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View Full Version : What did SDSU ever do to the Argus??



sodakfan
02-05-2004, 12:20 PM
Man-those guys have NO love for us!!!

Texas_Jacks_Fan
02-05-2004, 12:23 PM
Screw the Argus
Screw KELO TV.
We're movin' on. we don't need them !

89rabbit
02-05-2004, 12:41 PM
The Argus parent company belongs to Al Nauharth (USA Today fame) who is a USD Alum.

Alumguy
02-05-2004, 01:03 PM
I believe there are several factors at play. Try these:

1) Sioux Falls, in general, has a superiority complex. No person or entity outside their city limits has a right to outdo them on anything. They are smarter than anyone else _ just ask them.
2) After years and years of being bashed as that "Cow College" filled with heathens, it is difficult for anybody from "The City" to believe that anything special can be associated with a college with its roots steeped in agriculture.
3) The administration of the Argus Leader is filled with people who grew up outside South Dakota's borders. They come from places like Kansas or Iowa. There is no way that a school in South Dakota can measure up to where they came from.
4) The sports writers are of the same ilk.
5) There is an ugly belief, shared by many South Dakotans, that it is unacceptable to try and outdo your neighbors. How dare you try to be different? Who do you think you are?
6) The Argus is in a quandry. They spoke out against the move when SDSU was considering Division I. They now have a vested interest in us failing. When we succeed, they will have failed. This bothers them as they don't want to look stupid.

Just some thoughts on a snowy afternoon.

SDSUFAN
02-05-2004, 03:06 PM
I would agree with all that Alumguy has presented here and maybe eleborate on the observation made by 89rabbit.

Al Neuharth, USD and the founder of Gannett Newspapers USA today is a a extremely wealthy man. How he would have stacked up with Ralph Englestad in personal wealth is hard to say, but I would think he would have net worth some where equal to the estate of Ralph Englestad. Lets just say there are two guys from the Dakotas who have become extremely wealthy.
Opps Ralph technically is from Minnesota. Oh well he is connected to UND.

I am old enough to remember Al Neuharth failed venture called SoDak Sports. It was kind of a neat paper printed weekly on salmon colored paper, available in drugs stores who were big on comic books and magazines in the 1950's. I remember purchasing Sodak Sports at Ray's Drugstore in Brookings and reading it as I enjoyed a cherry coke at their now defunct soda fountain. It was a great little paper for a kid in the 6th grade who had no TV and lived on a farm, but got to Brookings on Saturday Afternoons. You read news that wasnt in the newspapers. Journlistically, Al and staff did a great job covering South Dakota high school and college basketball primarily.

The Late Tom Maxwell's radio program now being continued by his spouse and heard weekly across South Dakota reminds me of SoDak sports with the indept interviews and stories.

Al was a young guy at the time and really failed in getting sufficent advertizing. The paper went broke. I think he learned a great deal from this experience and went to work outstate and over time buildt the Gannett empire.

My whole point in mentioning this is that Al Neuharth is not all news and at minimum has a passive interest at athletics in South Dakota even after all these years.

Though he has never publicly commented on SDSU's move to D1, I am sure he has an opinion and that opinion is the one that is reflected in one of his Assets- the Sioux Falls Argus Leader. The staff at the Argus are hardly going to piss off the boss. That would not be a good idea.

Al Neuharth has promoted journalism and communications at USD, but not a cent towards the athletic department. I am kind of waiting for another shoe to drop.

filbert
02-05-2004, 08:57 PM
Nothing going on here that winning the Fresno State basketball tournament in November won't cure.

"If you don't think you can win, don't get on the bus."

If I was still in SD, I'd be looking forward to watching those games on TV.

On KSFY.

Go Rabbits!

filbert
02-07-2004, 08:53 AM
Another thought:

Not generally known is that in the days before statehood, Sioux Falls was given the choice by the territorial legislature: they could either host the state agricultural school, or the state penitentary.

Of course in the 1880's no one knew how important a strong research-oriented university was for economic development.

Sioux Falls and South Dakota are still trying to recover from that unfortunate decision (can you say USDSU? Of course not, neither can I ;-).

Bison_Kent
02-07-2004, 10:30 AM
fibert,

That sounds similar to N. Dakota as well. Bismarck and Fargo were looking at getting the state pen and ag college. Bismarck won the fight for the state pen and Fargo won the ag college.

