student fee numbers didn't look right at USD. After doing some research though this report is only through 2017 and the 2018 report will be quite different when the USA Today data comes out next year. USD was originally going to increase their General Activity Fee (GAF) $13.50 a credit hour in three steps of $4.50 a year starting back in 2015. (http://volanteonline.com/2015/09/ath...-gaf-increase/).

However, with the couple years of tuition freezes funded by the legislature, I think they only did phase one in 2015 which would account for the $.5 million jump from $1.4 to $1.9 million. The rest of it came this last fiscal year FY18 and the linked USA today report is always one year behind when they get the data collected and reported

If you look at the athletic projections given to the Board of Regents in June of 2017 (1 year ago) but projecting through FY2019 and go to page 3 you will see that USD's student fees to athletics was projected to go up 82% this year. Those numbers won't be reflected until next years USA today report. https://www.sdbor.edu/the-board/agen..._H_BOR0617.pdf Page 3, General activity fee row, 82.3% between FY17 and FY18.

The other part I like about the BOR report above is that it shows projected expenses by sport. Between that Board of Regents report and the USA today report there is a lot of data that could be broken into segments and posts

[91jack]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

These issues are no different than the ones we had to address when we made the move. As far as travel partners go, Augie would work well. UND-NDSU, SDSU-Augie and UNO-USD are all short drives. UNO-USD is about 130 miles. Fort Wayne-WIL is about 6 hrs. Denver-Tulsa is an easy flight but a 10 hr road trip. In addition to adding Augie, adding UNC as a partner for Denver and UMKC for ORU (240 miles) would be the best for travel partners.

I am not necessarily pro adding Augie, but the arguments against adding them remind me a great deal of USD arguments against us in 2003. They are more self protective than real. In fact the transition might be easier for Augie as they would have a built in set of rivals unlike us who only had NDSU.

I think I was spinning what JACKGUYII said by saying that I think their "revenue from attendance and concessions" will change drastically if they go DI. Will they quadruple their ticket prices to get up to par with SDSU's? Will they raise their concession prices? Will getting back with UND, NDSU, SDSU, USD and UNO bring in about as many fans as what they have now? If they raise their prices, they could make a lot more from those things but it could run off some fans, too. That is a lot of if's and the only way to know that answer is if they make the move.
I can care less if Augie joins the Summit. I would like the added security of having another team and there is the added bonus they they are right down the road. I do know that Augie will need to make a lot more money and don't know where that will come from. They may have a lot of donors there to help them out. The only way I don't like the move is if some of SDSU's donors cut back or quit supporting SDSU to support Augie. It is their money and they can do what they want but that might not be good for all involved.

[Rabbit74]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

I think that Augie's numbers might be interesting to see but I don't know how much they will translate to what they would look like if Augie went DI. I know that SDSU, NDSU, Omaha, UND and USD are all in the conference so there might be some sellouts but there are a ton of differences.
1) I was at a Augie football game two years ago and their tickets cost $8. SDSU's cost $30.
2) Augie plays doubleheaders on back to back nights (I think) and their tickets cost less than a single SDSU game. Especially, if it is a "premium" game.
3) How many Denver, ORU or other teams fans will travel to Augie to watch a game compared to fans from UMD, SCSU, etc... I guess Sioux Falls is an easy flight but it's not much more difficult to drive 50m minutes to get to Brookings. I guess I don't know how far most of the NSIC teams are and I know there are some that are more that a five hour drive but I don't know how many.
4) I think they might get some more casual fans to show up for a Augie/SDSU game but how many other fans will not go to as many games if they raise ticket prices?
I think the Summit League should add a 10th team and go to a travel partner schedule. I know getting from Denver to ORU or from Western Illinois to IPFW might not be a three hour drive but it probably isn't terrible. The question is would they ever go to back to back nights or leave the off day in between.

These issues are no different than the ones we had to address when we made the move. As far as travel partners go, Augie would work well. UND-NDSU, SDSU-Augie and UNO-USD are all short drives. UNO-USD is about 130 miles. Fort Wayne-WIL is about 6 hrs. Denver-Tulsa is an easy flight but a 10 hr road trip. In addition to adding Augie, adding UNC as a partner for Denver and UMKC for ORU (240 miles) would be the best for travel partners.

I am not necessarily pro adding Augie, but the arguments against adding them remind me a great deal of USD arguments against us in 2003. They are more self protective than real. In fact the transition might be easier for Augie as they would have a built in set of rivals unlike us who only had NDSU.

[91jack]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

What does Augie bring in terms of revenue from attendance and concessions?

I think that Augie's numbers might be interesting to see but I don't know how much they will translate to what they would look like if Augie went DI. I know that SDSU, NDSU, Omaha, UND and USD are all in the conference so there might be some sellouts but there are a ton of differences.
1) I was at a Augie football game two years ago and their tickets cost $8. SDSU's cost $30.
2) Augie plays doubleheaders on back to back nights (I think) and their tickets cost less than a single SDSU game. Especially, if it is a "premium" game.
3) How many Denver, ORU or other teams fans will travel to Augie to watch a game compared to fans from UMD, SCSU, etc... I guess Sioux Falls is an easy flight but it's not much more difficult to drive 50m minutes to get to Brookings. I guess I don't know how far most of the NSIC teams are and I know there are some that are more that a five hour drive but I don't know how many.
4) I think they might get some more casual fans to show up for a Augie/SDSU game but how many other fans will not go to as many games if they raise ticket prices?
I think the Summit League should add a 10th team and go to a travel partner schedule. I know getting from Denver to ORU or from Western Illinois to IPFW might not be a three hour drive but it probably isn't terrible. The question is would they ever go to back to back nights or leave the off day in between.

[BTownJack]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

And guaranteed not 1 story about the discrepancy will be in any of the state’s largest news outlets.

Agreed - this is the type of story that needs to be written and dig down into why their is such a discrepancy.

[SUPERBUNNY]

Re: NCAA Financial Data

Certainly these numbers are trumped up to paint SDSU in a good light. I remember for years that USD would always outdraw SDSU at home for rivalry games. Certainly they have similar revenue! (insert the heaviest of sarcasm here)

SUPERBUNNY