NDSU_grad
02-07-2004, 07:01 PM
The same thing happened in Iowa. The story goes that representatives from Ames went to the state legislature to try to petition to get the state insane asylum. They failed, but were awarded the land grand institution. The story goes that the people of Ames were very upset.

Texas_Jacks_Fan
02-08-2004, 08:10 AM
South Dakota chose Vermillion as the site for our states insane asylum. ;D :o

Buster
02-08-2004, 12:02 PM
South Dakota chose Vermillion as the site for our states insane asylum. ;D :o


Well, Yankton got it. I recall the rather curious signs near the building "DO NOT PICK UP HITCHIKERS". Yankton is a rather close drive from Vermillion.

Buster
02-08-2004, 12:12 PM
Another thought:

Not generally known is that in the days before statehood, Sioux Falls was given the choice by the territorial legislature: they could either host the state agricultural school, or the state penitentary.

Of course in the 1880's no one knew how important a strong research-oriented university was for economic development.

Sioux Falls and South Dakota are still trying to recover from that unfortunate decision (can you say USDSU? Of course not, neither can I ;-).


The thing is, I have a class down at USDSU once a week. I can see why the people in Brookings hate it so much -- the building is modern, well-designed architecturally, in a good location, and clean.

There's a rather nice, but small, common area, and tons of ethernet ports and 802.11a/b/g network all throughout the building.

The reason people in Brookings so detest USDSU, it seems, is because they've done it better. The classrooms are not full of crappy broken desks, shoddy equipment, and designed from converted offices and dorms. I recall classes I had on Scobey hall -- what a joke. They're the kind of rooms better suited to brutal interrogations than education.

That's not to say that all classrooms are in ill-repair. It just seems that I always get stuck in the rooms with creaky pipes, and oddly-placed pillars. The biostress building isn't too bad at all, and neither is the new printing and journalism building.

filbert
02-08-2004, 12:29 PM
Actually, USDSU isn't really the problem. As my previous post noted, the real problem began when Sioux Falls short-sightedly picked the Pen over the Ag College. Since that didn't happen, SD now has to spend resources to not only support six universities and four junior colleges (oops, Technical Institutes) but also has now realized that it has to have a 4-year + presence in the state's largest city and one of the fastest growing cities in the U.S.

That USDSU is state of the art is a credit to the state and a reminder that SD *can* do good things. That the rest of the campuses are all crumbling is an indication that the state isn't able to properly support them all.

Sometimes I think SD would be better off to just close the Vermillion, Madison, and Brookings campuses and move all three universities to a single institution in Sioux Falls. (As long as their colors stay yellow-and-blue and their nickname remains the Jackrabbits, that is. I'd compromise by moving DSU to Sioux Falls and moving USD to Brookings as a bigger, better SDSU...that'd be OK, I guess. <grin>)

89rabbit
02-08-2004, 12:54 PM
The thing is, I have a class down at USDSU once a week. I can see why the people in Brookings hate it so much -- the building is modern, well-designed architecturally, in a good location, and clean.

There's a rather nice, but small, common area, and tons of ethernet ports and 802.11a/b/g network all throughout the building.

The reason people in Brookings so detest USDSU, it seems, is because they've done it better. The classrooms are not full of crappy broken desks, shoddy equipment, and designed from converted offices and dorms. I recall classes I had on Scobey hall -- what a joke. They're the kind of rooms better suited to brutal interrogations than education.

That's not to say that all classrooms are in ill-repair. It just seems that I always get stuck in the rooms with creaky pipes, and oddly-placed pillars. The biostress building isn't too bad at all, and neither is the new printing and journalism building.

Buster,

USDSU is fine for what it is, a one building place for non-traditional students (for the most part) to take a class or two. Many metros have them. KU has what they call their Edwards Campus here in suburban KC. I think some people in Brookings dislike it because they see it as a waste of taxpayer money. As for me I think it is a good idea. That non-trad working student is not going to drive to Brookings to take his class he is just going to go to another school. I'll take his money.

As far as the building goes, that is a little unfair. SDSU is a degree granting 4 year University with tons of buildings all over it's beautiful campus. SDSU celebrated it's 100th anniversary before anyone even thought up USDSU. USDSU is a one building extension campus, next to a Vo-tech, that is what 10 years old if that.

Sure State has some old buildings on the campus, some are over 100 years old but that is part of what makes a college campus a college campus. A more fair comparison would be to find a building on the main campus that is roughly the same age so you are compairing apples to apples.

Don't get me wrong, I understand your concern (I had a class in the basement of the Barn) and at the time I preferred classes in the Rotunda or the Hen House. They were fairly new at the time had nice amenities and were close to the Student Union. I guess what I am saying is be glad you are taking classes at USDSU now while it is new. 30 years from now some guy will be saying what a dump it is. ;)



P.S. for those who might be lerking and not familiar with SDSU the "Barn" is the nickname for the old Basketball Arena that Frost Arena replaced. The "HEN House" was the nickname for the Home Economics and Nursing building.

Alumguy
02-08-2004, 03:10 PM
Let's put this thing into perspective. The state of South Dakota built that building in Sioux Falls with tuition money (20% of every tuition dollar goes into the Higher Education Facilities Fund) raised by students attending all the public higher education institutions in South Dakota. The state of South Dakota used no money of its own. Hell, the state of South Dakota hasn't appropriated any general funds for campus buildings since the '60s. Pretty good system, huh?

The pathetic thing is that the Board of Regents has been forced to tap into the HEFF money for maintenance and repair of these buildings. In other words, the students have to build the buildings and keep them maintained. Just recently, SDSU declared the President's home to be a classroom so that some of the HEFF money could be used to repair that house.

Now, isn't that something!

Buster
02-09-2004, 08:29 AM
The pathetic thing is that the Board of Regents has been forced to tap into the HEFF money for maintenance and repair of these buildings. In other words, the students have to build the buildings and keep them maintained. Just recently, SDSU declared the President's home to be a classroom so that some of the HEFF money could be used to repair that house.

Now, isn't that something!



So is the amount of secrecy and intrigue that went into the initial repair back when PGM was hired. That did not impress me. Nobody would reveal the true nature of the work, but mostly the cost involved and from where that money came. Nobody would say. Totally stonewalled.

I just don't get it.

Guest
02-09-2004, 10:39 AM
Welcome to politics, boys.

Love your site, South Dakota State fans.

I was born and raised in the great State of Wyoming (in Casper) so I know about South Dakota. Been to the Black Hills several times back in the 1980s. Wished I could back now. I miss Mt. Rushmore.

Wyoming played SDSU back in the early 1980s, 1983 I think, in football and won (of course).

From what I've read, Wyomingites should be gald we have only ONE university.

I actually had a teacher in elementary school that attended SDSU on a football scholarship (Jim Stark).

Welcome to Division I and the Big Time.

Texas_Jacks_Fan
02-09-2004, 01:10 PM
Welcome Poke... dont be a stranger. I was in college when we played the Cowboys. Am I mistaken or was that the game that a record was set by yards gained by two opposing running backs. I think Weeger (SDSU) went for over 200 and a Wyoming back went 250+does anyone else remember this or am I crazy??Wyoming won 40something to 20 something. anyway I hope in the near future we can get it on in basketball AND football with Wyoming in a few years.
GO SDSU !!!

Texas_Jacks_Fan
02-09-2004, 01:26 PM
I should start a new thread for this but we've been kicking around some of the South Dakota Govt. university systems shortcomings. Here is one guys opinion. There will probably be a lot of disagreement with this but here goes.
SDSU-Brookings-Leave alone; for obvious reasons, the largest and most diverse school in the state.
USD-Vermillion-Leave alone; Med school, Law school.
Black Hills St.-We need a four year school based in western side of the state.
Northern State-Leave alone; Good regional school can remain as is.
SD Tech- Close it-roll it into SDSU or USD? either school could absorb these programs.
Dak. St. -Close for sure, combine it with SDSU, maybe make it a satellite school like USDSU
That would leave South Dakota with 4 public Universities Let the argueing begin..... Nothing like over simplification.

Guest
02-09-2004, 01:35 PM
I should start a new thread for this but we've been kicking around some of the South Dakota Govt. university systems shortcomings. Here is one guys opinion. There will probably be a lot of disagreement with this but here goes.
SDSU-Brookings-Leave alone; for obvious reasons, the largest and most diverse school in the state.
USD-Vermillion-Leave alone; Med school, Law school.
Black Hills St.-We need a four year school based in western side of the state.
Northern State-Leave alone; Good regional school can remain as is.
SD Tech- Close it-roll it into SDSU or USD? either school could absorb these programs.
Dak. St. -Close for sure, combine it with SDSU, maybe make it a satellite school like USDSU
That would leave South Dakota with 4 public Universities Let the argueing begin..... Nothing like over simplification.

Thanks for the welcome, Texas_Jacks_Fan.

Rule #1 about state & federal government: if it make sense and saves money, the government won't do it.

Now that SDSU is Div. I-AA I would love to see Laramie, Wyoming host thousands of Jackrabbit fans from SD forr future football & basketball games.

Our football team is getting better (Thankfully, after only winning 5 games in 3 YEARS from 2000-2002).

As for the basketball team, does the word "rebuild" mean anything?

Alumguy
02-09-2004, 02:04 PM
In 1984, SDSU played Wyoming with the final score being Cowboys 45 and the Jackrabbits 29. Rick Wegher, State's running back, ran for 231 yards that day. Wyoming's running back, Kevin Lowe, ran for 301 yards. At the time, it was an NCAA record for the most yards gained by two opposing running backs. I'm wondering what the respective defensive coordinators thought about after that game.

Texas_Jacks_Fan
02-09-2004, 02:07 PM
Alumguy,
What did you think of my SD university system, I know your knowledgeable about "inside" alumni/funding and was curious on your opinion.
Glad to know I wasnt way off on that rushing record game against Wyoming.

JACKGUY
02-09-2004, 02:23 PM
I agree with the college closing scenario however I think it will be a tall task to close DSU. They have become a regional computer training mecca and I think the town of Madison would fight it vehemently. I also think we have way too many private schools even they don't cost the state any dollars or do they? DWU, Sa Tanka, etc.

Alumguy
02-09-2004, 03:15 PM
Texas_Jacks_Fan,

Obviously this state has far too many schools. But, I want to take you back to the early '80s when then Governor Bill Janklow succeeded in closing down USD at Springfield. It was a real blood letting. People in Springfield absolutely hate Bill Janklow. And, let's face it, it would seem that would be a very easy decision to make. But, here it is 20 years later and people are still fuming about it. Even though you have offered some real possibilities on closing institutions, it probably won't happen in our lifetime. The end result is that higher education in South Dakota will just limp along.

I think it was Jackguy who addressed the private school issue. Yeah, there are way too many of them also. It's true they receive no state funding. However, they each receive an enormous amount of federal assistance by virtue of the financial aids programs offered at those schools. So, in essence, taxpayer dollars are keeping them afloat, too.

Once again, the difference maker is our alumni. No other school in South Dakota has as many alumni (and friends) who have given significant dollars back to their alma mater. The reason why SDSU is moving ahead is that a lot of people care. You can see ... and feel ... the difference. It's a great day to be a Jackrabbit!

bballfan
02-09-2004, 05:25 PM
I think that we should close down Northern. Its academics aren't really up to par, and all of its majors are doubled at the other state schools.

JBB
02-09-2004, 05:57 PM
As far as I know Rays still has a soda fountain, I go there every two years and get fountain drinks all the time. :D Thats the place with the NCC helmets hanging from the ceiling isnt it?

filbert
02-09-2004, 05:59 PM
No...not any more, anyway.

JBB
02-09-2004, 06:03 PM
The helmets are gone! Did they leave NDSU?

Texas_Jacks_Fan
02-09-2004, 06:32 PM
I don't remember helmets in Ray's. although my memory is usually blurry when in Ray's. :P Cubbys has helmets from around the NCC including the Bison.

filbert
02-09-2004, 06:34 PM
Oops, was thinking Nick's, not Ray's. Now that I think of it, I think the helmets were in fact in Ray's Corner. Anybody care to confirm/deny?

Alumguy
02-10-2004, 03:37 AM
filbert, it's okay. After awhile, a lot of people claim to see stuff at Ray's.

ralph
02-10-2004, 08:35 PM
I have to add in this thread that only one newspaper in South Dakota has ever called me about I-AA and that was the Argus. Obviously I'm an advocate of the subclassification so that must have been what they wanted and that's what they printed. Fair enough.